$hark$ 2023 and beyond

[handyman]

To be fair, I never got the impression that Am would remain Springboks first choice. He was only it for world cup because of Kriel's injury right? Even though he would probably be in the squad.

Always thought it was useful having Muller as Captain whilst Smit was away.

In my mind, Am has leapfrogged Kriel, it was not an injury that forced the move. We still need a world class 13 tho, De Allende is solid at 12.

Am is not world class?

To me, he is the best in South Africa by a long way, but is he as good as Jaque Fourie? Not by a long shot.

[Chilli]

In my mind, Am has leapfrogged Kriel, it was not an injury that forced the move. We still need a world class 13 tho, De Allende is solid at 12.

Am is not world class?

To me, he is the best in South Africa by a long way, but is he as good as Jaque Fourie? Not by a long shot.

JF is possibly the GOAT of 13's.
Am is a world class 13.

[handyman]

Am is not world class?

To me, he is the best in South Africa by a long way, but is he as good as Jaque Fourie? Not by a long shot.

JF is possibly the GOAT of 13's.
Am is a world class 13.

Let's just agree to disagree on this here point.

[Big Nipper]

To me, he is the best in South Africa by a long way, but is he as good as Jaque Fourie? Not by a long shot.

JF is possibly the GOAT of 13's.
Am is a world class 13.

Let's just agree to disagree on this here point.

Lets just agree you have no fucking clue what you are talking about

[handyman]

JF is possibly the GOAT of 13's.
Am is a world class 13.

Let's just agree to disagree on this here point.

Lets just agree you have no fucking clue what you are talking about

What a nasty piece of work you are. You'll never be a premier poster.

[Sards]

JF is possibly the GOAT of 13's.
Am is a world class 13.

Let's just agree to disagree on this here point.

Lets just agree you have no fucking clue what you are talking about

Dude...you must be the angriest vokker ever on PR, NPR

[Sards]

Let's just agree to disagree on this here point.

Lets just agree you have no fucking clue what you are talking about

What a nasty piece of work you are. You'll never be a premier poster.

Laughable

[Big Nipper]

Lets just agree you have no fucking clue what you are talking about

What a nasty piece of work you are. You'll never be a premier poster.

Laughable

Get a room you two

[Sards]

What a nasty piece of work you are. You'll never be a premier poster.

Laughable

Get a room you two

There are 2 things on PR or NPR that are generally accepted....

1. Sards is a po#s....
2. BN is a miserable vokker.....

[Chilli]

To me, he is the best in South Africa by a long way, but is he as good as Jaque Fourie? Not by a long shot.

JF is possibly the GOAT of 13's.
Am is a world class 13.

Let's just agree to disagree on this here point.

You don't rate JF or you don't rate AM?

[Chilli]

https://www.news24.com/sport/rugby/afte ... e-20210218

[handyman]

JF is possibly the GOAT of 13's.
Am is a world class 13.

Let's just agree to disagree on this here point.

You don't rate JF or you don't rate AM?

I rate Jaque Fourie as one of the best ever, one of my all time favorite players. I feel Am is the best 13 in SA by a long way, but I don't think he is world class (which imo means he is the 13 in the world). He certainly has the potential to get there.

[TheNatalShark]

In my mind, Am has leapfrogged Kriel, it was not an injury that forced the move. We still need a world class 13 tho, De Allende is solid at 12.

Am is not world class?

To me, he is the best in South Africa by a long way, but is he as good as Jaque Fourie? Not by a long shot.

To dial it back down a little...

Looking back at the line-ups yes Am started ahead of Kriel after the Aus RC game. Not sure why I thought Kriel was still first choice (not that I thought or think Kriel was better) heading into the RWC.

I don't think Am is world class. Don't know what Kriel is getting up to in Japan to compare them currently re SA, but a few NZ players I would probably have ahead of Am.

Hopefully rugby resumes this year and we can proper shit fights rather than shit fights over speculative shit fights

[handyman]

Am is not world class?

To me, he is the best in South Africa by a long way, but is he as good as Jaque Fourie? Not by a long shot.

To dial it back down a little...

Looking back at the line-ups yes Am started ahead of Kriel after the Aus RC game. Not sure why I thought Kriel was still first choice (not that I thought or think Kriel was better) heading into the RWC.

I don't think Am is world class. Don't know what Kriel is getting up to in Japan to compare them currently re SA, but a few NZ players I would probably have ahead of Am.

Hopefully rugby resumes this year and we can proper shit fights rather than shit fights over speculative shit fights

Come on lad, this is no shitfight, it's a debate, it's what this forum is for.

Btw, I agree with you.

[OomStruisbaai]

I'll take Amm anyday above JF. Mossie wasnt a legend . He was good but not a legend like Amm.

[OomStruisbaai]

and Kriel was nowhere.

[handyman]

I'll take Amm anyday above JF. Mossie wasnt a legend . He was good but not a legend like Amm.

Philip Amm played cricket for Easter Province. Not too sure of his rugby prowess.

[TheNatalShark]

Come on lad, this is no shitfight, it's a debate, it's what this forum is for.

Btw, I agree with you.

Combo of mildly facetious and directed at BN. Don't have any issue with actual points forward.

I think one thing that inhibits me from thinking Am is world class is the seemingly erratic defensive tactic we sometimes get from the Boks and Sharks that sees a dog leg and the 14 (particularly Nkosi) rush up out of line. I believe Kriel is a bit quicker, particularly in acceleration, where this makes more sense if it fails for the Boks (heavens knows it fails enough) to have 13 able to double back to assist in shutting down a wide break. Something we see a lot more from other 13s around the world able to do in that specific scenario. Otherwise Am seems pretty good in scramble D and disruption, but this tactic doesn't seem suited to Am's speed and he seems sometimes caught unaware of when the 14 does this and goes in too heavily to pressure the 12/13.

Obviously the above is also baked in because SA wings are generally fast enough to double back themselves, but Am just doesn't seem to have this acceleration burst like some 13s do. Perhaps other 13s would reflect poorly if exposed to it as often as Am has been.

[handyman]

Come on lad, this is no shitfight, it's a debate, it's what this forum is for.

Btw, I agree with you.

Combo of mildly facetious and directed at BN. Don't have any issue with actual points forward.

I think one thing that inhibits me from thinking Am is world class is the seemingly erratic defensive tactic we sometimes get from the Boks and Sharks that sees a dog leg and the 14 (particularly Nkosi) rush up out of line. I believe Kriel is a bit quicker, particularly in acceleration, where this makes more sense if it fails for the Boks (heavens knows it fails enough) to have 13 able to double back to assist in shutting down a wide break. Something we see a lot more from other 13s around the world able to do in that specific scenario. Otherwise Am seems pretty good in scramble D and disruption, but this tactic doesn't seem suited to Am's speed and he seems sometimes caught unaware of when the 14 does this and goes in too heavily to pressure the 12/13.

Obviously the above is also baked in because SA wings are generally fast enough to double back themselves, but Am just doesn't seem to have this acceleration burst like some 13s do. Perhaps other 13s would reflect poorly if exposed to it as often as Am has been.

My issue with Kriel is not his physical attributes, but the lack of a big muscle between his ears.

[Chilli]

Jessie Kriel is decidedly average. He has beach muscles and no fukken brain.

[TheNatalShark]

My issue with Kriel is not his physical attributes, but the lack of a big muscle between his ears.

Indeed, he might have been provincial captain ahead of Bok captain had he opted to remain in KZN.

I wonder what other will happen with regards to players playing in Japan going forward. Such a fluid situation, hopefully we get Mapimpi back for some rugby this year just for some final games, though we now have surplus of quality wings.

[Sards]

Kolisi also reflected on the past year, and admitted there were numerous factors that prevented him from finding any rhythm or momentum in his play.

‘For me, I believe I’m a player who needs to play five games in a row, especially at the beginning of the season. I didn’t get that last year; for example, the first game back after the World Cup I was injured, and I’d had no real pre-season. After that, the season was stopped.

‘Then just after that I injured my hamstring in the game against the Pumas, then Covid hit my family. So there was never consistency. That played a huge role, and although a lot of people say I’m doing too much stuff off the field, I know myself and I will never take on too much because that’s the stuff that encourages me to work even harder because I know rugby opens those doors for me …

‘So, it’s not that, it was just about game time and consistency that was lacking. That’s why I’m excited to be here at the Sharks. The coaches have already said they just want me to get as fit as possible so I can deliver on the field. I know last year was difficult for me, you can’t hide it and the stats show it,’ he added.

‘I’m my biggest critic and I know that I need to work hard and fight for my place, nothing is going to be handed to me. Coach Sean [Everitt] said I just need to train hard, make sure I’m fit, and then I know I’m capable of doing anything. So I just need to have a good pre-season, and then when I’m ready I’ll have a chance to play. ‘

Making all the right noises......He will need to adjust to a great team enviroment where you are challenging for your place in the team , and what you bring to the table could mean a horses for courses selection....

Ultimately it makes the Sharks the team for all supporters of colour to support...

[handyman]

Kolisi also reflected on the past year, and admitted there were numerous factors that prevented him from finding any rhythm or momentum in his play.

‘For me, I believe I’m a player who needs to play five games in a row, especially at the beginning of the season. I didn’t get that last year; for example, the first game back after the World Cup I was injured, and I’d had no real pre-season. After that, the season was stopped.

‘Then just after that I injured my hamstring in the game against the Pumas, then Covid hit my family. So there was never consistency. That played a huge role, and although a lot of people say I’m doing too much stuff off the field, I know myself and I will never take on too much because that’s the stuff that encourages me to work even harder because I know rugby opens those doors for me …

‘So, it’s not that, it was just about game time and consistency that was lacking. That’s why I’m excited to be here at the Sharks. The coaches have already said they just want me to get as fit as possible so I can deliver on the field. I know last year was difficult for me, you can’t hide it and the stats show it,’ he added.

‘I’m my biggest critic and I know that I need to work hard and fight for my place, nothing is going to be handed to me. Coach Sean [Everitt] said I just need to train hard, make sure I’m fit, and then I know I’m capable of doing anything. So I just need to have a good pre-season, and then when I’m ready I’ll have a chance to play. ‘

Making all the right noises......He will need to adjust to a great team enviroment where you are challenging for your place in the team , and what you bring to the table could mean a horses for courses selection....

Ultimately it makes the Sharks the team for all supporters of colour to support...

See, you are going to have an issue. Kolisi is about team first, player second. Now he's in a dog eat dog environment, everything just looking out for number 1.

Trouble, she is coming.

[OomStruisbaai]

The problem with Springbok players at the provinces are that they need to be cotton wooled for Rassie plus they are very expensive. Some of them like Duane Vermeulen dont need any games to get into the provinces jersey and play like a Springbok. Kolisi never play like a Springbok for WP.

WP now for years has carry that burden for 11 years, time for the Sharks to help out.

[sorCrer]

Hendricks was better than AM this season.

[OomStruisbaai]

Hendricks was better than AM this season.

Both 13 yes

[Chilli]

Hendricks was better than AM this season.

Hendricks plays with which number on his back?
Am plays with which number on his back?

[Sards]

Hendricks was better than AM this season.

Hendricks plays with which number on his back?
Am plays with which number on his back?

You have to give Sauce credit....he is a Bull through and through

[sorCrer]

As a center.

[Chilli]

As a center.

They are 2 totally different positions.

[sorCrer]

As a center.

They are 2 totally different positions.

Yes. I have actually played many games as 11, 12, 13 and 14. Cornal gets up to speed quicker than Am (who I do rate). I'd still play Am at 12 on tighter plays but swap them when there is more field to work with.

My earlier point was that Cornal was a better player then Am this season.

[Sandstorm]

Frans Steyn had a good season. So did Jankies.

Any other players not involved with Sharks we can talk about on the Sharks thread? Reece Hodge?

[OomStruisbaai]

Willemse switch to 15 has been successful. Galante will struggle to get team with Kade now in flyhalf.

[Chilli]

As a center.

They are 2 totally different positions.

Yes. I have actually played many games as 11, 12, 13 and 14. Cornal gets up to speed quicker than Am (who I do rate). I'd still play Am at 12 on tighter plays but swap them when there is more field to work with.

My earlier point was that Cornal was a better player then Am this season.

Whilst playing in different positions.

It's like comparing a tight head prop to a loose head prop.

[Chilli]

SAT 20 FEB 2021 | 08:00
TRANSFER FEES: THE 'NEW' NORM IN SA
Jan de KoningJAN DE KONINGR365 EDITOR CONTACT JAN
World Cup-winning Springbok captain Siyamthanda Kolisi soft-pedalled the question when confronted with the query of his transfer fee during his formal media briefing – after being unveiled as a new Sharks signing.

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To recap.

It was first reported in the Cape Town media that the Western Province wanted a ZAR1-million transfer fee from the Sharks for Kolisi.

The Sharks, to the bitter end, denied they ever paid a cent.

Kolisi, to his credit, admitted there was indeed a ‘transfer fee’ involved, but said he personally took care of it – without confirming who put up the cash or revealed the actual amount.

“They [Western Province] offered me something [a new deal] and I said: ‘No, I won’t accept’,” the 29-year-old told the media briefing.

He added that he asked for an ‘early release’ from his contract, which was set to run till October.

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“Obviously there was a transfer fee and that is something I had to take care of myself.”

Some facts are clear:
1. He asked for an early release.
2. There was a transfer fee.
3. The transfer fee was paid.

(Continue below video …)
Video Spacer
However, the stumper is: Did Kolisi pay it out of his own pocket or was it provided for by one of his benefactors – which include his commercial agency Roc Nation and MVM Holdings partner Vincent Mai, the man who put up the bursary that allowed the Bok skipper to him to attend prestigious Grey High in Port Elizabeth?

The answer to that poser we may never know.

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However, there are some facts @rugby365com was able to unearth about the much-hyped transfer fee saga.

The transfer fee that was present in Kolisi’s contract is standard in all contracts – at least those of the Stormers/WP players.

These contracts require the player to pay. The reason for this clause is because the union/franchise can’t sign a contract with a potential future employer of the player – hence it is scripted so that the player is responsible (Kolisi: ‘That is something I had to take care of myself.’)

While, in reality, the new union often puts up the cash, in this case, the Sharks did not.

Those contracts ensure that the union/franchise is entitled to 15 percent of the player’s annual salary as a transfer fee.

* How about this for a provocative datum. If we accept that the reports of the amount of Kolisi’s transfer fee (ZAR1-million or thereabouts) are accurate, it would not be difficult to work out his annual salary (if that is important).

For what it’s worth. This also means other WP/Stormers players that were released early from their contracts would all have been required to pay transfer fees.

It is NOT new. It is the norm.

So Kolisi paid R1 million of his own money to get away from the WP?

[FalseBayFC]

There's no Bulls thread so I'll post it here because he's a Port Natal boy. Marcel Coetzee seems to have suffered a knee injury. Very sad. The oke has had lots of injury grief. But with his fitness record its probably safe to say he should now be blacklisted from Bok selection. He's just too high risk.

[OomStruisbaai]

There's no Bulls thread so I'll post it here because he's a Port Natal boy. Marcel Coetzee seems to have suffered a knee injury. Very sad. The oke has had lots of injury grief. But with his fitness record its probably safe to say he should now be blacklisted from Bok selection. He's just too high risk.

https://www.notplanetrugby.com/viewtopi ... ulls#p8927

[assfly]

I see Tambwe has left for the Bulls. A shame as I liked him, but was always going to struggle for gametime with Nkosi and Penxe there.

[handyman]

I see Tambwe has left for the Bulls. A shame as I liked him, but was always going to struggle for gametime with Nkosi and Penxe there.

A very good player, but yeah, saarks are spoiled at wing.

[FalseBayFC]

I see Tambwe has left for the Bulls. A shame as I liked him, but was always going to struggle for gametime with Nkosi and Penxe there.

A very good player, but yeah, saarks are spoiled at wing.

Absolutely. Mapimpi due back as well. Werner Kok will probably hang around until Sevens begins.
Tambwe will definitely benefit from consistent game time. He's only 23 and the thing I like about him is the support lines he runs. Not afraid to come off his wing and use his pace as a finisher.