"The BBC can't be 'stifling decent" because they can and might use other platforms" is some wonderfully flawed mental gymnastics

Since you asked so nicely, I never said the Sun was lying so a bizarre thing to keep going on.Insane_Homer wrote: Fri Mar 12, 2021 1:36 pmanswer the fucking question.Paddington Bear wrote: Fri Mar 12, 2021 1:31 pmOK, if you think that the cancelling of a comedy show that will most likely air on another channel, and who's chair is currently being reported on in all national papers as calling the Prime Minister a liar and a racist constitutes a country where there is a crackdown on all possible dissent then I think you're mad and we'll leave it there.Insane_Homer wrote: Fri Mar 12, 2021 1:28 pm
Yes I can. So I'll ask again, do you think the Sun is lying?
The cancellation of it because (as said by the Sun) it was critical of the government and anti-Brexit doesn't alter your view of it at all?Paddington Bear wrote: Fri Mar 12, 2021 3:34 pmSince you asked so nicely, I never said the Sun was lying so a bizarre thing to keep going on.Insane_Homer wrote: Fri Mar 12, 2021 1:36 pmanswer the fucking question.Paddington Bear wrote: Fri Mar 12, 2021 1:31 pm
OK, if you think that the cancelling of a comedy show that will most likely air on another channel, and who's chair is currently being reported on in all national papers as calling the Prime Minister a liar and a racist constitutes a country where there is a crackdown on all possible dissent then I think you're mad and we'll leave it there.
As I say, if you see the cancellation of a mediocre comedy show as a stifling of dissent dictatorship style we're starting from so far apart there's no point in the discussion. The UK is not a dictatorship and it trivialises what's going on in real ones to a point that is a little embarrassing. My last word on this, you're welcome to your opposing view.
The Telegraph is also reporting the same reasons for cancellation. At this stage, arguing the cancellation is NOT a political decision because of the show satirising the government and being anti-Brexit is swimming against the tide of information coming from all sides. The guy responsible has been open in his disdain for "left wing" comedy and in his desire to change things. It's blinkered to just flatly deny this is likely an example of it.Paddington Bear wrote: Fri Mar 12, 2021 4:22 pm 'As said by the Sun' is the key element there. They're as invested in whipping up a culture war as anyone. Chances are that it's been cancelled because shows get cancelled and it's viewing figures aren't amazing.
How bizarre!? I never said you said the Sun was lying. I asked you if you thought they were?Paddington Bear wrote: Fri Mar 12, 2021 3:34 pm Since you asked so nicely, I never said the Sun was lying so a bizarre thing to keep going on.
Paddington Bear wrote: Fri Mar 12, 2021 4:22 pm 'As said by the Sun' is the key element there. They're as invested in whipping up a culture war as anyone. Chances are that it's been cancelled because shows get cancelled and it's viewing figures aren't amazing.
I don’t think it’s actually possible to make a satire programme that appeals to a bunch of people with a simple nationalistic take on life. Not without some flat out racism and sexism being presented as humour.Rhubarb & Custard wrote: Sat Mar 13, 2021 10:42 am There is a fair concern that whilst the BBC has had shows like the Mash Report it has little that speaks in a similar voice from a pro Brexit, pro authoritarian government standpoint, and clearly that does lack balance vis a vis the UK population. The problem with the Beeb is how to make a satire that speaks to a bunch of people that believe in a simplistic nationalistic take on life that wouldn't come across as worrying in the extreme, just having the occasional guest slot for Geoff Norcot isn't enough, but what would be?
I think it's probably very difficult for any serious news organ to produce content that presents 'pro-Brexit, pro authoritarian government standpoints' in a favourable light without losing credibility.Rhubarb & Custard wrote: Sat Mar 13, 2021 10:42 am There is a fair concern that whilst the BBC has had shows like the Mash Report it has little that speaks in a similar voice from a pro Brexit, pro authoritarian government standpoint, and clearly that does lack balance vis a vis the UK population. The problem with the Beeb is how to make a satire that speaks to a bunch of people that believe in a simplistic nationalistic take on life that wouldn't come across as worrying in the extreme, just having the occasional guest slot for Geoff Norcot isn't enough, but what would be?
Starring Jim Davidson, & Bernard ManningInsane_Homer wrote: Sat Mar 13, 2021 1:59 pm ... and now for the "The Brexit Comedy show!"
you will laugh!
Certainly can't see them doing anything like the MPs expenses investigation under the current editorial regime.Rinkals wrote: Sat Mar 13, 2021 2:07 pmI think it's probably very difficult for any serious news organ to produce content that presents 'pro-Brexit, pro authoritarian government standpoints' in a favourable light without losing credibility.Rhubarb & Custard wrote: Sat Mar 13, 2021 10:42 am There is a fair concern that whilst the BBC has had shows like the Mash Report it has little that speaks in a similar voice from a pro Brexit, pro authoritarian government standpoint, and clearly that does lack balance vis a vis the UK population. The problem with the Beeb is how to make a satire that speaks to a bunch of people that believe in a simplistic nationalistic take on life that wouldn't come across as worrying in the extreme, just having the occasional guest slot for Geoff Norcot isn't enough, but what would be?
I accept that there are newspapers in the UK which attempt to do so, but whether they ever had any credibility in the first place is moot. If the Telegraph had any, it's certainly long gone since Boris started writing for them.
"There are some reports of reduced trade to Europe since we left the EU. Reality is our exports are indeed getting stuck, because of the EU covid response the trucks can't get through the streets as they are filled with dead bodies and unused Astrazeneca vaccine boxes!fishfoodie wrote: Sat Mar 13, 2021 2:12 pmStarring Jim Davidson, & Bernard ManningInsane_Homer wrote: Sat Mar 13, 2021 1:59 pm ... and now for the "The Brexit Comedy show!"
you will laugh!
There’s nothing funny about Vienna.TheNatalShark wrote: Sat Mar 13, 2021 6:43 pm"There are some reports of reduced trade to Europe since we left the EU. Reality is our exports are indeed getting stuck, because of the EU covid response the trucks can't get through the streets as they are filled with dead bodies and unused Astrazeneca vaccine boxes!fishfoodie wrote: Sat Mar 13, 2021 2:12 pmStarring Jim Davidson, & Bernard ManningInsane_Homer wrote: Sat Mar 13, 2021 1:59 pm ... and now for the "The Brexit Comedy show!"
you will laugh!![]()
"
I’d hate to be police in that scenario. The law says they must break it up as it’s beyond covid guidelines, but you know you’ll be pilloried for it.I like neeps wrote: Sat Mar 13, 2021 10:31 pm So on Saturday police decide to use violence against grieving woman during a vigil after one of their own (allegedly) murdered and kidnapped a woman. On Monday the Tories sprint through a bill giving police even more powers to stamp out protests.
Another banner week in our liberal democracy.
There is a very clear win. Allow the socially distanced vigil in the first place. The vigil was inevitable, banning it gave it extra politically charged dimensions. Kate Middleton turned up ffs. The met had more chance of removing covid from the country than mourners from the Common. You don't use violence on women who are I guess protesting violence against woman. You do not do that.Random1 wrote: Sat Mar 13, 2021 10:58 pmI’d hate to be police in that scenario. The law says they must break it up as it’s beyond covid guidelines, but you know you’ll be pilloried for it.I like neeps wrote: Sat Mar 13, 2021 10:31 pm So on Saturday police decide to use violence against grieving woman during a vigil after one of their own (allegedly) murdered and kidnapped a woman. On Monday the Tories sprint through a bill giving police even more powers to stamp out protests.
Another banner week in our liberal democracy.
On top of it all, it’s likely a cause they’d all be in support of.
No win.
Yep. A peaceful vigil, with most in attendance wearing face masks. Not a rowdy mob fighting with the police, instead the protesters shouted 'shame on you' as the police started arresting women.I like neeps wrote: Sat Mar 13, 2021 11:10 pmThere is a very clear win. Allow the socially distanced vigil in the first place. The vigil was inevitable, banning it gave it extra politically charged dimensions. Kate Middleton turned up ffs. The met had more chance of removing covid from the country than mourners from the Common. You don't use violence on women who are I guess protesting violence against woman. You do not do that.Random1 wrote: Sat Mar 13, 2021 10:58 pmI’d hate to be police in that scenario. The law says they must break it up as it’s beyond covid guidelines, but you know you’ll be pilloried for it.I like neeps wrote: Sat Mar 13, 2021 10:31 pm So on Saturday police decide to use violence against grieving woman during a vigil after one of their own (allegedly) murdered and kidnapped a woman. On Monday the Tories sprint through a bill giving police even more powers to stamp out protests.
Another banner week in our liberal democracy.
On top of it all, it’s likely a cause they’d all be in support of.
No win.
The police didn't fight any rangers fans as they celebrated in the streets last week. They even took the knee during some BLM protests. They allowed gatherings on streets for the NHS applause. What they did was ridiculous and I think it spells the end of Cressida Dick. They messed up so bad Priti Patel is annoyed at the use of force against protestors! They achieved the impossible.
I Agree in principle, and I can’t see any logic in it from a political stance.I like neeps wrote: Sat Mar 13, 2021 11:10 pmThere is a very clear win. Allow the socially distanced vigil in the first place. The vigil was inevitable, banning it gave it extra politically charged dimensions. Kate Middleton turned up ffs. The met had more chance of removing covid from the country than mourners from the Common. You don't use violence on women who are I guess protesting violence against woman. You do not do that.Random1 wrote: Sat Mar 13, 2021 10:58 pmI’d hate to be police in that scenario. The law says they must break it up as it’s beyond covid guidelines, but you know you’ll be pilloried for it.I like neeps wrote: Sat Mar 13, 2021 10:31 pm So on Saturday police decide to use violence against grieving woman during a vigil after one of their own (allegedly) murdered and kidnapped a woman. On Monday the Tories sprint through a bill giving police even more powers to stamp out protests.
Another banner week in our liberal democracy.
On top of it all, it’s likely a cause they’d all be in support of.
No win.
The police didn't fight any rangers fans as they celebrated in the streets last week. They even took the knee during some BLM protests. They allowed gatherings on streets for the NHS applause. What they did was ridiculous and I think it spells the end of Cressida Dick. They messed up so bad Priti Patel is annoyed at the use of force against protestors! They achieved the impossible.
I'm pretty sure the law gives the police full discretion.Random1 wrote: Sat Mar 13, 2021 10:58 pmI’d hate to be police in that scenario. The law says they must break it up as it’s beyond covid guidelines, but you know you’ll be pilloried for it.I like neeps wrote: Sat Mar 13, 2021 10:31 pm So on Saturday police decide to use violence against grieving woman during a vigil after one of their own (allegedly) murdered and kidnapped a woman. On Monday the Tories sprint through a bill giving police even more powers to stamp out protests.
Another banner week in our liberal democracy.
On top of it all, it’s likely a cause they’d all be in support of.
No win.
She's survived much worse; so I don't see why this should be any different.tc27 wrote: Sat Mar 13, 2021 11:39 pm Massive overreaction by the cops. Cant see Cressida Dick surviving this
Discretion still requires decision making. Doing nothing is a decision.JM2K6 wrote: Sun Mar 14, 2021 12:01 amI'm pretty sure the law gives the police full discretion.Random1 wrote: Sat Mar 13, 2021 10:58 pmI’d hate to be police in that scenario. The law says they must break it up as it’s beyond covid guidelines, but you know you’ll be pilloried for it.I like neeps wrote: Sat Mar 13, 2021 10:31 pm So on Saturday police decide to use violence against grieving woman during a vigil after one of their own (allegedly) murdered and kidnapped a woman. On Monday the Tories sprint through a bill giving police even more powers to stamp out protests.
Another banner week in our liberal democracy.
On top of it all, it’s likely a cause they’d all be in support of.
No win.
They didn't allow it because it would be a breach of covid rules. And they presumably didn't allow the BLM ones either. Unless legislation changed after it to ban protests in covid. Every protests in lockdown from BLM, to statue bores, to Piers Corbyn's anti lockdown loonies to this were all inevitable. So they should've allowed the vigil.Random1 wrote: Sun Mar 14, 2021 9:29 amDiscretion still requires decision making. Doing nothing is a decision.JM2K6 wrote: Sun Mar 14, 2021 12:01 amI'm pretty sure the law gives the police full discretion.Random1 wrote: Sat Mar 13, 2021 10:58 pm
I’d hate to be police in that scenario. The law says they must break it up as it’s beyond covid guidelines, but you know you’ll be pilloried for it.
On top of it all, it’s likely a cause they’d all be in support of.
No win.
Who knows what went into that decision.
Just off the top of my head, what if they had refused permission for BLM to hold a similar thing?
They’d have been pilloried for allowing this for a white woman.
All I’m saying is, let’s see what went into the decision, then condemn them, or not, once we have the facts.
I understand that Patel wants her out. But for someone more hardline. Here's the excuse.fishfoodie wrote: Sun Mar 14, 2021 12:26 amShe's survived much worse; so I don't see why this should be any different.tc27 wrote: Sat Mar 13, 2021 11:39 pm Massive overreaction by the cops. Cant see Cressida Dick surviving this
I am not sure that is the hill you want to die on...Glass houses etc.Muttonbird wrote: Sat Mar 13, 2021 10:59 pm The state of he UK police allowing this guy into their ranks. Wonder how many other murderers they've hired?
Exactly - that combined with elements at that vigil that were not there to honour Sarah but to stir up confrontation with the Police.Ymx wrote: Sun Mar 14, 2021 10:50 am Any protest which will involve breaking the existing law should be banned. That involves abiding to COVID restrictions.
Presumably the new laws are there to prevent breaking the law rather than needing to react and then have to make necessary fines and arrests as it happens. Which would be even more antagonist
The new laws are there to suppress any public display of dissent or opposition to the Government, from that bloke outside Parliament protesting Brexit to marches and vigils that the police don't like.Ymx wrote: Sun Mar 14, 2021 10:50 am Any protest which will involve breaking the existing law should be banned. That involves abiding to COVID restrictions.
Presumably the new laws are there to prevent breaking the law rather than needing to make necessary fines and arrests as it happens.
Reading reports of it it was perfectly peaceful and the police at a respectful distance until a group of men started confronting the police.Hal Jordan wrote: Sun Mar 14, 2021 10:58 amThe new laws are there to suppress any public display of dissent or opposition to the Government, from that bloke outside Parliament protesting Brexit to marches and vigils that the police don't like.Ymx wrote: Sun Mar 14, 2021 10:50 am Any protest which will involve breaking the existing law should be banned. That involves abiding to COVID restrictions.
Presumably the new laws are there to prevent breaking the law rather than needing to make necessary fines and arrests as it happens.
Incidentally, 100 people held a vigil in Nottingham Town Square yesterday evening, and it went off peacefully without any police intervention whatsoever, so the idea that the Met were forced to go in on a bunch of women protesting the death of a woman at the hands of a serving Met officer is fucking nonsense.
Tip of the iceberg isn't it. Last year two policemen took selfies with murdered woman and shared them across WhatsApp. Don't think they've yet been charged with anything though or what the crime is. But that mentality doesn't strike you as good. I notice the alleged killer was reported for flashing weeks before he killed someone and the met are investigating why nothing was done.Muttonbird wrote: Sat Mar 13, 2021 10:59 pm The state of he UK police allowing this guy into their ranks. Wonder how many other murderers they've hired?
Perhaps I misunderstood the new laws. Does it give police full discretionary rights, the right to block protests even where they will not break existing laws? And without parameters?Hal Jordan wrote: Sun Mar 14, 2021 10:58 amThe new laws are there to suppress any public display of dissent or opposition to the Government, from that bloke outside Parliament protesting Brexit to marches and vigils that the police don't like.Ymx wrote: Sun Mar 14, 2021 10:50 am Any protest which will involve breaking the existing law should be banned. That involves abiding to COVID restrictions.
Presumably the new laws are there to prevent breaking the law rather than needing to make necessary fines and arrests as it happens.
Incidentally, 100 people held a vigil in Nottingham Town Square yesterday evening, and it went off peacefully without any police intervention whatsoever, so the idea that the Met were forced to go in on a bunch of women protesting the death of a woman at the hands of a serving Met officer is fucking nonsense.
An entirely predictable outcome. The less than honest element of society can and does use these events to create chaos and if someone/people lose their positions of power over it all the better.Random1 wrote: Sat Mar 13, 2021 10:58 pmI like neeps wrote: Sat Mar 13, 2021 10:31 pm So on Saturday police decide to use violence against grieving woman during a vigil after one of their own (allegedly) murdered and kidnapped a woman. On Monday the Tories sprint through a bill giving police even more powers to stamp out protests.
Another banner week in our liberal democracy.
I’d hate to be police in that scenario. The law says they must break it up as it’s beyond covid guidelines, but you know you’ll be pilloried for it.
On top of it all, it’s likely a cause they’d all be in support of.
No win.