England v Argentina

[Madness]

I honestly think you need to give him a chance

His Leicester team were boring as fuck and so have England been. Pundits in the English game openly talk about this being his style of rugby. We might start executing it a bit better, but we could give him another 2 months or another 20 years and I'm pretty sure he'd have England playing the same dull, zero-risk anti-rugby.

I don't expect us to suddenly turn into prime France or Scotland, but looking like we have a plan other that actually involves occasionally trying to pass to a winger or engineer a line break would be nice.

I know, but look what he inherited and he’s only been there for a few months. They were easily the worst England team in my lifetime and, with pretty much the same players, he got to within a point of SA in a WC SF. He didn’t have time to change the players so I think he’s done OK. He’s a very inexperienced coach and his team are even less experienced. I think you have to at least give him a go.

Also, I’m not sure where this vision of England as an expansive attacking team is coming from, you’ve always been dull as fuck

Too true, always been dull

[sockwithaticket]

I honestly think you need to give him a chance

His Leicester team were boring as fuck and so have England been. Pundits in the English game openly talk about this being his style of rugby. We might start executing it a bit better, but we could give him another 2 months or another 20 years and I'm pretty sure he'd have England playing the same dull, zero-risk anti-rugby.

I don't expect us to suddenly turn into prime France or Scotland, but looking like we have a plan other that actually involves occasionally trying to pass to a winger or engineer a line break would be nice.

I know, but look what he inherited and he’s only been there for a few months. They were easily the worst England team in my lifetime and, with pretty much the same players, he got to within a point of SA in a WC SF. He didn’t have time to change the players so I think he’s done OK. He’s a very inexperienced coach and his team are even less experienced. I think you have to at least give him a go.

Also, I’m not sure where this vision of England as an expansive attacking team is coming from, you’ve always been dull as fuck

Nah, we played some good stuff under Woodward, Lancaster and Eddie's first 4 years.

Also, we see week in week out in the Prem that the players at our disposal are best suited to playing a more attacking game. Even Saracens have been throwing it around the last two or three seasons because the players coming through and that they've bought in from other clubs are more of the winnowy, skilful and speedy variety. The English game doesn't have have many brick wall centres and our forwards are struggling for parity, let alone dominance, at times with zero depth at prop. The way Borthwick seems to envision us playing doesn't suit the cattle available to England, so another way that plays to their strengths must be sought.

[BnM]

I never saw the landing for that, showed same replay on telly, did they help him down?

He was solo, they would only have tipped him if they tried to grip him again.

Yeah, Gonzales is built a bit different. Stuck the landing and set off

Just a fun, unorthodox player to watch.

Thanks both.

[C69]

Just watched the Cheika interview.
He really doesn't hold back on saying England were again gifted the match by the ref.

[SaintK]

Just watched the Cheika interview.
He really doesn't hold back on saying England were again gifted the match by the ref.

Similar rant every time they lose. Always the refs fault, his default position.

[C69]

Just watched the Cheika interview.
He really doesn't hold back on saying England were again gifted the match by the ref.

Similar rant every time they lose. Always the refs fault, his default position.

Was he wrong though?
I didn't watch enough of the game to comment tbh.

[dpedin]

[C69]

Farrell must really hate him.
Lol

[sockwithaticket]

Cheika was a whiny sore loser while he tanked Australia, of course he's the same with a side as inconsistent as Argentina.

[tc27]

Ref bottled that scrum.

Re this scrum...unless getting pushed backwards is a penalty offence I dont see the issue?

[SaintK]

What an absolute waste of talent.
Good luck to Arundell in Paris. Hope he tears it up!

[JM2K6]

I honestly think you need to give him a chance

His Leicester team were boring as fuck and so have England been. Pundits in the English game openly talk about this being his style of rugby. We might start executing it a bit better, but we could give him another 2 months or another 20 years and I'm pretty sure he'd have England playing the same dull, zero-risk anti-rugby.

I don't expect us to suddenly turn into prime France or Scotland, but looking like we have a plan other that actually involves occasionally trying to pass to a winger or engineer a line break would be nice.

I know, but look what he inherited and he’s only been there for a few months. They were easily the worst England team in my lifetime and, with pretty much the same players, he got to within a point of SA in a WC SF. He didn’t have time to change the players so I think he’s done OK. He’s a very inexperienced coach and his team are even less experienced. I think you have to at least give him a go.

Also, I’m not sure where this vision of England as an expansive attacking team is coming from, you’ve always been dull as fuck

The absolute worst England have been in your lifetime surely had to be the England team that came into this world Cup. We lost to Fiji. We were appallingly lucky against a bad Samoa team and should've lost to them, we scraped through the qf against a Fiji team that had lost to Portugal and we've played insanely negative anti rugby against teams having bad days.

The last couple of months is worse than the 2011 World Cup team that bombed out, the 2015 side that lost at the death to Wales, the dross of the mid to late 2000s. It's so frustrating that people look at the score against the first good team we played (and lost to) and just ignore how that game was played, how bad SA were, or just how rubbish our opponents had been to get us to that point in the first place.

He inherited a bad team and made them appreciably worse. He's had them for ages - 14? 15? matches and they still look like they've never seen a rugby ball in their life before.

[inactionman]

Just watched the Cheika interview.
He really doesn't hold back on saying England were again gifted the match by the ref.

Similar rant every time they lose. Always the refs fault, his default position.

Was he wrong though?
I didn't watch enough of the game to comment tbh.

Maybe they should have asked him about a forward pass.

[petej]

His Leicester team were boring as fuck and so have England been. Pundits in the English game openly talk about this being his style of rugby. We might start executing it a bit better, but we could give him another 2 months or another 20 years and I'm pretty sure he'd have England playing the same dull, zero-risk anti-rugby.

I don't expect us to suddenly turn into prime France or Scotland, but looking like we have a plan other that actually involves occasionally trying to pass to a winger or engineer a line break would be nice.

I know, but look what he inherited and he’s only been there for a few months. They were easily the worst England team in my lifetime and, with pretty much the same players, he got to within a point of SA in a WC SF. He didn’t have time to change the players so I think he’s done OK. He’s a very inexperienced coach and his team are even less experienced. I think you have to at least give him a go.

Also, I’m not sure where this vision of England as an expansive attacking team is coming from, you’ve always been dull as fuck

The absolute worst England have been in your lifetime surely had to be the England team that came into this world Cup. We lost to Fiji. We were appallingly lucky against a bad Samoa team and should've lost to them, we scraped through the qf against a Fiji team that had lost to Portugal and we've played insanely negative anti rugby against teams having bad days.

The last couple of months is worse than the 2011 World Cup team that bombed out, the 2015 side that lost at the death to Wales, the dross of the mid to late 2000s. It's so frustrating that people look at the score against the first good team we played (and lost to) and just ignore how that game was played, how bad SA were, or just how rubbish our opponents had been to get us to that point in the first place.

He inherited a bad team and made them appreciably worse. He's had them for ages - 14? 15? matches and they still look like they've never seen a rugby ball in their life before.

The thing is he had a few performances that showed real progress then just jettisoned or moved those players to accommodate favourites like farrell, billy vunipola, tuilagi etc..

[Uncle fester]

Just watched the Cheika interview.
He really doesn't hold back on saying England were again gifted the match by the ref.

Similar rant every time they lose. Always the refs fault, his default position.

Was he wrong though?
I didn't watch enough of the game to comment tbh.

Argentina had their chances and didn't take them.

[Uncle fester]

I know, but look what he inherited and he’s only been there for a few months. They were easily the worst England team in my lifetime and, with pretty much the same players, he got to within a point of SA in a WC SF. He didn’t have time to change the players so I think he’s done OK. He’s a very inexperienced coach and his team are even less experienced. I think you have to at least give him a go.

Also, I’m not sure where this vision of England as an expansive attacking team is coming from, you’ve always been dull as fuck

The absolute worst England have been in your lifetime surely had to be the England team that came into this world Cup. We lost to Fiji. We were appallingly lucky against a bad Samoa team and should've lost to them, we scraped through the qf against a Fiji team that had lost to Portugal and we've played insanely negative anti rugby against teams having bad days.

The last couple of months is worse than the 2011 World Cup team that bombed out, the 2015 side that lost at the death to Wales, the dross of the mid to late 2000s. It's so frustrating that people look at the score against the first good team we played (and lost to) and just ignore how that game was played, how bad SA were, or just how rubbish our opponents had been to get us to that point in the first place.

He inherited a bad team and made them appreciably worse. He's had them for ages - 14? 15? matches and they still look like they've never seen a rugby ball in their life before.

The thing is he had a few performances that showed real progress then just jettisoned or moved those players to accommodate favourites like farrell, billy vunipola, tuilagi etc..

He inherited a complete shitshow from Eddie and with world cup coming up, he was always going to be short term in his outlook.

See how he does in upcoming 6n.

[JM2K6]

Yup. It's pathetic that Youngs started that game. Awful that Billy was anywhere near the squad. Ridiculous that Manu got ahead of Lawrence. Etc, etc.