NPR

When you start referring to yourself in the 4th person inanimate object, you really need to up your meds!

Sandstorm wrote: Sun Sep 24, 2023 9:33 pm

_Os_ wrote: Sun Sep 24, 2023 9:30 pm

Sandstorm wrote: Sun Sep 24, 2023 9:26 pm Oom is right. Pass the ball in the mid-field and score tries. Then kicks at goal mean fokkol.

Os XV is a very clever side, they have noticed your place kicker is shooting at 40%, they have decided to cheat like fuck all the time because you cannot punish them. Os XV has now stopped you getting any useful ball.

We have the best pack in the world. Possibly ever. It’s the backs where we’re losing and I don’t think it’s because of shots at goal.

Let them have Pollard and play kick and charge boring shite. The game moved on, we all chasing the Irish or Leinster rugby.

I do not disagree with our limitations in midfield and would love to see Esterhuizen and Moodie there. Yet, the biggest flaw remains the goal kicking. Our forwards dominanted the no 1 team in the world and we only lost because we didn't convert 4 easy kicks.

Love Manie but accept his limitations. This is down to the coaches. Pollard should always have been in the squad. He was discarded like a Los lappie and the coaches had it under control...in their minds. Now reality bites.

boere wors wrote: Mon Sep 25, 2023 7:49 am I do not disagree with our limitations in midfield and would love to see Esterhuizen and Moodie there. Yet, the biggest flaw remains the goal kicking. Our forwards dominanted the no 1 team in the world and we only lost because we didn't convert 4 easy kicks.

OK , simple question, how many tries did Ellendig and Kriel spoiled and add the try we scored from 1st phase? Why dont you make your maths for at least three easy tries compare to Libbok misses?

AE and Moodie is a MUST in that backline with Libbok, Willemse and any of our wings.

Fuck Pollard

OomStruisbaai wrote: Mon Sep 25, 2023 8:09 am

boere wors wrote: Mon Sep 25, 2023 7:49 am I do not disagree with our limitations in midfield and would love to see Esterhuizen and Moodie there. Yet, the biggest flaw remains the goal kicking. Our forwards dominanted the no 1 team in the world and we only lost because we didn't convert 4 easy kicks.

OK , simple question, how many tries did Ellendig and Kriel spoiled and add the try we scored from 1st phase? Why dont you make your maths for at least three easy tries compare to Libbok misses?

AE and Moodie is a MUST in that backline with Libbok, Willemse and any of our wings.

Fuck Pollard

Too hypothetical. Even simpler question for you. Substract the try that we would have never scored without Manie and add the 11 points a reliable kicker would have made. Win or Loss?

OomStruisbaai wrote: Mon Sep 25, 2023 8:09 am

boere wors wrote: Mon Sep 25, 2023 7:49 am I do not disagree with our limitations in midfield and would love to see Esterhuizen and Moodie there. Yet, the biggest flaw remains the goal kicking. Our forwards dominanted the no 1 team in the world and we only lost because we didn't convert 4 easy kicks.

OK , simple question, how many tries did Ellendig and Kriel spoiled and add the try we scored from 1st phase? Why dont you make your maths for at least three easy tries compare to Libbok misses?

AE and Moodie is a MUST in that backline with Libbok, Willemse and any of our wings.

Fuck Pollard

You still don't get it. You are so vas on Willemse. He has now lost to the ABs and also Ireland starting. Willie produces try scoring opportunities and works well with Libbok. Willemse can take the bench
Grant
Libbok

Mapimpi
KLA

Andre
Moodie

Willie.

Pollard and Willemse on the bench

Look back at the history of the 2 backlines. Manie was constant but looked dreadful with the 1 backline and world class the other

The Fourie experiment. Has it failed. When he was expected to perform we lost the breakdown badly and a lineout on the 5 metre line on attack

Sards wrote: Mon Sep 25, 2023 8:22 am The Fourie experiment. Has it failed. When he was expected to perform we lost the breakdown badly and a lineout on the 5 metre line on attack

And our scrum went to shit, after total dominance. The hooker situation is another concern

Another point. At the post match Jaques was asked about kicking to posts instead of the line. He said that Kolisi had asked the kickers and they were confident and chose to kick.

I am questioning that. The disco lights left no debate

I would play this same side with a few forward changes against Tonga and the other side including Pollard for the Quarters

They were putting pressure on their players. Rassie was doing the talking, the coach [Jacques] Nienaber is drinking, who is running the show? Once they did 7-1, they felt they had to justify it. I couldn't believe when Etzebeth came off, I couldn't believe they took their captain off. Apart from the substitution of the two props which worked, I thought the substitutions were a disaster

https://www.balls.ie/rugby/matt-william ... HEA9gROWrU

boere wors wrote: Mon Sep 25, 2023 8:26 am

Sards wrote: Mon Sep 25, 2023 8:22 am The Fourie experiment. Has it failed. When he was expected to perform we lost the breakdown badly and a lineout on the 5 metre line on attack

And our scrum went to shit, after total dominance. The hooker situation is another concern

Our scrum went to shit? Honestly you were on Pappegaai twak like Sards?

I agree about Fourie. He looked totally out of his depth when he came on. Butchered a lineout and our scrum looked less stable.

Against Ireland you can't have any weak points.

Perhaps give Marco a run at 2 against Tonga, or jet in Dweba.

Some of you don't rate defence that highly it seems. A side has to make its tackles. De Allende will start, if you didn't want him you should've supported Frans Steyn more. Kriel will start because he tackles. Willemse has moved ahead of Le Roux because he's stronger on defence.

Some of you also aren't keen on scoring points by kicking goals. Only a moron would demand to support a side with a 40% goal kicker, when there's an 85% goal kicker available who is better in defence and has already won a RC/RWC/Lions series etc. It's like saying "fuck Butch James or Joel Stransky! I demand Brent Russell!".

Stuff like trying to play dual flyhalves is fine. But there needs to be someone defending and goals being kicked. Can't cook up entirely new combinations before a RWC quarter either.

This is going to happen. It's why Pollard was called up and not a hooker, and why everything was shot at goal (lineout maul attempt at the end the only time they tried?). RasNaber wouldn't replace Libbok if he didn't fail, they gave him the chance to shoot goals and win a match, he didn't take the chance and Pollard is ready. They could try and use Libbok and Pollard together, but Libbok would then be in the Le Roux role, and the actual Le Roux is in the squad.

OK Os, I get it. We are stuck with playing boring rugby again. Lets see where we get with it.

Winning games like the one against Irland...

OomStruisbaai wrote: Mon Sep 25, 2023 9:44 am OK Os, I get it. We are stuck with playing boring rugby again. Lets see where we get with it.

I quite like tackling and kicking. They're the basics, cannot win without them.

No use saying De Allende and Kriel must be replaced by inexperienced chumps who don't tackle. Or refusing to get the best place kicker into the XV and playing the full match. "Lets tackle less and continue with 40% goal kicking" doesn't sound like a great plan.

Mapimpi should replace Arendse too, it improves the defence and Mapimpi has the balls in big matches to try and do stuff on attack. Same with Vermeulen, he should come back into the 23 because he improves the defence, it's like having an on field assistant defence coach playing that's why he was sitting with the coaches for the Ireland match, he has a coach level understanding of what's happening. Same reason Willemse and Mostert shouldn't be out of the 23, they're good on defence.

_Os_ wrote: Mon Sep 25, 2023 10:07 am

OomStruisbaai wrote: Mon Sep 25, 2023 9:44 am OK Os, I get it. We are stuck with playing boring rugby again. Lets see where we get with it.

I quite like tackling and kicking. They're the basics, cannot win without them.

No use saying De Allende and Kriel must be replaced by inexperienced chumps who don't tackle. Or refusing to get the best place kicker into the XV and playing the full match. "Lets tackle less and continue with 40% goal kicking" doesn't sound like a great plan.

Mapimpi should replace Arendse too, it improves the defence and Mapimpi has the balls in big matches to try and do stuff on attack. Same with Vermeulen, he should come back into the 23 because he improves the defence, it's like having an on field assistant defence coach playing that's why he was sitting with the coaches for the Ireland match, he has a coach level understanding of what's happening. Same reason Willemse and Mostert shouldn't be out of the 23, they're good on defence.

What nonsense. How can anyone say the backline that destroyed the ABs is boring. The backline that lost to the ABs in the RC and Ireland....
Thats boring

boere wors wrote: Mon Sep 25, 2023 7:49 am I do not disagree with our limitations in midfield and would love to see Esterhuizen and Moodie there.

Esterhuizen is the only Bok who plays Libbok's style with experience. Moodie plays 13 and grubbers the ball into the 22. Fokkin kids!
The other two can fuck off back to Japan, where the Rugby standards have gone down the shitter recently.

_Os_ wrote: Mon Sep 25, 2023 10:07 am Mapimpi has the balls in big matches to try and do stuff on attack.

Attack who? The Irish mascot? Because with Blind & Alley playing 12/13, he won't get the ball in attack.

Sandstorm wrote: Mon Sep 25, 2023 11:45 am

boere wors wrote: Mon Sep 25, 2023 7:49 am I do not disagree with our limitations in midfield and would love to see Esterhuizen and Moodie there.

Esterhuizen is the only Bok who plays Libbok's style with experience. Moodie plays 13 and grubbers the ball into the 22. Fokkin kids!
The other two can fuck off back to Japan, where the Rugby standards have gone down the shitter recently.

Boerewors want the Japan midfield with Pollard. High kick and charge boring rugby.

Sandstorm wrote: Mon Sep 25, 2023 11:45 am The other two can fuck off back to Japan, where the Rugby standards have gone down the shitter recently.

This man is a fast moving wall on defence.

Sandstorm wrote: Mon Sep 25, 2023 11:53 am

_Os_ wrote: Mon Sep 25, 2023 10:07 am Mapimpi has the balls in big matches to try and do stuff on attack.

Attack who? The Irish mascot? Because with Blind & Alley playing 12/13, he won't get the ball in attack.

Wings need to go looking for work, they must bring themselves into the game. Not go missing when it gets tough. The few chances they get they must take and try to use, not wimp out.

_Os_ wrote: Mon Sep 25, 2023 11:58 am

Sandstorm wrote: Mon Sep 25, 2023 11:45 am The other two can fuck off back to Japan, where the Rugby standards have gone down the shitter recently.

This man is a fast moving wall on defence.

He was also about 2mm & a brown envelope of cash away from a 3 match ban against Scotland.....

Sandstorm wrote: Mon Sep 25, 2023 12:13 pm

_Os_ wrote: Mon Sep 25, 2023 11:58 am

Sandstorm wrote: Mon Sep 25, 2023 11:45 am The other two can fuck off back to Japan, where the Rugby standards have gone down the shitter recently.

This man is a fast moving wall on defence.

He was also about 2mm & a brown envelope of cash away from a 3 match ban against Scotland.....

You really believe that. With a ref, a TMO team, a bunker team, and a citing process? There's now a team of refs and quasi-refs, some on the pitch others looking at screens in a windowless room and yet more at a remote location we never see, all obsessed with head contact.

There was another angle which shows the impact was with the ball. Which is why nothing came of it.

Someone said to me.

This was billed and played as the RWC final. We are smarting after the loss but we are still in it and can make changes.

If it had been the RWC final Ireland would be champions and us the losers.

Sards wrote: Mon Sep 25, 2023 1:21 pm Someone said to me.

This was billed and played as the RWC final. We are smarting after the loss but we are still in it and can make changes.

If it had been the RWC final Ireland would be champions and us the losers.

Willemse to blame?

You can all moan and discuss the backline as much as you want. But we all know what is going to happen. In the QF in 3 weeks we will all see the same backline as in the RWC final 2019, obviously with Kriel instead of Am.

boere wors wrote: Mon Sep 25, 2023 1:29 pm You can all moan and discuss the backline as much as you want. But we all know what is going to happen. In the QF in 3 weeks we will all see the same backline as in the RWC final 2019, obviously with Kriel instead of Am.

Exactly.

I hope you lot don't cry yourselves dry when some Tongan idiot smashed Pollard in the back and he goes home injured.

_Os_ wrote: Mon Sep 25, 2023 12:53 pm

Sandstorm wrote: Mon Sep 25, 2023 12:13 pm

_Os_ wrote: Mon Sep 25, 2023 11:58 am
This man is a fast moving wall on defence.

He was also about 2mm & a brown envelope of cash away from a 3 match ban against Scotland.....

You really believe that. With a ref, a TMO team, a bunker team, and a citing process? There's now a team of refs and quasi-refs, some on the pitch others looking at screens in a windowless room and yet more at a remote location we never see, all obsessed with head contact.

There was another angle which shows the impact was with the ball. Which is why nothing came of it.

As per the IRB that's irrelevant, he was always high and always making contact high, that some other part of his body touched the ball is as useful as saying DDA has a lovely pass left to right.

And yet, and for whatever reason, an odd number of players have been excused red cards/bans in the lead up to and during the game's showpiece event. Either some form of madness has taken over, or the IRB have noted they don't want bans denying fans the chance to see their players at said showpiece event. I'd go with the political pressure behind the scenes, but I don't discount they could be nuttier than a sack of macadamias

Rhubarb & Custard wrote: Mon Sep 25, 2023 4:05 pm

_Os_ wrote: Mon Sep 25, 2023 12:53 pm

Sandstorm wrote: Mon Sep 25, 2023 12:13 pm

He was also about 2mm & a brown envelope of cash away from a 3 match ban against Scotland.....

You really believe that. With a ref, a TMO team, a bunker team, and a citing process? There's now a team of refs and quasi-refs, some on the pitch others looking at screens in a windowless room and yet more at a remote location we never see, all obsessed with head contact.

There was another angle which shows the impact was with the ball. Which is why nothing came of it.

As per the IRB that's irrelevant, he was always high and always making contact high, that some other part of his body touched the ball is as useful as saying DDA has a lovely pass left to right.

And yet, and for whatever reason, an odd number of players have been excused red cards/bans in the lead up to and during the game's showpiece event. Either some form of madness has taken over, or the IRB have noted they don't want bans denying fans the chance to see their players at said showpiece event. I'd go with the political pressure behind the scenes, but I don't discount they could be nuttier than a sack of macadamias

The jolt backwards was from contact with the ball, Kriel's head goes past the Scottish player's head. That's why it wasn't cited. Or you can believe in conspiracy theories that SA Rugby control World Rugby.

_Os_ wrote: Mon Sep 25, 2023 4:29 pm

Rhubarb & Custard wrote: Mon Sep 25, 2023 4:05 pm

_Os_ wrote: Mon Sep 25, 2023 12:53 pm
You really believe that. With a ref, a TMO team, a bunker team, and a citing process? There's now a team of refs and quasi-refs, some on the pitch others looking at screens in a windowless room and yet more at a remote location we never see, all obsessed with head contact.

There was another angle which shows the impact was with the ball. Which is why nothing came of it.

As per the IRB that's irrelevant, he was always high and always making contact high, that some other part of his body touched the ball is as useful as saying DDA has a lovely pass left to right.

And yet, and for whatever reason, an odd number of players have been excused red cards/bans in the lead up to and during the game's showpiece event. Either some form of madness has taken over, or the IRB have noted they don't want bans denying fans the chance to see their players at said showpiece event. I'd go with the political pressure behind the scenes, but I don't discount they could be nuttier than a sack of macadamias

The jolt backwards was from contact with the ball, Kriel's head goes past the Scottish player's head. That's why it wasn't cited. Or you can believe in conspiracy theories that SA Rugby control World Rugby.

I don't believe SA does control the IRB, for one I wouldn't make a charge of such competency. Also it's not only SA players getting a bye for head on head contacts, which suggests the reason isn't due to SA players being involved and more they simply don't want too many bans .

And I imagine that clip shows head on head contact, because that's what happened, and that's what was ignored. But they're not ignoring by accident, it's surely by design

Rhubarb & Custard wrote: Mon Sep 25, 2023 4:43 pm And I imagine that clip shows

Why are you imagining stuff when the clip shows what happened from an angle most didn't see?

This is what Rassie said at the time, which ended up being correct:

"“We are comfortable that they haven’t cited him and we are very sure that there won’t be a citing,” Erasmus said.
“There definitely wasn’t head-on-head contact, it was a tackle on the ball. He moved up after making the tackle on the ball.
“I’ve seen a few stills where that were taken just after Jesse made direct contact on the ball. You can make any tackle like that look really bad. If you look a millisecond or a second or two back, you will see that he clearly tackled on the ball.
“So, yeah, we are very happy with how it was refereed. We are happy with the decision that was made. I will be very surprised that, with first contact on the ball, there will be anything from that.”
Erasmus added that he felt Scotland flyhalf Finn Russell’s shoulder charge on Kurt-Lee Arendse, which left the Springbok wing with a cut on the head, was “much closer”."

Rhubarb & Custard wrote: Mon Sep 25, 2023 4:43 pm But they're not ignoring by accident, it's surely by design

So you're not just wrong, instead there's a purposely designed conspiracy.

I thought it was wrong and against rugby to criticise the ref/s. Is it okay to do so now and throw in the entire governing body being bent too? Sounds like it's wrong when we do it but okay and very clever when you do it?

I think applying the pre-RWC framework is now demonstrably silly. Bunker/TMOs clearly been given a different flow chart. From coaches comments, I think the coaches haven’t seen the new decision tree.

_Os_ wrote: Mon Sep 25, 2023 4:57 pm So you're not just wrong, instead there's a purposely designed conspiracy.

I thought it was wrong and against rugby to criticise the ref/s. Is it okay to do so now and throw in the entire governing body being bent too? Sounds like it's wrong when we do it but okay and very clever when you do it?

You don’t think it’s weird that things that were given as clear reds in the warm ups aren’t in round two and three in the comp?

Edit: Round one was closer to warm ups than rounds 2/3

Simian wrote: Mon Sep 25, 2023 5:05 pm

_Os_ wrote: Mon Sep 25, 2023 4:57 pm So you're not just wrong, instead there's a purposely designed conspiracy.

I thought it was wrong and against rugby to criticise the ref/s. Is it okay to do so now and throw in the entire governing body being bent too? Sounds like it's wrong when we do it but okay and very clever when you do it?

You don’t think it’s weird that things that were given as clear reds in the warm ups aren’t in round two and three in the comp?

Edit: Round one was closer to warm ups than rounds 2/3

They're only focused on head contact. Anything that looks like obvious head contact is looked at extremely closely.

Anything else like neck holds, dangerous contact in the air, seatbelt tackles that get close to the neck, torpedo no arms shoulder barges, even head contact if it's in a ruck and not immediately clear ... they don't give a shit about any of that. Only head contact between tackler and ball carrier.

It's like some people think if we play Libbok against the world's best we become untouchable. It's like they think we'll score tries for free because he's there. It's like they think these other teams can't tackle and apply pressure. It's like they think rookie players like Libbok and Moodie wont crack under this pressure.

This is not the fokon Currie cup, you're not going to cut teams like Ireland, NZ and France up just because you picked players that can run. This is test rugby against the world's best where 3 points can win or lose you a game.

average joe wrote: Tue Sep 26, 2023 6:52 am It's like some people think if we play Libbok against the world's best we become untouchable. It's like they think we'll score tries for free because he's there. It's like they think these other teams can't tackle and apply pressure. It's like they think rookie players like Libbok and Moodie wont crack under this pressure.

This is not the fokon Currie cup, you're not going to cut teams like Ireland, NZ and France up just because you picked players that can run. This is test rugby against the world's best where 3 points can win or lose you a game.

Spot on! As much as we all would love to see our backline running in tries.