NPR

Not the best day for the SRU to send out the debenture details for next season...

I’ve just sat down and watched yesterday’s game (first viewing, was following on Twitter at the time).

My take now: it was a tightly fought game and it could easily have gone either way. If we didn’t have such a regular diet of false dawns, we’d take it on the chin. The reason we’re upset is that we seem to be on the wrong side of these fine margins about 80% of the time.

Few other thoughts:

Ireland’s first try and our first try both owed a fair amount to favourable bounces of the ball. We’ll call it even.

Our defence was actually very solid all game - Ireland had us on our line a few times and we gave up very little.

Ireland’s second try was utter bullshit. Field position from a penalty that wasn’t a penalty (how the fuck can you blow up for holding on even as the ball is visibly coming back? It wasn’t the only time we were pinged for holding on almost immediately, either). Then he awards a try he couldn’t possibly have seen grounded, without (I think) even checking with the TMO!

We actually deserve some credit for not folding after that, and pulling ourselves back level. All Scotland for a while.

Decisions at the end - Price actually had a decent game otherwise, but that box kick was hideous. Hogg was also guilty of kicking away possession with a few minutes to go, but he isn’t a 10, so maybe harsh to criticise. Russell wasn’t bad, either. Had a good day off the tee, didn’t do anything stupid, and missed one touch (as did Sexton).

IMHO there were two reasons we lost. The first was, as everyone has said, the lineout. Even a mediocre lineout and I reckon we’d have won. The second was that we lost pretty much every 50:50 ball in the air. Every time there was an aerial challenge, the Ireland player came away with the ball as if it was glued to him. This happened twice in the dying minutes.

One other real pivotal moment was the one kick Russell missed just before HT. If that had gone over, we’d probably have gone in 2 points up rather than 4 points down.

Yr Alban wrote: Tue Mar 16, 2021 12:41 am ...
One other real pivotal moment was the one kick Russell missed just before HT. If that had gone over, we’d probably have gone in 2 points up rather than 4 points down.

If my auntie had balls.

Good analysis. At the time I was raging due to the sheer Scottishness of the manner of defeat but, in hindsight, it probably wasn't as bad as I thought, aside from the plethora of stupid errors and brainfarts.

Tattie wrote: Tue Mar 16, 2021 12:53 am

Yr Alban wrote: Tue Mar 16, 2021 12:41 am ...
One other real pivotal moment was the one kick Russell missed just before HT. If that had gone over, we’d probably have gone in 2 points up rather than 4 points down.

If my auntie had balls.

Good analysis. At the time I was raging due to the sheer Scottishness of the manner of defeat but, in hindsight, it probably wasn't as bad as I thought, aside from the plethora of stupid errors and brainfarts.

Aye, I know. I was just observing that sometimes a game can turn on a tiny moment like that.

Yr Alban wrote: Tue Mar 16, 2021 12:56 am

Tattie wrote: Tue Mar 16, 2021 12:53 am

Yr Alban wrote: Tue Mar 16, 2021 12:41 am ...
One other real pivotal moment was the one kick Russell missed just before HT. If that had gone over, we’d probably have gone in 2 points up rather than 4 points down.

If my auntie had balls.

Good analysis. At the time I was raging due to the sheer Scottishness of the manner of defeat but, in hindsight, it probably wasn't as bad as I thought, aside from the plethora of stupid errors and brainfarts.

Aye, I know. I was just observing that sometimes a game can turn on a tiny moment like that.

Aye, fine margins indeed. Aside from the obvious player fuck-ups (butchered try v Wales, Fagerson, Price yesterday etc), I reckon we were two big, incorrect refereeing decisions away from playing for the Grand Slam in Paris a week on Friday. Two split second decisions that could and should have gone our way is the difference between Scotland's best tournament this century and yet another soul crushing pile o' shite.

We were crap yesterday so a win would have been a little harsh on Ireland, but how many times has that happened to us? Winning ugly is a sign of a good side.

Tattie wrote: Tue Mar 16, 2021 1:25 am

Yr Alban wrote: Tue Mar 16, 2021 12:56 am

Tattie wrote: Tue Mar 16, 2021 12:53 am

If my auntie had balls.

Good analysis. At the time I was raging due to the sheer Scottishness of the manner of defeat but, in hindsight, it probably wasn't as bad as I thought, aside from the plethora of stupid errors and brainfarts.

Aye, I know. I was just observing that sometimes a game can turn on a tiny moment like that.

Aye, fine margins indeed. Aside from the obvious player fuck-ups (butchered try v Wales, Fagerson, Price yesterday etc), I reckon we were two big, incorrect refereeing decisions away from playing for the Grand Slam in Paris a week on Friday. Two split second decisions that could and should have gone our way is the difference between Scotland's best tournament this century and yet another soul crushing pile o' shite.

We were crap yesterday so a win would have been a little harsh on Ireland, but how many times has that happened to us? Winning ugly is a sign of a good side.

Having watched the whole game now, I actually don’t think we were dreadful. The lineout was a shambles, we got turned over a bit too easily and couldn’t contest a ball in the air. But we also had parity in the scrum, our defence was excellent, and our attack was decent when we got it going.

Edinburgh have signed SQ hooker Adam McBurney from Ulster. Anyone know much about him? Edinburgh also confirmed Willemese is away at the end of the season.

Begbie wrote: Tue Mar 16, 2021 11:05 am Edinburgh have signed SQ hooker Adam McBurney from Ulster. Anyone know much about him? Edinburgh also confirmed Willemese is away at the end of the season.

No but I am glad we're finally looking in Ireland for SQ players. Connacht's Sean Masterson is also SQ as his brother played for Scotland age grades. Ben Healy now signed to Munster's professional contract too. Surely others. You can't have the shared history we have with Ireland without it.

Begbie wrote: Tue Mar 16, 2021 11:05 am Edinburgh have signed SQ hooker Adam McBurney from Ulster. Anyone know much about him? Edinburgh also confirmed Willemese is away at the end of the season.

Here is what Cockers says about him

https://www.edinburghrugby.org/the-club ... RZw0V9_7Rg

Mike Willemse leaves at the end of season

Yr Alban wrote: Tue Mar 16, 2021 7:34 am

Tattie wrote: Tue Mar 16, 2021 1:25 am

Yr Alban wrote: Tue Mar 16, 2021 12:56 am

Aye, I know. I was just observing that sometimes a game can turn on a tiny moment like that.

Aye, fine margins indeed. Aside from the obvious player fuck-ups (butchered try v Wales, Fagerson, Price yesterday etc), I reckon we were two big, incorrect refereeing decisions away from playing for the Grand Slam in Paris a week on Friday. Two split second decisions that could and should have gone our way is the difference between Scotland's best tournament this century and yet another soul crushing pile o' shite.

We were crap yesterday so a win would have been a little harsh on Ireland, but how many times has that happened to us? Winning ugly is a sign of a good side.

Having watched the whole game now, I actually don’t think we were dreadful. The lineout was a shambles, we got turned over a bit too easily and couldn’t contest a ball in the air. But we also had parity in the scrum, our defence was excellent, and our attack was decent when we got it going.

I think this is a good summary.

I'm not too up on the return to play protocols but would have thought it'd be know by now if Finn is out or not, haven't seen anything on it though.

Looking like CdP off to Toulon

Jock42 wrote: Wed Mar 17, 2021 12:26 pm Looking like CdP off to Toulon

Who?

Slick wrote: Wed Mar 17, 2021 12:58 pm

Jock42 wrote: Wed Mar 17, 2021 12:26 pm Looking like CdP off to Toulon

Who?

Cornel du Preez

Jock42 wrote: Wed Mar 17, 2021 12:26 pm Looking like CdP off to Toulon

Obviously still in demand. I thought he could have done better than going to Worcester actually.

Deserves a bit of a payday after those horrific injuries.

robmatic wrote: Wed Mar 17, 2021 1:35 pm

Jock42 wrote: Wed Mar 17, 2021 12:26 pm Looking like CdP off to Toulon

Obviously still in demand. I thought he could have done better than going to Worcester actually.

Deserves a bit of a payday after those horrific injuries.

Aye he's done really well to get back after that.

Jock42 wrote: Wed Mar 17, 2021 12:59 pm

Slick wrote: Wed Mar 17, 2021 12:58 pm

Jock42 wrote: Wed Mar 17, 2021 12:26 pm Looking like CdP off to Toulon

Who?

Cornel du Preez

Ahh right, thanks

Not rugby related, but sitting in the garden working is an absolute fucking pleasure.

Obviously not working would be better, but great anyway.

Slick wrote: Wed Mar 17, 2021 3:28 pm Not rugby related, but sitting in the garden working is an absolute fucking pleasure.

Obviously not working would be better, but great anyway.

I've spent a lot of time in front of my laptop between doing a degree and virtual training for the reserves when I'm not at work of the last few weeks. I can't handle much more of it

Toony has basically said Russell won’t feature v Italy, and Jonny Gray is a major doubt. Cummings out already if fractured hand confirmed. Have also heard unconfirmed rumour about Sutherland being out as well.

Second row probably not an issue, especially if Richie Gray is fit (not sure whether he is). Skinner can slot in and Gilchrist did OK v Ireland.

LHP is fine if Kebble is fit. If not, more of an issue.

Russell: the timing is pretty bad, let’s face it. Toony isn’t calling up anyone else, so it’ll be Jaco with Lang or Hogg covering.

Yr Alban wrote: Wed Mar 17, 2021 5:19 pm Toony has basically said Russell won’t feature v Italy, and Jonny Gray is a major doubt. Cummings out already if fractured hand confirmed. Have also heard unconfirmed rumour about Sutherland being out as well.

Second row probably not an issue, especially if Richie Gray is fit (not sure whether he is). Skinner can slot in and Gilchrist did OK v Ireland.

LHP is fine if Kebble is fit. If not, more of an issue.

Russell: the timing is pretty bad, let’s face it. Toony isn’t calling up anyone else, so it’ll be Jaco with Lang or Hogg covering.

Lovely. Can't wait for Saturday

Begbie wrote: Wed Mar 17, 2021 6:42 pm

Yr Alban wrote: Wed Mar 17, 2021 5:19 pm Toony has basically said Russell won’t feature v Italy, and Jonny Gray is a major doubt. Cummings out already if fractured hand confirmed. Have also heard unconfirmed rumour about Sutherland being out as well.

Second row probably not an issue, especially if Richie Gray is fit (not sure whether he is). Skinner can slot in and Gilchrist did OK v Ireland.

LHP is fine if Kebble is fit. If not, more of an issue.

Russell: the timing is pretty bad, let’s face it. Toony isn’t calling up anyone else, so it’ll be Jaco with Lang or Hogg covering.

Lovely. Can't wait for Saturday

Even allowing for the fact that we play a different Italy from everyone else, I think we should have enough to see us safely home even without the players named. Then again, what do I know?

I'd like to see Lang at 10 later in the game tbh.

I'd be going Craig and Skinner in the 2nd row.

Jock42 wrote: Wed Mar 17, 2021 8:27 pm I'd like to see Lang at 10 later in the game tbh.

I wouldn’t mind that either, a solid number 3 after Finn and Hastings maybe.

Having said that I just watched the highlights of the Edinburgh game and Chamberlain looked a player!

Slick wrote: Wed Mar 17, 2021 10:29 pm

Jock42 wrote: Wed Mar 17, 2021 8:27 pm I'd like to see Lang at 10 later in the game tbh.

I wouldn’t mind that either, a solid number 3 after Finn and Hastings maybe.

Having said that I just watched the highlights of the Edinburgh game and Chamberlain looked a player!

Problem with Lang is that even for Quins he's only ever been bench cover at 10 of that recently. It is something like two years since he started a game there.

There’s the option of Hoggy at 10, Graham, Maitland and vdW in the back three. I don’t suppose we’ll see it, but I’d like to give it a lash.

Slick wrote: Wed Mar 17, 2021 10:29 pm

Jock42 wrote: Wed Mar 17, 2021 8:27 pm I'd like to see Lang at 10 later in the game tbh.

I wouldn’t mind that either, a solid number 3 after Finn and Hastings maybe.

Having said that I just watched the highlights of the Edinburgh game and Chamberlain looked a player!

Cockers was quoted a wee while ago as saying the younger players will get their chance in the upcoming Rainbow Cup.
Frankly I don’t see how playing the top 4 Saffa franchises’ packs is a better introduction than playing the Pro 14 teams, but there we go.

Chamberlain was left as an unused sub for something like 8 or 9 games, Charlie Shiel is now trying to force everything because he gets so little game time. Matt Currie is training with Scotland but gets seconds off the bench at the end of an Edinburgh game due to an injured player coming off.

Meanwhile Dobie and Thompson are shaping up very nicely over at Glasgow, they will be ready next season, or damn near close.

Tichtheid wrote: Thu Mar 18, 2021 8:05 am There’s the option of Hoggy at 10, Graham, Maitland and vdW in the back three. I don’t suppose we’ll see it, but I’d like to give it a lash.

The Thistle pod guys are saying they've heard it's Steele and Hogg at 9&10. I can never remember if it's them or the Scottish Rugby Blog guys that get it wrong quite a lot though

Begbie wrote: Thu Mar 18, 2021 8:53 am

Tichtheid wrote: Thu Mar 18, 2021 8:05 am There’s the option of Hoggy at 10, Graham, Maitland and vdW in the back three. I don’t suppose we’ll see it, but I’d like to give it a lash.

The Thistle pod guys are saying they've heard it's Steele and Hogg at 9&10. I can never remember if it's them or the Scottish Rugby Blog guys that get it wrong quite a lot though

Saw that too. Hogg starting at 10 might be peak tombola, with an actual 10 available (even if it’s Jaco)

Tichtheid wrote: Thu Mar 18, 2021 8:14 am

Slick wrote: Wed Mar 17, 2021 10:29 pm

Jock42 wrote: Wed Mar 17, 2021 8:27 pm I'd like to see Lang at 10 later in the game tbh.

I wouldn’t mind that either, a solid number 3 after Finn and Hastings maybe.

Having said that I just watched the highlights of the Edinburgh game and Chamberlain looked a player!

Cockers was quoted a wee while ago as saying the younger players will get their chance in the upcoming Rainbow Cup.
Frankly I don’t see how playing the top 4 Saffa franchises’ packs is a better introduction than playing the Pro 14 teams, but there we go.

Probably has a lot to do with Cockers' performance review (I imagine) being based on the Pro 14 and the Rainbow Cup, if it happens, not being meaningful.

robmatic wrote: Thu Mar 18, 2021 9:02 am
Probably has a lot to do with Cockers' performance review (I imagine) being based on the Pro 14 and the Rainbow Cup, if it happens, not being meaningful.

Sure, but there does seem to be an innate conservatism in his selections as well as the tactics.

A few of the players who have left have said as much, and it's not just guys who you'd think have an axe to grind because they wanted to prove themselves, John Barclay said it was difficult to break into the inner circle from the outside.

I haven't heard anything in this regarding Matt Scott, but it does make you wonder when he was really very keen for a contract renewal, even on reduced terms, but it just wasn't happening.

Yr Alban wrote: Thu Mar 18, 2021 8:59 am

Begbie wrote: Thu Mar 18, 2021 8:53 am

Tichtheid wrote: Thu Mar 18, 2021 8:05 am There’s the option of Hoggy at 10, Graham, Maitland and vdW in the back three. I don’t suppose we’ll see it, but I’d like to give it a lash.

The Thistle pod guys are saying they've heard it's Steele and Hogg at 9&10. I can never remember if it's them or the Scottish Rugby Blog guys that get it wrong quite a lot though

Saw that too. Hogg starting at 10 might be peak tombola, with an actual 10 available (even if it’s Jaco)

Unless Jaco is injured I find this hard to believe. My guess would be they have been running this scenario in training because there will be no cover on the bench, and we will see Jaco start.

I'd rather Steele started if Dobbie isn't getting his first cap

Begbie wrote: Thu Mar 18, 2021 8:53 am

Tichtheid wrote: Thu Mar 18, 2021 8:05 am There’s the option of Hoggy at 10, Graham, Maitland and vdW in the back three. I don’t suppose we’ll see it, but I’d like to give it a lash.

The Thistle pod guys are saying they've heard it's Steele and Hogg at 9&10. I can never remember if it's them or the Scottish Rugby Blog guys that get it wrong quite a lot though

Hogg at 10 seems a bit unnecessary when there is an actual 10 in the squad.

robmatic wrote: Thu Mar 18, 2021 10:47 am

Begbie wrote: Thu Mar 18, 2021 8:53 am

Tichtheid wrote: Thu Mar 18, 2021 8:05 am There’s the option of Hoggy at 10, Graham, Maitland and vdW in the back three. I don’t suppose we’ll see it, but I’d like to give it a lash.

The Thistle pod guys are saying they've heard it's Steele and Hogg at 9&10. I can never remember if it's them or the Scottish Rugby Blog guys that get it wrong quite a lot though

Hogg at 10 seems a bit unnecessary when there is an actual 10 in the squad.

I don't think it will happen.

JvdW did okay against Ireland last year

robmatic wrote: Thu Mar 18, 2021 10:47 am

Begbie wrote: Thu Mar 18, 2021 8:53 am

Tichtheid wrote: Thu Mar 18, 2021 8:05 am There’s the option of Hoggy at 10, Graham, Maitland and vdW in the back three. I don’t suppose we’ll see it, but I’d like to give it a lash.

The Thistle pod guys are saying they've heard it's Steele and Hogg at 9&10. I can never remember if it's them or the Scottish Rugby Blog guys that get it wrong quite a lot though

Hogg at 10 seems a bit unnecessary when there is an actual 10 in the squad.

I think Hogg is a better option at 10 than VdW for this game. The only thing is Hogg's range of passing but VdW is hardly a terrific passer.

But he is an experienced international, a good leader and unlikely to get flustered. Italy will go for us and it will take a little bit of experience and nous in the early exchanges particularly if Steele is at 9. Starting a 10 in his second cap who was ok but not great of debut may be seen as a bigger risk.

Tichtheid wrote: Thu Mar 18, 2021 8:14 am

Slick wrote: Wed Mar 17, 2021 10:29 pm

Jock42 wrote: Wed Mar 17, 2021 8:27 pm I'd like to see Lang at 10 later in the game tbh.

I wouldn’t mind that either, a solid number 3 after Finn and Hastings maybe.

Having said that I just watched the highlights of the Edinburgh game and Chamberlain looked a player!

Cockers was quoted a wee while ago as saying the younger players will get their chance in the upcoming Rainbow Cup.
Frankly I don’t see how playing the top 4 Saffa franchises’ packs is a better introduction than playing the Pro 14 teams, but there we go.

Chamberlain was left as an unused sub for something like 8 or 9 games, Charlie Shiel is now trying to force everything because he gets so little game time. Matt Currie is training with Scotland but gets seconds off the bench at the end of an Edinburgh game due to an injured player coming off.

Meanwhile Dobie and Thompson are shaping up very nicely over at Glasgow, they will be ready next season, or damn near close.

If Chamberlain (and Shiel/Frostwick) get sacrificed behind 2nd string packs it will be disappointing. They need to be bled in with the 1sts but my fear is they wont be.

Jamie Lyall (who I rate highly) now also in on the Hogg to 10 - it is almost certainly happening

Will we go all in? Backline of Steele, Hogg, Johnson, Jones, Duhan, Darcy, Maitland? Sexy, but also surely a recipe for utter disaster.

Toonie's Top Tombola

KingBlairhorn wrote: Thu Mar 18, 2021 1:57 pm Jamie Lyall (who I rate highly) now also in on the Hogg to 10 - it is almost certainly happening

Will we go all in? Backline of Steele, Hogg, Johnson, Jones, Duhan, Darcy, Maitland? Sexy, but also surely a recipe for utter disaster.

Apparently that’s exactly what we’re doing.

I may just hide under the sofa for the next few days. Damn it, I actually have to work on Sat.