Scotland vs Springboks

[OomStruisbaai]

That’s what we all said after the final whistle. That was a good game, but with a competent ref it would have been a great game.

We probably still wouldn’t have won, but it would have been a terrific game.

Boet honestly, you sound like having to many sour grapes while watching the rugby. Next time focus on the players.

Refs make mistakes, they are human.

Agree - and they make less than any player on the paddock despite being involved in EVERY play.

Still, we (and I) like to moan

Ever heard of supporter moaning after winning? Thats ok I think. After losing it not only sound like sour grapes but it also make you more depressing. In rugby forwards decide the win , backs the score line. The Boks bullied them up front despite being kak in the lineouts. Not even their lovely Hollie would have saved them.

[OomStruisbaai]

That’s what we all said after the final whistle. That was a good game, but with a competent ref it would have been a great game.

We probably still wouldn’t have won, but it would have been a terrific game.

Boet honestly, you sound like having to many sour grapes while watching the rugby. Next time focus on the players.

Refs make mistakes, they are human.

Yeah you guys never ever ever do it. Fuck off.

Boet your personal attacks mean vokol. Go blow your doedelsak.

[Slick]

Law trial query 1:

Is the TMO Protocol trial that was active in the summer being used in the Autumn Nations Series? There is no mention of it in the ANS press release on law trials.

Disallowed try for Scotland went back 3 phases which is outwith current Protocol but not the trial Protocol.

This is interesting.

[Chilli2]

That’s what we all said after the final whistle. That was a good game, but with a competent ref it would have been a great game.

We probably still wouldn’t have won, but it would have been a terrific game.

Boet honestly, you sound like having to many sour grapes while watching the rugby. Next time focus on the players.

Refs make mistakes, they are human.

Yeah you guys never ever ever do it. Fuck off.

Classy.

[Slick]

Oh, and the thing I haven’t mentioned yet is the penalty given away by SA immediately under their post. It was a deliberate and cynical penalty in a try scoring position. But the ref didn’t give a yellow card, because he’d given on 90 seconds previously. An experienced ref wouldn’t have been scared of that, and would have put SA down to thirteen. That was the point they were at their most rattled, with abrasive throwing his toys about on the big screen in the stadium. We would have scored again against thirteen from that point.

I must say I turned to the Saffer next to me at that point and said that’s another yellow and he agreed, we were both surprised it wasn’t given, especially as it was, imo, worse than the one that was

[I like neeps]

If anyone should have seen red for the Cummings incident it's the South African 9. Comes in from the side (illegal) and collapses the ruck onto Mostert's leg.

[assfly]

Ugly win but I'll take it. Scotland were better than the scoreline shows, but at times they really were their own worst enemies with some of their passing. Also their contesting under the high ball was woeful, which is bizarre considering it's not exactly a state secret we were going to do it.

Valuable gametime for some of the dirt trackers to make an impression on Rassie, but apart from Thomas du Toit and AE none of them really did. Henrikse was terrible, I don't know what was wrong with him. Williams must be our first choice 9 going forward.

[average joe]

Faf, for all his faults is still a better 9 than Jaden "slowmo" Hendrikse.

[assfly]

Faf, for all his faults is still a better 9 than Jaden "slowmo" Hendrikse.

Hendikse is a better player than what we saw yesterday.

He is usually abrasive and takes the ball up much more, and is a strong tackler and good at the jackal.

But yesterday he was very clumsy at the back of the ruck. I counted 3 errors.

[I like neeps]

Law trial query 1:

Is the TMO Protocol trial that was active in the summer being used in the Autumn Nations Series? There is no mention of it in the ANS press release on law trials.

Disallowed try for Scotland went back 3 phases which is outwith current Protocol but not the trial Protocol.

Rugby's laws, the interpretations of the laws, and the annual trials we have means that nobody understands the rules anymore.

Not a surprise Ian Tempest didn't know them and overstepped his mark.

Townsend should release a Rassie Erasmus inspired crying whining deep cut of every wrong decision to scare other referees from wronging us.

[average joe]

His pass is so slow I thought they were broadcasting in slowmo every time he passed the ball.

[JM2K6]

Law trial query 1:

Is the TMO Protocol trial that was active in the summer being used in the Autumn Nations Series? There is no mention of it in the ANS press release on law trials.

Disallowed try for Scotland went back 3 phases which is outwith current Protocol but not the trial Protocol.

Rugby's laws, the interpretations of the laws, and the annual trials we have means that nobody understands the rules anymore.

Not a surprise Ian Tempest didn't know them and overstepped his mark.

Townsend should release a Rassie Erasmus inspired crying whining deep cut of every wrong decision to scare other referees from wronging us.

They went back 2 phases I think? I guess it all depends whether you consider the end of the ruck to be the beginning of the new phase or when it's originally created. I think it's probably not worth quibbling about, it was a short period of time before the break happened.

Biffer: they did not get the wrong guy. Cummings falls on his leg. It's still a baffling red, of course.

[assfly]

Ja I agree that didn't even look like a card. Just an unfortunate rugby incident where nobody got hurt.

[Sards]

It was great playing the Scots....Result was never going to be in doubt but the Scots but up a Braveheart. Nothing to be ashamed of.....The English , Irish and Welsh on the other hand...

[Chilli2]

I'm not sure if Bongi was throwing pies, or they worked out our lineout calls or we were trying to overcomplicate the lineouts.

I was not impressed with Van Staaden. Kwagga isn't a big test starter, he is a bomb squad specialist.
Hendricks was slow. Am has tits for hands.

RG Snyman should do the basics then play cute rugby. He seems to believe the press about him and he thinks that he has to do something spectacular every time he touches the ball.

[I like neeps]

Law trial query 1:

Is the TMO Protocol trial that was active in the summer being used in the Autumn Nations Series? There is no mention of it in the ANS press release on law trials.

Disallowed try for Scotland went back 3 phases which is outwith current Protocol but not the trial Protocol.

Rugby's laws, the interpretations of the laws, and the annual trials we have means that nobody understands the rules anymore.

Not a surprise Ian Tempest didn't know them and overstepped his mark.

Townsend should release a Rassie Erasmus inspired crying whining deep cut of every wrong decision to scare other referees from wronging us.

They went back 2 phases I think? I guess it all depends whether you consider the end of the ruck to be the beginning of the new phase or when it's originally created. I think it's probably not worth quibbling about, it was a short period of time before the break happened.

Biffer: they did not get the wrong guy. Cummings falls on his leg. It's still a baffling red, of course.

Cummings falls on the guys legs because of the illegal actions of the South African 9 (and maybe Rory Darge) so you're sending a guy off for being wrong place at the wrong time because of the illegal play of two others.

[JM2K6]

Rugby's laws, the interpretations of the laws, and the annual trials we have means that nobody understands the rules anymore.

Not a surprise Ian Tempest didn't know them and overstepped his mark.

Townsend should release a Rassie Erasmus inspired crying whining deep cut of every wrong decision to scare other referees from wronging us.

They went back 2 phases I think? I guess it all depends whether you consider the end of the ruck to be the beginning of the new phase or when it's originally created. I think it's probably not worth quibbling about, it was a short period of time before the break happened.

Biffer: they did not get the wrong guy. Cummings falls on his leg. It's still a baffling red, of course.

Cummings falls on the guys legs because of the illegal actions of the South African 9 (and maybe Rory Darge) so you're sending a guy off for being wrong place at the wrong time because of the illegal play of two others.

Yes, I know. I'm saying that they didn't get the wrong guy, it is Cummings who does the thing they consider illegal. We are in complete agreement that it's very confused with a ton of mitigation.

[Slick]

Law trial query 1:

Is the TMO Protocol trial that was active in the summer being used in the Autumn Nations Series? There is no mention of it in the ANS press release on law trials.

Disallowed try for Scotland went back 3 phases which is outwith current Protocol but not the trial Protocol.

Rugby's laws, the interpretations of the laws, and the annual trials we have means that nobody understands the rules anymore.

Not a surprise Ian Tempest didn't know them and overstepped his mark.

Townsend should release a Rassie Erasmus inspired crying whining deep cut of every wrong decision to scare other referees from wronging us.

I was at hospitality yesterday and they had Habana, Johnny Beattie and Franco Smith all speaking. Everyone of them made a point about the laws constantly changing and how damaging it was for the game

[Sandstorm]

RG Snyman should do the basics then play cute rugby. He seems to believe the press about him and he thinks that he has to do something spectacular every time he touches the ball.

Leinstertainment. That chicken-wing offload works with players you train & play with every week. Stupid to try it in a Test Team that hasn't played together for a month.

[Big D]

Fun game to watch. Better team with the greater depth of talent won.

[Yr Alban]

Good point made on the Beeb: Scotland can and do score magnificent tries, usually off first or second phase possession, but we aren’t good at scoring the sort of tries that you grind out with relentless pressure and finally score on the 7th or 8th phase. Against the really top level teams, opportunities to score the first kind of try are rare. You are much more likely to need to make the most of opportunities to score the second kind. This is what we need to work on.

Having said that, for many years now we’ve looked like we had no answer to teams who dominate us physically, but yesterday SA didn’t overwhelm us, so maybe we’ve finally learned.

[assfly]

Can we just take a moment to appreciate Willie le Roux's chip kick for Mapimpi's second try?

An absolute thing of beauty. It was like a soccer kick, forcing the receiver to attack the space. So much more difficult to execute when the receiver is relatively static.

We will miss le Roux when he is gone.

[OomStruisbaai]

https://x.com/i/status/1855868213843698038

[Slick]

Can we just take a moment to appreciate Willie le Roux's chip kick for Mapimpi's second try?

An absolute thing of beauty. It was like a soccer kick, forcing the receiver to attack the space. So much more difficult to execute when the receiver is relatively static.

We will miss le Roux when he is gone.

Think it was appreciated further up. I saw it in the stadium and thought it looked brilliant, even better on TV

[weegie01]

Good point made on the Beeb: Scotland can and do score magnificent tries, usually off first or second phase possession, but we aren’t good at scoring the sort of tries that you grind out with relentless pressure and finally score on the 7th or 8th phase. Against the really top level teams, opportunities to score the first kind of try are rare. You are much more likely to need to make the most of opportunities to score the second kind. This is what we need to work on.

Having said that, for many years now we’ve looked like we had no answer to teams who dominate us physically, but yesterday SA didn’t overwhelm us, so maybe we’ve finally learned.

Having SA in the URC has made a big difference. In the past Scottish players never encountered the physicality of the Boks except those rare times they played them. Now they play teams with a similar approach several times a year who may not bring Bok level intensity, but they do bring more physicality than the other URC teams.

[Tichtheid]

Good point made on the Beeb: Scotland can and do score magnificent tries, usually off first or second phase possession, but we aren’t good at scoring the sort of tries that you grind out with relentless pressure and finally score on the 7th or 8th phase. Against the really top level teams, opportunities to score the first kind of try are rare. You are much more likely to need to make the most of opportunities to score the second kind. This is what we need to work on.

Having said that, for many years now we’ve looked like we had no answer to teams who dominate us physically, but yesterday SA didn’t overwhelm us, so maybe we’ve finally learned.

On the grinding out, one thing that I think the lawmakers should address is the cynical second or third penalty under advantage, the ones that kill the ball in the ruck when everyone knows they will go back for the original penalty - don't get me wrong, Edinburgh, Glasgow and Scotland do it too, everyone does, but heavy sanction for that might allow for release of the ball in scoring situations - it's always in the 22 when this happens.

Yes players do get carded for a cynical last-gasp penalty or a deliberate knock on, but that's not what I'm talking about

[inactionman]

Good point made on the Beeb: Scotland can and do score magnificent tries, usually off first or second phase possession, but we aren’t good at scoring the sort of tries that you grind out with relentless pressure and finally score on the 7th or 8th phase. Against the really top level teams, opportunities to score the first kind of try are rare. You are much more likely to need to make the most of opportunities to score the second kind. This is what we need to work on.

Having said that, for many years now we’ve looked like we had no answer to teams who dominate us physically, but yesterday SA didn’t overwhelm us, so maybe we’ve finally learned.

On the grinding out, one thing that I think the lawmakers should address is the cynical second or third penalty under advantage, the ones that kill the ball in the ruck when everyone knows they will go back for the original penalty - don't get me wrong, Edinburgh, Glasgow and Scotland do it too, everyone does, but heavy sanction for that might allow for release of the ball in scoring situations - it's always in the 22 when this happens.

Yes players do get carded for a cynical last-gasp penalty or a deliberate knock on, but that's not what I'm talking about

NZ always used to be good at this - a second quick penalty conceded to kill the ball, and to kill any chance of conceding under the advantage.

It should be pretty straightforward - the ref can judge whether the infringement was cynical or not, and give a yellow card if cynical. That's already allowed, isn't it?


I also find the team with advantage playing a 'hail Mary' really frustrating - just play properly, and take advantage of the fact that it gets reset if you stuff it up.

[Tichtheid]

It should be pretty straightforward - the ref can judge whether the infringement was cynical or not, and give a yellow card if cynical. That's already allowed, isn't it?

I can't really remember a card being issued for the specific circumstance I'm talking about - that "kill the ball in the ruck" whilst under advantage

[inactionman]

It should be pretty straightforward - the ref can judge whether the infringement was cynical or not, and give a yellow card if cynical. That's already allowed, isn't it?

I can't really remember a card being issued for the specific circumstance I'm talking about - that "kill the ball in the ruck" whilst under advantage

Oh, I'm agreeing, just pointing out that it wouldn't necessarily require a Law change to resolve.

[Tichtheid]

It should be pretty straightforward - the ref can judge whether the infringement was cynical or not, and give a yellow card if cynical. That's already allowed, isn't it?

I can't really remember a card being issued for the specific circumstance I'm talking about - that "kill the ball in the ruck" whilst under advantage

Oh, I'm agreeing, just pointing out that it wouldn't necessarily require a Law change to resolve.

That's fair.

However I'd add that often laws aren't changed per se, but directives are issued to ensure refs penalise certain things (quite often at the start of a season, then two or three months into it, the actions get ignored again)

edited to add - I remember Stuart Hogg being caught on the ref's mic shouting "KILL IT" to his forwards in a Scotland game.
The thing is, I shouted the very same thing at the tv at the same time!

[OomStruisbaai]

Hope your Mrs dont hear your shouting.

[Biffer]

Good point made on the Beeb: Scotland can and do score magnificent tries, usually off first or second phase possession, but we aren’t good at scoring the sort of tries that you grind out with relentless pressure and finally score on the 7th or 8th phase. Against the really top level teams, opportunities to score the first kind of try are rare. You are much more likely to need to make the most of opportunities to score the second kind. This is what we need to work on.

Having said that, for many years now we’ve looked like we had no answer to teams who dominate us physically, but yesterday SA didn’t overwhelm us, so maybe we’ve finally learned.

On the grinding out, one thing that I think the lawmakers should address is the cynical second or third penalty under advantage, the ones that kill the ball in the ruck when everyone knows they will go back for the original penalty - don't get me wrong, Edinburgh, Glasgow and Scotland do it too, everyone does, but heavy sanction for that might allow for release of the ball in scoring situations - it's always in the 22 when this happens.

Yes players do get carded for a cynical last-gasp penalty or a deliberate knock on, but that's not what I'm talking about

Didn’t get carded for the cyclical penalty on Sunday…

[Sandstorm]

Didn’t get carded for the cyclical penalty on Sunday…

We did. Some said we should have got another yellow for the next penalty immediately after that one too.....

[Biffer]

Didn’t get carded for the cyclical penalty on Sunday…

We did. Some said we should have got another yellow for the next penalty immediately after that one too.....

That's the one I'm talking about. Worse than the first one, entirely deliberate and cynical. Would have been a yellow if you hadn't been down to fourteen already. Ref absolutely bottled the call.

[OomStruisbaai]

Didn’t get carded for the cyclical penalty on Sunday…

We did. Some said we should have got another yellow for the next penalty immediately after that one too.....

That's the one I'm talking about. Worse than the first one, entirely deliberate and cynical. Would have been a yellow if you hadn't been down to fourteen already. Ref absolutely bottled the call.

Thought you are finished with your ref bashing. Must be depressing.

[Sards]

Oh my word. Please Scots. You played against our B team.
Don't spoil the respect I have for your side.

[Biffer]

Oh my word. Please Scots. You played against our B team.
Don't spoil the respect I have for your side.

You can tell Etzebeth he’s in the B team.

[Sandstorm]

Oh my word. Please Scots. You played against our B team.
Don't spoil the respect I have for your side.

You can tell Etzebeth he’s in the B team.

He’s B Team skipper. He’s ok with that.

[Biffer]

Oh my word. Please Scots. You played against our B team.
Don't spoil the respect I have for your side.

You can tell Etzebeth he’s in the B team.

He’s B Team skipper. He’s ok with that.

Kiwis will be happy to know the 23 that beat them in Cape Town is mostly a B team.

[Sards]

You can tell Etzebeth he’s in the B team.

He’s B Team skipper. He’s ok with that.

Kiwis will be happy to know the 23 that beat them in Cape Town is mostly a B team.

Ja...this is the big grind going around atm.....the insane depth of the Springboks.....
Time to wipe the tears and move on lads....