NPR

Big D wrote: Wed Nov 24, 2021 9:46 am

Slick wrote: Wed Nov 24, 2021 9:17 am

Big D wrote: Wed Nov 24, 2021 1:20 am

It is a wee bit more nuanced than that though isn't it?

For example the one yellow card on Scotland v Aus/SA was for contact with the face by a player diving off his feet at a ruck (IIRC). Where as the yellow in Scotland v Japan was for a "totting up" of penalties rather than the offence itself. So that's one yellow of 1 offence and 1 for effectively 8 or so penalties.

I don't remember there being too many contentious card/no card incidents in Scotlands games really.

It wouldn't surprise me if refs were slightly influenced by the home crowds. To be fair to them, for some it'll be the first time they've been in front of 80k+ crowds for 2 years.

The comical ooooing and ahhhhing from the home crowd has become part of the game now.

Absolutely, but refs/touch judges haven't had to stand in front of a crowd that size in a long time under pressure. Would be understandable if they were impacted (more so than usual) in this AIs IMO.

I think the influence of the home crowd is a given, people, even if subconsciously, want to feel they belong, be part of a gang, and going against the crowd goes against that instinct. The host union also brings out their most gracious hospitality for the visiting ref, and people generally don't like to offend their hosts. But I'm not convinced the refs were more impacted just because they haven't refereed in front of crowds for while. It will anyway be interesting to see how the cards, and results stack up during the July tests. I'm sure the NH posters will be just as supportive of the refs then as they are now.

Calculon wrote: Thu Nov 25, 2021 12:47 pm

Big D wrote: Wed Nov 24, 2021 9:46 am

Slick wrote: Wed Nov 24, 2021 9:17 am

The comical ooooing and ahhhhing from the home crowd has become part of the game now.

Absolutely, but refs/touch judges haven't had to stand in front of a crowd that size in a long time under pressure. Would be understandable if they were impacted (more so than usual) in this AIs IMO.

I think the influence of the home crowd is a given, people, even if subconsciously, want to feel they belong, be part of a gang, and going against the crowd goes against that instinct. The host union also brings out their most gracious hospitality for the visiting ref, and people generally don't like to offend their hosts. But I'm not convinced the refs were more impacted just because they haven't refereed in front of crowds for while. It will anyway be interesting to see how the cards, and results stack up during the July tests. I'm sure the NH posters will be just as supportive of the refs then as they are now.

I would take each card, or lack of, on its own merits. Not "we had similar number of penalties but more cards".

Take the Scotland games, two yellows for (both "one more and someone goes" type cards) and two against both for reckless or dangerous play. One of the Aussie props also avoided a card just because he was practically knocked out.

The Wales v Australia game saw two straight forward cards for the Aussies and Thomas could have been a red rather than a yellow. When you compare it to the yellow Alaalatoa got versus Scotland the main difference is contact with the face and contact with the head, both make similar movements with the arm, are reckless and there was no need. But both were a yellow so there is some consistency there.

Are we sure this isn't Australia that is the issue? From memory the Bell tackle was a borderline off the ball tip tackle that was a Lawes hand away from him landing on his neck and it being a red. The Wright card in that game was direct contact to the head and could easily have been red but the ref, as others have done (see Alaalatoa and Thomas) mitigated it down to a yellow.

So of the 8 SH cards, 5 were for Aussies, 4 of those were for contact with the head or tip tackles and one was a deliberate knock on.

I say we bin Australia in an attempt to clean the game up :)

Hong Kong wrote: Thu Nov 25, 2021 12:50 pm https://www.timeslive.co.za/sport/rugby ... to-digest/

Rennie gets a written warning

Calculon wrote: Sat Nov 27, 2021 12:18 pm

Hong Kong wrote: Thu Nov 25, 2021 12:50 pm https://www.timeslive.co.za/sport/rugby ... to-digest/

Rennie gets a written warning

Seesm fair enough. No priors, didn't threaten the ref beforehand and done in a heat of the moment interview straight after the game.

All of those things could not be taken into account with Rassie

Yes, it was just reaction from a standard media interview. He didn’t go out of his way to create and publish on social media. And he apologised afterwards. He got his point across too.

Who is running the ref shit show these days? Is it Joel Jutdge?

Jutge, but yes.

ETA - Currently the head of the refs reports in to Joe Schmidt. I don't know if they've confirmed if that's staying as is post Schmidt

Can we also bitch and moan about coaches/players who bring this sort of nonsense into the game?

Yeah. Not a fan of teams that look to exploit the laws in "creative" ways in order to spoil or slow down the game.

Niegs wrote: Sun Nov 28, 2021 7:55 pm Can we also bitch and moan about coaches/players who bring this sort of nonsense into the game?

No. Make your own new thread.

Ymx wrote: Sun Nov 28, 2021 8:20 pm

Niegs wrote: Sun Nov 28, 2021 7:55 pm Can we also bitch and moan about coaches/players who bring this sort of nonsense into the game?

No. Make your own new thread.

Okay, so I'm bitching at referees for not doing anything about it!

I'd also like refs to stop trying to be nice to athletes (presumably because they were Billy No Mates in their playing days, and want to get invited out for a drink after) and march the cynical plum back when they say anything negative or ask for penalties/cards.

Niegs wrote: Sun Nov 28, 2021 10:33 pm

Ymx wrote: Sun Nov 28, 2021 8:20 pm

Niegs wrote: Sun Nov 28, 2021 7:55 pm Can we also bitch and moan about coaches/players who bring this sort of nonsense into the game?

No. Make your own new thread.

Okay, so I'm bitching at referees for not doing anything about it!

I'd also like refs to stop trying to be nice to athletes (presumably because they were Billy No Mates in their playing days, and want to get invited out for a drink after) and march the cynical plum back when they say anything negative or ask for penalties/cards.

This. Get unnecessarily annoyed by the seeminly new thing of using players first names like they're friends. When I was ever captain I'd ask to be referred to as red 2 so I knew he was warning me.

I love the crab for the chargedown attempt from Sarries. Nothing wrong with it legally. I'd not cry if it was stamped out for some reason, but I'm always going to appreciate the genius to realise it was a possibility.

Raggs wrote: Mon Nov 29, 2021 10:16 am I love the crab for the chargedown attempt from Sarries. Nothing wrong with it legally. I'd not cry if it was stamped out for some reason, but I'm always going to appreciate the genius to realise it was a possibility.

I would not be surprised if there was a quick re-emphasis that you must be behind the back foot if you're going to try and charge down, even if you're "bound" to begin with.

JM2K6 wrote: Mon Nov 29, 2021 10:21 am

Raggs wrote: Mon Nov 29, 2021 10:16 am I love the crab for the chargedown attempt from Sarries. Nothing wrong with it legally. I'd not cry if it was stamped out for some reason, but I'm always going to appreciate the genius to realise it was a possibility.

I would not be surprised if there was a quick re-emphasis that you must be behind the back foot if you're going to try and charge down, even if you're "bound" to begin with.

But if you're part of the ruck I don't believe you have to be, as long as you entered the ruck legally. I suspect there may be a small shift in perhaps picking up that they've not come through the middle however.