Tories now tell whiteys to "go home"

[Torquemada 1420]

Seems the original thread title was discomforting.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... o-leave-uk

Now, if this had been targeted at Asians or Blacks, I wonder that the response would be? This latest Tory stunt is a subtle variation of ethnic cleansing with a monetary sweetener to help encourage the pill to be swallowed.

They are incapable of change. The last version of this stunt

was a key factor in swinging the vote for a pro Brexit as masses of ill educated people were swept up in the Enoch Effect.

They've been at it for 60+ years now

[Insane_Homer]

@admin, please merge into the Tory Scum thread.

[dpedin]

Absolutely feckin insane! What a bunch of cnuts!

[charltom]

Seems the original thread title was discomforting.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... o-leave-uk

Now, if this had been targeted at Asians or Blacks, I wonder that the response would be? This latest Tory stunt is a subtle variation of ethnic cleansing with a monetary sweetener to help encourage the pill to be swallowed.

They are incapable of change. The last version of this stunt

was a key factor in swinging the vote for a pro Brexit as masses of ill educated people were swept up in the Enoch Effect.

They've been at it for 60+ years now

But this poster has clearly been made up by someone who couldn't spell "burdened".

[Insane_Homer]

fuck that, go full BNP instead & get paid to leave!

[Torquemada 1420]

But this poster has clearly been made up by someone who couldn't spell "burdened".

Tories in "thick as sh*t" shocker?

[Sandstorm]

But this poster has clearly been made up by someone who couldn't spell "burdened".

Tories in "thick as sh*t" shocker?

It's amazing how little control and oversight there is across the Party.

They're getting kicked daily for Brexit trade delays + poor Covid response, yet they chuck some full-blown racism on the fire too!
Clownshoes.

[JM2K6]

But this poster has clearly been made up by someone who couldn't spell "burdened".

Tories in "thick as sh*t" shocker?

It's amazing how little control and oversight there is across the Party.

They're getting kicked daily for Brexit trade delays + poor Covid response, yet they chuck some full-blown racism on the fire too!
Clownshoes.

It's a one-trick Government based on stoking the culture war that got them Brexit. Why on earth do you expect them to behave any differently? As far as they're concerned, they're doing what they're good at and their base loves them for it.

[Glaston]

But this poster has clearly been made up by someone who couldn't spell "burdened".

Tories in "thick as sh*t" shocker?

It's amazing how little control and oversight there is across the Party.

They're getting kicked daily for Brexit trade delays + poor Covid response, yet they chuck some full-blown racism on the fire too!
Clownshoes.

Where is the Racism?

Are they not offering non white Europeans the deal?

[dpedin]

Seriously though we in Scotland are desperate for inward migration given our pop demographics and drop in pop of working age. This is one of the main reasons, there were lots of others, we were so against the ending of FoM. Feckin idiotic to start paying good quality highly skilled workerforce, and the majority are, to leave when we desperately need them here.

[ASMO]

Tories in "thick as sh*t" shocker?

It's amazing how little control and oversight there is across the Party.

They're getting kicked daily for Brexit trade delays + poor Covid response, yet they chuck some full-blown racism on the fire too!
Clownshoes.

Where is the Racism?

Are they not offering non white Europeans the deal?

Race is not all about colour

[Hugo]

Seriously though we in Scotland are desperate for inward migration given our pop demographics and drop in pop of working age.

I'm curious to know what's the position of the SNP on this?

I would imagine a nationalist party not wanting too much inward migration because it would water down their chances of getting elected and water down the national identity of the country.

Good faith question, I genuinely don't know much about Scottish nationalism.

[dkm57]

As far as I'm aware the SNP are in favour of immigration, strange as it may seem most immigrants are likely to go native and lean towards independence or at least further Devolution.

[dpedin]

Seriously though we in Scotland are desperate for inward migration given our pop demographics and drop in pop of working age.

I'm curious to know what's the position of the SNP on this?

I would imagine a nationalist party not wanting too much inward migration because it would water down their chances of getting elected and water down the national identity of the country.

Good faith question, I genuinely don't know much about Scottish nationalism.

SNP are very much pro EU and very much pro FoM. I think you are mixing up a party like SNP wanting self determination for Scotland with a racist, jingoistic and populist 'nationalist' party like the Tories! Scotland voted heavily for remaining in EU and that also included FoM, we are trying desperately to remain in schemes like Erasmus etc despite the nationalist Tory party taking the UK out of it and if possible would rejoin the EU including FoM, Erasmsus, etc as soon as we can.

Interestingly everyone who lived in Scotland was allowed to vote in the independence referendum run by the SG but foreign/EU nationals were not allowed to vote in the Brexit referendum by the nationalist UK Gov, indeed my mate a UK citizen who lived in Belgium at the time wasn't allowed to vote ... I will leave you to come to your own conclusions.

Everyone who lives in Scotland is by definition Scottish, we don't differentiate. Migrants don't 'water down' national identity at all, they help build and sustain it! I find that 'water down' point you make slightly distasteful tbh.

[salanya]

Seriously though we in Scotland are desperate for inward migration given our pop demographics and drop in pop of working age. This is one of the main reasons, there were lots of others, we were so against the ending of FoM. Feckin idiotic to start paying good quality highly skilled workerforce, and the majority are, to leave when we desperately need them here.

Vote for independence and join the EU, and I'll happily move to Scotland.

I've got full Settled Status, but I feel Nick Griffin/Priti Patel should still give me £50k

[charltom]

But this poster has clearly been made up by someone who couldn't spell "burdened".

Tories in "thick as sh*t" shocker?

It's amazing how little control and oversight there is across the Party.

They're getting kicked daily for Brexit trade delays + poor Covid response, yet they chuck some full-blown racism on the fire too!
Clownshoes.

What, "60+ years" ago? In a clearly made-up poster? Are you guys normally this bad at checking sources?

[JM2K6]

Tories in "thick as sh*t" shocker?

It's amazing how little control and oversight there is across the Party.

They're getting kicked daily for Brexit trade delays + poor Covid response, yet they chuck some full-blown racism on the fire too!
Clownshoes.

What, "60+ years" ago? In a clearly made-up poster? Are you guys normally this bad at checking sources?

Er... if it's fake, the original is worse: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smethwick ... l_election

[Hugo]

Seriously though we in Scotland are desperate for inward migration given our pop demographics and drop in pop of working age.

I'm curious to know what's the position of the SNP on this?

I would imagine a nationalist party not wanting too much inward migration because it would water down their chances of getting elected and water down the national identity of the country.

Good faith question, I genuinely don't know much about Scottish nationalism.

SNP are very much pro EU and very much pro FoM. I think you are mixing up a party like SNP wanting self determination for Scotland with a racist, jingoistic and populist 'nationalist' party like the Tories! Scotland voted heavily for remaining in EU and that also included FoM, we are trying desperately to remain in schemes like Erasmus etc despite the nationalist Tory party taking the UK out of it and if possible would rejoin the EU including FoM, Erasmsus, etc as soon as we can.

Interestingly everyone who lived in Scotland was allowed to vote in the independence referendum run by the SG but foreign/EU nationals were not allowed to vote in the Brexit referendum by the nationalist UK Gov, indeed my mate a UK citizen who lived in Belgium at the time wasn't allowed to vote ... I will leave you to come to your own conclusions.

Everyone who lives in Scotland is by definition Scottish, we don't differentiate. Migrants don't 'water down' national identity at all, they help build and sustain it! I find that 'water down' point you make slightly distasteful tbh.

Thanks but not sure how its distasteful, I'm genuinely curious about exactly what activates Scottish nationalism and its the type of stuff that fascinates me.

Having a common history and religion, shared struggles, a glorious failure, clannish genealogy, mythology and such is the stuff that cultivates and sustains nationalist identity. That and the idea of a foreign entity infringing on the nation. It must be harder to sustain that type of nationalist sentiment when people have no real attachment to it.

[Hugo]

As far as I'm aware the SNP are in favour of immigration, strange as it may seem most immigrants are likely to go native and lean towards independence or at least further Devolution.

Missed this, thanks.

It's an interesting thing to consider, I wonder how much of it is based on political beliefs versus a desire for acceptance or a desire to embrace their new found home?

[Ymx]

Very clumsy. I wonder what sort of demographic it’s aimed at.

Perhaps those not employed/able, who are taking up benefits.

I assume the shortage of jobs in the service industry due to Covid might well be a cause for the “kind” offer.

[Slick]

As far as I'm aware the SNP are in favour of immigration, strange as it may seem most immigrants are likely to go native and lean towards independence or at least further Devolution.

Missed this, thanks.

It's an interesting thing to consider, I wonder how much of it is based on political beliefs versus a desire for acceptance or a desire to embrace their new found home?

I’ve heard it said it’s because a lot of immigrants come from countries that got independence in the not too distant past

[dpedin]

I'm curious to know what's the position of the SNP on this?

I would imagine a nationalist party not wanting too much inward migration because it would water down their chances of getting elected and water down the national identity of the country.

Good faith question, I genuinely don't know much about Scottish nationalism.

SNP are very much pro EU and very much pro FoM. I think you are mixing up a party like SNP wanting self determination for Scotland with a racist, jingoistic and populist 'nationalist' party like the Tories! Scotland voted heavily for remaining in EU and that also included FoM, we are trying desperately to remain in schemes like Erasmus etc despite the nationalist Tory party taking the UK out of it and if possible would rejoin the EU including FoM, Erasmsus, etc as soon as we can.

Interestingly everyone who lived in Scotland was allowed to vote in the independence referendum run by the SG but foreign/EU nationals were not allowed to vote in the Brexit referendum by the nationalist UK Gov, indeed my mate a UK citizen who lived in Belgium at the time wasn't allowed to vote ... I will leave you to come to your own conclusions.

Everyone who lives in Scotland is by definition Scottish, we don't differentiate. Migrants don't 'water down' national identity at all, they help build and sustain it! I find that 'water down' point you make slightly distasteful tbh.

Thanks but not sure how its distasteful, I'm genuinely curious about exactly what activates Scottish nationalism and its the type of stuff that fascinates me.

Having a common history and religion, shared struggles, a glorious failure, clannish genealogy, mythology and such is the stuff that cultivates and sustains nationalist identity. That and the idea of a foreign entity infringing on the nation. It must be harder to sustain that type of nationalist sentiment when people have no real attachment to it.

I suppose I see a difference between national and nationalist, the latter being more akin to the UKIP and the BNP 'little englander' nutters. I don't really think anyone is afraid about sustaining our national sentiment and certainly the majority ( there is always some nutters) don't see immigrants as a threat to our national identify as such. I would also like to think that when folk come and settle in Scotland they become attached to Scotland and what it represents. I suspect that what has fired up the desire for independence in Scotland is being attached to England as it lurches further and further to the right and in the process is shedding the middle ground politics and morals that sustained the UK for many years. The further toward Trumpism that the Blonde Bumblecunt and the Brexit Ultras go then the more Scots become alienated from the concept of the UK.

[dkm57]

Certainly my missus, who I rescued from the east mids of Englandshire, is going more and more native. The local area has a huge population of refugees from Englandshire and they almost all settle in well and become fully part of the community, apart from those who think they can make things work like the shit-holes they came here to escape.

[Lemoentjie]

This is fairly normal. Sweden and Germany offer similar amounts of money.

[Uncle fester]

I'm curious to know what's the position of the SNP on this?

I would imagine a nationalist party not wanting too much inward migration because it would water down their chances of getting elected and water down the national identity of the country.

Good faith question, I genuinely don't know much about Scottish nationalism.

SNP are very much pro EU and very much pro FoM. I think you are mixing up a party like SNP wanting self determination for Scotland with a racist, jingoistic and populist 'nationalist' party like the Tories! Scotland voted heavily for remaining in EU and that also included FoM, we are trying desperately to remain in schemes like Erasmus etc despite the nationalist Tory party taking the UK out of it and if possible would rejoin the EU including FoM, Erasmsus, etc as soon as we can.

Interestingly everyone who lived in Scotland was allowed to vote in the independence referendum run by the SG but foreign/EU nationals were not allowed to vote in the Brexit referendum by the nationalist UK Gov, indeed my mate a UK citizen who lived in Belgium at the time wasn't allowed to vote ... I will leave you to come to your own conclusions.

Everyone who lives in Scotland is by definition Scottish, we don't differentiate. Migrants don't 'water down' national identity at all, they help build and sustain it! I find that 'water down' point you make slightly distasteful tbh.

Thanks but not sure how its distasteful, I'm genuinely curious about exactly what activates Scottish nationalism and its the type of stuff that fascinates me.

Having a common history and religion, shared struggles, a glorious failure, clannish genealogy, mythology and such is the stuff that cultivates and sustains nationalist identity. That and the idea of a foreign entity infringing on the nation. It must be harder to sustain that type of nationalist sentiment when people have no real attachment to it.

Scotland has always been about more than a bunch of Gaels stroking their ginger beards and by & large, they've embraced (non-English) immigration throughout their history.
Part of the reason for this is that they forged links with Europe to try and protect themselves against their large powerful neighbour.
For example when England became insular and inward looking in the Tudor era, Scotland was marrying into the French royal family.

Unfortunately Spain will probably try to block and independent Scotland joining the EU because they don't want a precedent set for Catalonia to follow.

[robmatic]

As far as I'm aware the SNP are in favour of immigration, strange as it may seem most immigrants are likely to go native and lean towards independence or at least further Devolution.

Missed this, thanks.

It's an interesting thing to consider, I wonder how much of it is based on political beliefs versus a desire for acceptance or a desire to embrace their new found home?

I’ve heard it said it’s because a lot of immigrants come from countries that got independence in the not too distant past

Most of the English folk I know who moved to Scotland seem to be in favour of independence as well.

With regards to the SNP being in favour of immigration, the population was declining until recently so it's basically a rational policy. Also, it's quite an easy position to hold politically when immigration levels are low so people don't see it as a threat.

[Tichtheid]

Unfortunately Spain will probably try to block and independent Scotland joining the EU because they don't want a precedent set for Catalonia to follow.

I don't think that is the case anymore. It was said that Cameron and Rajoy had made a deal to block Scotland or Catalonia's membership of the EU, but of course the UK doesn't have a vote in that anymore and Rajoy isn't PM of Spain any longer.

Most of the noises coming out of Spain now are that saying they wouldn't block Scotland's membership. Application to join would have to follow a referendum in Scotland, the current policy of the SNP is to join, but they may not win that vote. I would hope they did.

[Torquemada 1420]

It's amazing how little control and oversight there is across the Party.

They're getting kicked daily for Brexit trade delays + poor Covid response, yet they chuck some full-blown racism on the fire too!
Clownshoes.

What, "60+ years" ago? In a clearly made-up poster? Are you guys normally this bad at checking sources?

Er... if it's fake, the original is worse: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smethwick ... l_election

As you highlight, who gives a f**k if this one is a fake? The essence of the campaign is on record for all to see.

I found the doco: it was Channel 4 in 2015.
“About the slogan, “If you want a n*gger neighbour, vote Labour”.I should think that is a manifestation of the popular feeling. I would not condemn anyone who said that. I would say that is how people see the situation in Smethwick. I fully understand the feelings of the people who say it. I would say it is exasperation, not fascism.” [/Peter Griffiths, Tory candidate]

[Random1]

Missed this, thanks.

It's an interesting thing to consider, I wonder how much of it is based on political beliefs versus a desire for acceptance or a desire to embrace their new found home?

I’ve heard it said it’s because a lot of immigrants come from countries that got independence in the not too distant past

Most of the English folk I know who moved to Scotland seem to be in favour of independence as well.

With regards to the SNP being in favour of immigration, the population was declining until recently so it's basically a rational policy. Also, it's quite an easy position to hold politically when immigration levels are low so people don't see it as a threat.

Localism is always a good idea until the macro comes in. Currency, military, things like vaccines etc.

It’d be a shame to break something that’s survived for 300 odd years, but hey ho, nothing lasts forever.

[charltom]

What, "60+ years" ago? In a clearly made-up poster? Are you guys normally this bad at checking sources?

Er... if it's fake, the original is worse: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smethwick ... l_election

As you highlight, who gives a f**k if this one is a fake? The essence of the campaign is on record for all to see.

I found the doco: it was Channel 4 in 2015.
“About the slogan, “If you want a n*gger neighbour, vote Labour”.I should think that is a manifestation of the popular feeling. I would not condemn anyone who said that. I would say that is how people see the situation in Smethwick. I fully understand the feelings of the people who say it. I would say it is exasperation, not fascism.” [/Peter Griffiths, Tory candidate]

So a Conservative candidate failed to condemn a racist slogan as fascist, 60 years ago (when most people in the country were a little bit racist)? Shocking.

[Random1]

Er... if it's fake, the original is worse: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smethwick ... l_election

As you highlight, who gives a f**k if this one is a fake? The essence of the campaign is on record for all to see.

I found the doco: it was Channel 4 in 2015.
“About the slogan, “If you want a n*gger neighbour, vote Labour”.I should think that is a manifestation of the popular feeling. I would not condemn anyone who said that. I would say that is how people see the situation in Smethwick. I fully understand the feelings of the people who say it. I would say it is exasperation, not fascism.” [/Peter Griffiths, Tory candidate]

So a Conservative candidate failed to condemn a racist slogan as fascist, 60 years ago (when most people in the country were a little bit racist)? Shocking.

It’s one of the things that amuses me about politics today; if you took all the conservatives governments since Cameron, transported them back in time and positioned them on the spectrum, you’d see how far left and liberal the conservatives (and society) has moved.

Yet everyone seems to think we’re in a right wing dominated world. Fucking oblivious.

[I like neeps]

We're not a right wing society anymore because David Cameron, Theresa May, and Boris Johnson don't support workhouses, children in paid work, and having a sprawling empire?

There's an opinion. I guess we're all left wing when compared to feudalist times. Good point, Random1!

[Random1]

We're not a right wing society anymore because David Cameron, Theresa May, and Boris Johnson don't support workhouses, children in paid work, and having a sprawling empire?

There's an opinion. I guess we're all left wing when compared to feudalist times. Good point, Random1!

I’m not saying we’re left wing. I’m saying the centre has moved massively left and towards liberal tendencies over the last few decades.

Which should give people on the left cause for thought (and celebration).

I’m quite happy with that. I’m only a centrist because I like where the centre sits at the minute. Transport me back 50 years and I’d be considered a massive left leaning libtard.

[SaintK]

We're not a right wing society anymore because David Cameron, Theresa May, and Boris Johnson don't support workhouses, children in paid work, and having a sprawling empire?

There's an opinion. I guess we're all left wing when compared to feudalist times. Good point, Random1!

I’m not saying we’re left wing. I’m saying the centre has moved massively left and towards liberal tendencies over the last few decades.

Which should give people on the left cause for thought (and celebration).

I’m quite happy with that. I’m only a centrist because I like where the centre sits at the minute. Transport me back 50 years and I’d be considered a massive left leaning libtard.

Enter Bimbo 3 2 1................................

[charltom]

We're not a right wing society anymore because David Cameron, Theresa May, and Boris Johnson don't support workhouses, children in paid work, and having a sprawling empire?

There's an opinion. I guess we're all left wing when compared to feudalist times. Good point, Random1!

I’m not saying we’re left wing. I’m saying the centre has moved massively left and towards liberal tendencies over the last few decades.

Which should give people on the left cause for thought (and celebration).

I’m quite happy with that. I’m only a centrist because I like where the centre sits at the minute. Transport me back 50 years and I’d be considered a massive left leaning libtard.

I only agree with this in one dimension. We are socially more "left" than 50 years ago (more liberal, with Labour policies). We are also economically more "right" than 50 years ago (more classical liberal, with Conservative - as opposed to conservative - policies).

I don't get why people think in terms of left and right other than that it suits the two big parties. In fact we are more libertarian (social left, economic right) and less authoritarian (although nowhere near enough, at times!). Fascists tend to be the latter.

[Random1]

We're not a right wing society anymore because David Cameron, Theresa May, and Boris Johnson don't support workhouses, children in paid work, and having a sprawling empire?

There's an opinion. I guess we're all left wing when compared to feudalist times. Good point, Random1!

I’m not saying we’re left wing. I’m saying the centre has moved massively left and towards liberal tendencies over the last few decades.

Which should give people on the left cause for thought (and celebration).

I’m quite happy with that. I’m only a centrist because I like where the centre sits at the minute. Transport me back 50 years and I’d be considered a massive left leaning libtard.

I only agree with this in one dimension. We are socially more "left" than 50 years ago (more liberal, with Labour policies). We are also economically more "right" than 50 years ago (more classical liberal, with Conservative - as opposed to conservative - policies).

I don't get why people think in terms of left and right other than that it suits the two big partoes. In fact we are more libertarian (social left, economic right) and less authoritarian (although nowhere near enough, at times!). Fascists tend to be the latter.

I agree that referring to left and right axis's alone is not nuanced enough; that’s why I said left, right and liberal (granted, didn’t mention authoritarian, but not even neeps would argue we’ve gone down that axis)

So, I agree we’ve gone more liberal as opposed to authoritarian

But You genuinely think we’re further right in terms of classic economic right and left compared to 50 years ago?

[I like neeps]

I’m not saying we’re left wing. I’m saying the centre has moved massively left and towards liberal tendencies over the last few decades.

Which should give people on the left cause for thought (and celebration).

I’m quite happy with that. I’m only a centrist because I like where the centre sits at the minute. Transport me back 50 years and I’d be considered a massive left leaning libtard.

I only agree with this in one dimension. We are socially more "left" than 50 years ago (more liberal, with Labour policies). We are also economically more "right" than 50 years ago (more classical liberal, with Conservative - as opposed to conservative - policies).

I don't get why people think in terms of left and right other than that it suits the two big partoes. In fact we are more libertarian (social left, economic right) and less authoritarian (although nowhere near enough, at times!). Fascists tend to be the latter.

I agree that referring to left and right axis's alone is not nuanced enough; that’s why I said left, right and liberal (granted, didn’t mention authoritarian, but not even neeps would argue we’ve gone down that axis)

So, I agree we’ve gone more liberal as opposed to authoritarian

But You genuinely think we’re further right in terms of classic economic right and left compared to 50 years ago?

50 years ago we had stricter capital controls and much much much higher tax rates. Now we have low tax and money/transactions are borderless.

There's good and bad but we're hardly moving left of the economy.

[Hugo]

IMO the left have been on the front foot socially ever since WW2.

I think social conservatives have taken an absolute hiding in the past few generations - church attendance has been in freefall for decades, divorce is socially acceptable, homosexuality is no longer taboo, feminism, women in the workplace so that women are no longer just homemakers.

I'm not saying its either good or bad but over the past 80 years there has been, in my opinion a social revolution and I think conservatism has been mostly on the losing side.

[Torquemada 1420]

So a Conservative candidate failed to condemn a racist slogan as fascist, 60 years ago (when most people in the country were a little bit racist)? Shocking.

You might want to read some history and context before making an arse of yourself.

[charltom]

So a Conservative candidate failed to condemn a racist slogan as fascist, 60 years ago (when most people in the country were a little bit racist)? Shocking.

You might want to read some history and context before making an arse of yourself.

Good try.

It's 2021.