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The more I think about that game, the more I get a bit worried. The intensity and physicality of SA/NZ test matches are fantastic to behold, but a couple of weeks before the start of the RWC it could become a war zone. It's strange too, it's not like we don't have enough of these matches waiting for us on our side of the draw. I mean, Ireland, Scotland and then if we are good enough either NZ/FRA in the 1/4. Hope there are no injuries on either side.Ymx wrote: Mon Jul 10, 2023 1:24 pm NZ v SA game will pretty much be the RC decider.
Although, the replay at Twickers should be a big one!
You forgot boring oom. Be consistent.OomStruisbaai wrote: Mon Jul 10, 2023 1:49 pm The All Blacks are the big favorites. The Springboks will go back to high kick and charge tactics.
Happy with that, in fact that's a bloody good team. Excellent bench as well. Wonder how long Frans and Kitchie will play before being subbedassfly wrote: Tue Jul 11, 2023 7:30 am Springbok team to face New Zealand in Auckland:
15 – Willie le Roux (Vodacom Bulls) – 84 caps, 65 pts (13t)
14 – Cheslin Kolbe (Suntory Sungoliath) – 23 caps, 74pts (11t, 2c, 5p)
13 – Lukhanyo Am (Cell C Sharks) – 32 caps, 30 pts (6t)
12 – Damian de Allende (Panasonic Wild Knights) – 70 Tests, 45pts (9t)
11 – Makazole Mapimpi (Cell C Sharks) – 36 caps, 110pts (22t)
10 – Damian Willemse (DHL Stormers) – 28 caps, 36 pts (2t, 4c, 4p, 2d)
9 – Faf de Klerk (Canon Eagles) – 46 Tests, 41pts (5t, 2c, 4p)
8 – Jasper Wiese (Leicester) – 20 caps, 5pts (1t)
7 – Franco Mostert (Honda Heat) – 63 caps, 15pts (3t)
6 – Kwagga Smith (Blue Revs) – 31 caps, 20pts (4t)
5 – Lood de Jager (Panasonic Wild Knights) – 65 caps, 25pts (5t)
4 – Eben Etzebeth (captain, Cell C Sharks) – 110 caps, 15pts (3t)
3 – Frans Malherbe (DHL Stormers) – 59 caps, 5 pts (1t)
2 – Bongi Mbonambi (Cell C Sharks) – 57 caps, 60 pts (12t)
1 – Steven Kitshoff (Ulster) – 72 caps, 10pts (2t)
Replacements:
16 – Malcolm Marx (Kubota Spears) – 59 caps, 70pts (14t)
17 – Thomas du Toit (Bath) – 16 caps, 0 pts
18 – Vincent Koch (Stade Francais) – 42 caps, 0 pts
19 – RG Snyman (Munster) – 24 caps, 5 pts (1t)
20 – Pieter-Steph du Toit (Toyota Verblitz) – 67 caps, 30 pts (6t)
21 – Duane Vermeulen (SA Rugby) – 66 caps, 15 pts (3t)
22 – Grant Williams (Cell C Sharks) – 2 caps, 0 pts
23 – Manie Libbok (DHL Stormers) – 4 caps, 19 pts (8c, 1p)
Yep, their bomb squad has always been a big advantage to SA.LoveOfTheGame wrote: Tue Jul 11, 2023 7:39 amHappy with that, in fact that's a bloody good team. Excellent bench as well. Wonder how long Frans and Kitchie will play before being subbed
We will do what we always do and fudge someone in to that position when on the highest stage.Gumboot wrote: Tue Jul 11, 2023 6:59 am Probably.
So, now that we have a few damn good right wings, who do we need on the left? Narawa reminds me a lot of Kahui defensively. Just superb anticipation and timing of the tackle, especially on the kick chase. Maybe he could make the switch? Surely replacing Clarke is a priority now?
Yep, they run deep but they're still top heavy. Class from top to bottom.Raggs wrote: Tue Jul 11, 2023 9:06 am In terms of individual personnel, SA have got to be right up there both in terms of 1st XV and depth, to being best in history no? Some seriously good players picking up just a few caps, simply because of the quality above them.
Raggs wrote: Tue Jul 11, 2023 9:06 am In terms of individual personnel, SA have got to be right up there both in terms of 1st XV and depth, to being best in history no? Some seriously good players picking up just a few caps, simply because of the quality above them.
I suspect they have to put this one to bed. Willemse hasnt exactly cemented any spot with much higher quality ahead of him in all positions....one would feel that this is make or break for him. And the multipurpose Jack of all trades position.boere wors wrote: Tue Jul 11, 2023 9:16 am Good team, great bench
I still think Libbok should start at 10 and Willemse to the bench as 10, 12, 15 backup
Will be a good contest on Saturday, that bok team should be hard to beat
In terms of team, I agree, in terms of individuals, it's a lot closer. And even then, Carter/Ritche I don't think had quite the same depth (though it was good).Tichtheid wrote: Tue Jul 11, 2023 9:17 amRaggs wrote: Tue Jul 11, 2023 9:06 am In terms of individual personnel, SA have got to be right up there both in terms of 1st XV and depth, to being best in history no? Some seriously good players picking up just a few caps, simply because of the quality above them.
In terms of the team, I still think the ABs of peak Carter and Ruchie are the best. Maybe this Springbok vintage will better them, though
Yep, they're odds on to repeat, I reckon. Remember how fancied England were in 2019, only to get spanked.Tichtheid wrote: Tue Jul 11, 2023 9:17 amRaggs wrote: Tue Jul 11, 2023 9:06 am In terms of individual personnel, SA have got to be right up there both in terms of 1st XV and depth, to being best in history no? Some seriously good players picking up just a few caps, simply because of the quality above them.
In terms of the team, I still think the ABs of peak Carter and Ruchie are the best. Maybe this Springbok vintage will better them, though
Herschel jantjies still gets dragged around to every match and tournament yet he is still way down the pecking order...wasting the place of a potential player. WTF would we need 5 scrumhalvesLoveOfTheGame wrote: Tue Jul 11, 2023 7:39 amHappy with that, in fact that's a bloody good team. Excellent bench as well. Wonder how long Frans and Kitchie will play before being subbedassfly wrote: Tue Jul 11, 2023 7:30 am Springbok team to face New Zealand in Auckland:
15 – Willie le Roux (Vodacom Bulls) – 84 caps, 65 pts (13t)
14 – Cheslin Kolbe (Suntory Sungoliath) – 23 caps, 74pts (11t, 2c, 5p)
13 – Lukhanyo Am (Cell C Sharks) – 32 caps, 30 pts (6t)
12 – Damian de Allende (Panasonic Wild Knights) – 70 Tests, 45pts (9t)
11 – Makazole Mapimpi (Cell C Sharks) – 36 caps, 110pts (22t)
10 – Damian Willemse (DHL Stormers) – 28 caps, 36 pts (2t, 4c, 4p, 2d)
9 – Faf de Klerk (Canon Eagles) – 46 Tests, 41pts (5t, 2c, 4p)
8 – Jasper Wiese (Leicester) – 20 caps, 5pts (1t)
7 – Franco Mostert (Honda Heat) – 63 caps, 15pts (3t)
6 – Kwagga Smith (Blue Revs) – 31 caps, 20pts (4t)
5 – Lood de Jager (Panasonic Wild Knights) – 65 caps, 25pts (5t)
4 – Eben Etzebeth (captain, Cell C Sharks) – 110 caps, 15pts (3t)
3 – Frans Malherbe (DHL Stormers) – 59 caps, 5 pts (1t)
2 – Bongi Mbonambi (Cell C Sharks) – 57 caps, 60 pts (12t)
1 – Steven Kitshoff (Ulster) – 72 caps, 10pts (2t)
Replacements:
16 – Malcolm Marx (Kubota Spears) – 59 caps, 70pts (14t)
17 – Thomas du Toit (Bath) – 16 caps, 0 pts
18 – Vincent Koch (Stade Francais) – 42 caps, 0 pts
19 – RG Snyman (Munster) – 24 caps, 5 pts (1t)
20 – Pieter-Steph du Toit (Toyota Verblitz) – 67 caps, 30 pts (6t)
21 – Duane Vermeulen (SA Rugby) – 66 caps, 15 pts (3t)
22 – Grant Williams (Cell C Sharks) – 2 caps, 0 pts
23 – Manie Libbok (DHL Stormers) – 4 caps, 19 pts (8c, 1p)
We didn't have the depth unfortunately. Losing Sinckler in the first minute, to then have a less than vintage Dan Cole play near enough 80, was never going to work. He shouldn't have been doing 20 at the end at that time (he's looking much better again now though). The two late tries made that game look a lot worse, and it's where our depth let us down. And refusing to sub Ben Youngs....Gumboot wrote: Tue Jul 11, 2023 9:20 amYep, they're odds on to repeat, I reckon. Remember how fancied England were in 2019, only to get spanked.Tichtheid wrote: Tue Jul 11, 2023 9:17 amRaggs wrote: Tue Jul 11, 2023 9:06 am In terms of individual personnel, SA have got to be right up there both in terms of 1st XV and depth, to being best in history no? Some seriously good players picking up just a few caps, simply because of the quality above them.
In terms of the team, I still think the ABs of peak Carter and Ruchie are the best. Maybe this Springbok vintage will better them, though
100%boere wors wrote: Tue Jul 11, 2023 9:16 am Good team, great bench
I still think Libbok should start at 10 and Willemse to the bench as 10, 12, 15 backup
Will be a good contest on Saturday, that bok team should be hard to beat
True that, their second half performance in the 2019 final was as good as it gets.Tichtheid wrote: Tue Jul 11, 2023 9:25 am I think many people don't give the South African backs enough credit, even after the World Cup in 2019 the talk was about the bomb squad and the starting pack, but the backline was sensational.
The fact he isn't even on the bench is telling. I think he's the first 9 to get dropped.Sards wrote: Tue Jul 11, 2023 9:26 am Herschel jantjies still gets dragged around to every match and tournament yet he is still way down the pecking order...wasting the place of a potential player. WTF would we need 5 scrumhalves
It is almost tragical how he never regained his 2019 form. He was really good that year. Played as a rookie in a RWC final... all downhill from then onassfly wrote: Tue Jul 11, 2023 9:42 amThe fact he isn't even on the bench is telling. I think he's the first 9 to get dropped.Sards wrote: Tue Jul 11, 2023 9:26 am Herschel jantjies still gets dragged around to every match and tournament yet he is still way down the pecking order...wasting the place of a potential player. WTF would we need 5 scrumhalves
Ah come on man, let us feel a bit bullish after our trashing of a hapless Wallabies team last weekendGrandpa wrote: Tue Jul 11, 2023 9:44 am Can't believe the talking up of this Bok team... The worst All Black side of the past 20 years has a 50% record against them since the World Cup.
What has this team done? Seriously? Apart from one excellent game v England in 2019... I've seen nothing that takes them beyond average. Foster's All Blacks have won the last two Rugby Championships... that's all you need to know. If SA were undefeated since 2019 then that's a different discussion... this Bok side has been no better than Foster's rag tag mob...
What a lot of nonsense posts.
. I think we feel that our team is on a good path to finding form for the RWC after some rather mixed years lately.OK, well their World Cup record suggests they rise to the occasion...Grandpa wrote: Tue Jul 11, 2023 9:44 am Can't believe the talking up of this Bok team... The worst All Black side of the past 20 years has a 50% record against them since the World Cup.
What has this team done? Seriously? Apart from one excellent game v England in 2019... I've seen nothing that takes them beyond average. Foster's All Blacks have won the last two Rugby Championships... that's all you need to know. If SA were undefeated since 2019 then that's a different discussion... this Bok side has been no better than Foster's rag tag mob...
What a lot of nonsense posts.
So what? They're a good cup team... or lucky in the case of the last world cup.Gumboot wrote: Tue Jul 11, 2023 9:52 amOK, well their World Cup record suggests they rise to the occasion...Grandpa wrote: Tue Jul 11, 2023 9:44 am Can't believe the talking up of this Bok team... The worst All Black side of the past 20 years has a 50% record against them since the World Cup.
What has this team done? Seriously? Apart from one excellent game v England in 2019... I've seen nothing that takes them beyond average. Foster's All Blacks have won the last two Rugby Championships... that's all you need to know. If SA were undefeated since 2019 then that's a different discussion... this Bok side has been no better than Foster's rag tag mob...
What a lot of nonsense posts.
I don't mind optimism... it's outlandish hubris that annoys me... a bit like the 2003 England team that is severely over rated.boere wors wrote: Tue Jul 11, 2023 9:52 amAh come on man, let us feel a bit bullish after our trashing of a hapless Wallabies team last weekendGrandpa wrote: Tue Jul 11, 2023 9:44 am Can't believe the talking up of this Bok team... The worst All Black side of the past 20 years has a 50% record against them since the World Cup.
What has this team done? Seriously? Apart from one excellent game v England in 2019... I've seen nothing that takes them beyond average. Foster's All Blacks have won the last two Rugby Championships... that's all you need to know. If SA were undefeated since 2019 then that's a different discussion... this Bok side has been no better than Foster's rag tag mob...
What a lot of nonsense posts.
OK now I'm getting a tingle in my junkGrandpa wrote: Tue Jul 11, 2023 9:56 am
So what? They're a good cup team... or lucky in the case of the last world cup.
Ask your under 15 side.OomStruisbaai wrote: Tue Jul 11, 2023 9:59 am Can't believe Marx isn't starting? Bongi has been kak.
That's unfair. The one thing Australia did well was put our lineout under pressure, and bar one or two throws he was excellent.OomStruisbaai wrote: Tue Jul 11, 2023 9:59 am Can't believe Marx isn't starting? Bongi has been kak.
Who knows what this lot is capable of, they really haven't been tested in years,Grandpa wrote: Tue Jul 11, 2023 9:56 amSo what? They're a good cup team... or lucky in the case of the last world cup.Gumboot wrote: Tue Jul 11, 2023 9:52 amOK, well their World Cup record suggests they rise to the occasion...Grandpa wrote: Tue Jul 11, 2023 9:44 am Can't believe the talking up of this Bok team... The worst All Black side of the past 20 years has a 50% record against them since the World Cup.
What has this team done? Seriously? Apart from one excellent game v England in 2019... I've seen nothing that takes them beyond average. Foster's All Blacks have won the last two Rugby Championships... that's all you need to know. If SA were undefeated since 2019 then that's a different discussion... this Bok side has been no better than Foster's rag tag mob...
What a lot of nonsense posts.
The boks of 2007/8 vintage were class. This lot are not in the same ball park...
This weekendGumboot wrote: Tue Jul 11, 2023 10:11 amWho knows what this lot is capable of, they really haven't been tested in years,Grandpa wrote: Tue Jul 11, 2023 9:56 amSo what? They're a good cup team... or lucky in the case of the last world cup.Gumboot wrote: Tue Jul 11, 2023 9:52 am
OK, well their World Cup record suggests they rise to the occasion...
The boks of 2007/8 vintage were class. This lot are not in the same ball park...
Remember we had a rookie in the lineout.assfly wrote: Tue Jul 11, 2023 10:10 amThat's unfair. The one thing Australia did well was put our lineout under pressure, and bar one or two throws he was excellent.OomStruisbaai wrote: Tue Jul 11, 2023 9:59 am Can't believe Marx isn't starting? Bongi has been kak.
His support play was outstanding, seen in his try assist for KLA.
Can't fucking wait.Sards wrote: Tue Jul 11, 2023 10:12 amThis weekendGumboot wrote: Tue Jul 11, 2023 10:11 amWho knows what this lot is capable of, they really haven't been tested in years,Grandpa wrote: Tue Jul 11, 2023 9:56 am
So what? They're a good cup team... or lucky in the case of the last world cup.
The boks of 2007/8 vintage were class. This lot are not in the same ball park...