NPR

Snooze wrote: Wed Aug 30, 2023 8:02 pm Yip, I'll be watching. And may be moving to the Med before the main event. In which case I'll be there with bells on.

Grandpa wrote: Wed Aug 30, 2023 8:54 pm Should be in NZ... don't seem right...

Grandpa wrote: Wed Aug 30, 2023 8:54 pm Should be in NZ... don't seem right...

Ymx wrote: Wed Aug 30, 2023 7:47 pm Hello?

Anyone?

shaggy wrote: Sun Sep 03, 2023 9:18 am Totally miss the displacement hull racing with the proper windward duals. I grew up match racing dinghies and then yachts so despite watching all the most recents with hydrofoil craft it still feels like a very poor relative.

Ymx wrote: Sun Sep 03, 2023 12:08 pm

shaggy wrote: Sun Sep 03, 2023 9:18 am Totally miss the displacement hull racing with the proper windward duals. I grew up match racing dinghies and then yachts so despite watching all the most recents with hydrofoil craft it still feels like a very poor relative.

I loved the old Cup with hugely puffed out spinnakers. And the race to switch in and out of them. That was cool

But I’ve made my peace with it now. It’s not as bad as the cats.

Grandpa wrote: Sun Sep 03, 2023 2:11 pm

Ymx wrote: Sun Sep 03, 2023 12:08 pm

shaggy wrote: Sun Sep 03, 2023 9:18 am Totally miss the displacement hull racing with the proper windward duals. I grew up match racing dinghies and then yachts so despite watching all the most recents with hydrofoil craft it still feels like a very poor relative.

I loved the old Cup with hugely puffed out spinnakers. And the race to switch in and out of them. That was cool

But I’ve made my peace with it now. It’s not as bad as the cats.

What's your favourite America's Cup? I think 1987 was mine... the first one I watched properly... I was gripped!

Ymx wrote: Sun Sep 03, 2023 12:08 pm

shaggy wrote: Sun Sep 03, 2023 9:18 am Totally miss the displacement hull racing with the proper windward duals. I grew up match racing dinghies and then yachts so despite watching all the most recents with hydrofoil craft it still feels like a very poor relative.

I loved the old Cup with hugely puffed out spinnakers. And the race to switch in and out of them. That was cool

But I’ve made my peace with it now. It’s not as bad as the cats.

Ymx wrote: Sun Sep 03, 2023 2:24 pm

Grandpa wrote: Sun Sep 03, 2023 2:11 pm

Ymx wrote: Sun Sep 03, 2023 12:08 pm

I loved the old Cup with hugely puffed out spinnakers. And the race to switch in and out of them. That was cool

But I’ve made my peace with it now. It’s not as bad as the cats.

What's your favourite America's Cup? I think 1987 was mine... the first one I watched properly... I was gripped!

Yep, exactly that one. I think.

I even had the Commodore 64 game. On cassette tape. Had to wheel the joystick handle around to change sails.

Those were the days !

Ymx wrote: Sun Sep 03, 2023 2:29 pm

Grandpa wrote: Sun Sep 03, 2023 2:11 pm

Ymx wrote: Sun Sep 03, 2023 12:08 pm

shaggy wrote: Sun Sep 03, 2023 9:18 am Totally miss the displacement hull racing with the proper windward duals. I grew up match racing dinghies and then yachts so despite watching all the most recents with hydrofoil craft it still feels like a very poor relative.

I loved the old Cup with hugely puffed out spinnakers. And the race to switch in and out of them. That was cool

But I’ve made my peace with it now. It’s not as bad as the cats.

What's your favourite America's Cup? I think 1987 was mine... the first one I watched properly... I was gripped!

Guy Smiley wrote: Wed Sep 06, 2023 11:16 am

Grandpa wrote: Sun Sep 03, 2023 2:11 pm

Ymx wrote: Sun Sep 03, 2023 12:08 pm

I loved the old Cup with hugely puffed out spinnakers. And the race to switch in and out of them. That was cool

But I’ve made my peace with it now. It’s not as bad as the cats.

What's your favourite America's Cup? I think 1987 was mine... the first one I watched properly... I was gripped!

I was sharing a house in Sydney at the time and the landlady went over for the Cup in Fremantle, chasing a 6'6" Californian sculptor she'd fallen for. She spent the summer there basically, then came back with him in tow. Their stories and photos of WA and the Regatta fascinated me and a few years later I moved over and ended up spending 28 years living in Freo.

The locals were still talking about the Cup 3 years later when I arrived. Easily my favourite Cup, it gave me 30 years of belonging somewhere

Grandpa wrote: Wed Sep 06, 2023 12:23 pm What made you leave... after almost three decades of belonging?

Guy Smiley wrote: Wed Sep 06, 2023 10:26 pm

Grandpa wrote: Wed Sep 06, 2023 12:23 pm What made you leave... after almost three decades of belonging?

I returned to NZ in 1990 with a gf in tow, looking to work a ski season and travel on somewhere from there. Worst time to come home as the recession bit hard and soup queues formed in some towns. It was brutal and a lack of family support left me with a sour taste in my mouth. We headed to Melbourne at first after 6 months struggling in NZ and ended up driving across the dirt to WA... 4 weeks or so camping in the desert, we'd spent 3 weeks working in Sydney, took a mate of mine from there back through Melbourne, Great Ocean Road through Adelaide, the Flinders' Ranges, Coober Pedy, Alice where we dropped him off to hitch on the Qld before heading out past Uluru and Kata Tjuta for the dirt highway to Kalgoorlie. That trip actually had a profound effect on my pysche... the experience of being out on that huge landscape, moving across while being still within changed me or the way I was thinking back then. I resettled into Freo and decided I probably wouldn't live in NZ again. I became an Australian citizen later that year, sworn in by the Mayor of Fremantle... didn't go home again for over 11 years when I shot back for my sister's 40th. Profound change had swept the country and Canterbury had become a dairy farm. Family ties aside, I didn't feel a connection outside of nostalgia tugging at my shoelaces. Skip forward 15 years or so and the frailty of aging parents became a factor... first Dad died a sad death after suffering stroke induced dementia that stole him slowly from all of us and then mum had a return of cancer...

I had injured my shoulders at work and was on workers' compensation, the Oz version of ACCC. I'd had one operation and was working in the town office on light duties. The nature of those claims in Oz is adverserial, it's managed through commercial insurance partners and essentially it's a hostile 'care' environment. I had months worth of personal leave available and took a couple of weeks to visit Mum who was booked for an operation and would need some care at home afterwards. The day I arrived we had an oncologist's appointment where he told her (us) that the cancer was inoperable. Basically, I returned to WA and asked if I could take extended leave to offer Mum home care for as long as we could managed it. I spent almost 3 months nursing her across a wet spring, walking everyday while she napped. The magic of NZ in springtime worked me over and with a hostile work situation unfolding, a closing of doors if you like going on, I ended up wondering why the fuck I'd stayed away so long. After Mum died and I endured the acrimonious delaying tactics of reaching a financial settlement, I came home... via Nepal and one more trip to altitude.

Now that I've been back here for almost 5 years I find myself wondering if I could live in Freo again at times. I could... it's a great town and a second home. NZ is in many ways, a disappointment. Politics, economy, that sort of thing... but I work with a bunch of really good people who display the genuine warmth and values we think are common Kiwi traits. It's really cool to be around.

Grandpa wrote: Wed Sep 06, 2023 10:59 pm

Guy Smiley wrote: Wed Sep 06, 2023 10:26 pm

Grandpa wrote: Wed Sep 06, 2023 12:23 pm What made you leave... after almost three decades of belonging?

I returned to NZ in 1990 with a gf in tow, looking to work a ski season and travel on somewhere from there. Worst time to come home as the recession bit hard and soup queues formed in some towns. It was brutal and a lack of family support left me with a sour taste in my mouth. We headed to Melbourne at first after 6 months struggling in NZ and ended up driving across the dirt to WA... 4 weeks or so camping in the desert, we'd spent 3 weeks working in Sydney, took a mate of mine from there back through Melbourne, Great Ocean Road through Adelaide, the Flinders' Ranges, Coober Pedy, Alice where we dropped him off to hitch on the Qld before heading out past Uluru and Kata Tjuta for the dirt highway to Kalgoorlie. That trip actually had a profound effect on my pysche... the experience of being out on that huge landscape, moving across while being still within changed me or the way I was thinking back then. I resettled into Freo and decided I probably wouldn't live in NZ again. I became an Australian citizen later that year, sworn in by the Mayor of Fremantle... didn't go home again for over 11 years when I shot back for my sister's 40th. Profound change had swept the country and Canterbury had become a dairy farm. Family ties aside, I didn't feel a connection outside of nostalgia tugging at my shoelaces. Skip forward 15 years or so and the frailty of aging parents became a factor... first Dad died a sad death after suffering stroke induced dementia that stole him slowly from all of us and then mum had a return of cancer...

I had injured my shoulders at work and was on workers' compensation, the Oz version of ACCC. I'd had one operation and was working in the town office on light duties. The nature of those claims in Oz is adverserial, it's managed through commercial insurance partners and essentially it's a hostile 'care' environment. I had months worth of personal leave available and took a couple of weeks to visit Mum who was booked for an operation and would need some care at home afterwards. The day I arrived we had an oncologist's appointment where he told her (us) that the cancer was inoperable. Basically, I returned to WA and asked if I could take extended leave to offer Mum home care for as long as we could managed it. I spent almost 3 months nursing her across a wet spring, walking everyday while she napped. The magic of NZ in springtime worked me over and with a hostile work situation unfolding, a closing of doors if you like going on, I ended up wondering why the fuck I'd stayed away so long. After Mum died and I endured the acrimonious delaying tactics of reaching a financial settlement, I came home... via Nepal and one more trip to altitude.

Now that I've been back here for almost 5 years I find myself wondering if I could live in Freo again at times. I could... it's a great town and a second home. NZ is in many ways, a disappointment. Politics, economy, that sort of thing... but I work with a bunch of really good people who display the genuine warmth and values we think are common Kiwi traits. It's really cool to be around.

Great post. I can relate to a lot of it. I've been away from NZ for over 30 years... yet the pull of NZ is always here. Unlike you I brought my elderly parents to me, rather than going to them. Now they are no longer in NZ I wonder if the place will still feel like "home" when I next go back... I love the Bay of Plenty... I'm envious you live there.

Snooze wrote: Thu Sep 07, 2023 3:24 pm

Grandpa wrote: Wed Sep 06, 2023 10:59 pm

Guy Smiley wrote: Wed Sep 06, 2023 10:26 pm

I returned to NZ in 1990 with a gf in tow, looking to work a ski season and travel on somewhere from there. Worst time to come home as the recession bit hard and soup queues formed in some towns. It was brutal and a lack of family support left me with a sour taste in my mouth. We headed to Melbourne at first after 6 months struggling in NZ and ended up driving across the dirt to WA... 4 weeks or so camping in the desert, we'd spent 3 weeks working in Sydney, took a mate of mine from there back through Melbourne, Great Ocean Road through Adelaide, the Flinders' Ranges, Coober Pedy, Alice where we dropped him off to hitch on the Qld before heading out past Uluru and Kata Tjuta for the dirt highway to Kalgoorlie. That trip actually had a profound effect on my pysche... the experience of being out on that huge landscape, moving across while being still within changed me or the way I was thinking back then. I resettled into Freo and decided I probably wouldn't live in NZ again. I became an Australian citizen later that year, sworn in by the Mayor of Fremantle... didn't go home again for over 11 years when I shot back for my sister's 40th. Profound change had swept the country and Canterbury had become a dairy farm. Family ties aside, I didn't feel a connection outside of nostalgia tugging at my shoelaces. Skip forward 15 years or so and the frailty of aging parents became a factor... first Dad died a sad death after suffering stroke induced dementia that stole him slowly from all of us and then mum had a return of cancer...

I had injured my shoulders at work and was on workers' compensation, the Oz version of ACCC. I'd had one operation and was working in the town office on light duties. The nature of those claims in Oz is adverserial, it's managed through commercial insurance partners and essentially it's a hostile 'care' environment. I had months worth of personal leave available and took a couple of weeks to visit Mum who was booked for an operation and would need some care at home afterwards. The day I arrived we had an oncologist's appointment where he told her (us) that the cancer was inoperable. Basically, I returned to WA and asked if I could take extended leave to offer Mum home care for as long as we could managed it. I spent almost 3 months nursing her across a wet spring, walking everyday while she napped. The magic of NZ in springtime worked me over and with a hostile work situation unfolding, a closing of doors if you like going on, I ended up wondering why the fuck I'd stayed away so long. After Mum died and I endured the acrimonious delaying tactics of reaching a financial settlement, I came home... via Nepal and one more trip to altitude.

Now that I've been back here for almost 5 years I find myself wondering if I could live in Freo again at times. I could... it's a great town and a second home. NZ is in many ways, a disappointment. Politics, economy, that sort of thing... but I work with a bunch of really good people who display the genuine warmth and values we think are common Kiwi traits. It's really cool to be around.

Great post. I can relate to a lot of it. I've been away from NZ for over 30 years... yet the pull of NZ is always here. Unlike you I brought my elderly parents to me, rather than going to them. Now they are no longer in NZ I wonder if the place will still feel like "home" when I next go back... I love the Bay of Plenty... I'm envious you live there.

Similar story here. Told Mum I'd be back in 18 months (work visa to England). That was 1990. Would love to go back to live, but cost of living and Irish wife won't hear of it. 1 kid in NZ doing Masters. 1 kid soon to be in Amsterdam doing Masters/PhD. What do I do??? Portugal most likely for retirement in the sun. Luckily our CDN house has good value and paid off, so can wind down 'relatively' (can someone define that) comfortably.

Guy Smiley wrote: Thu Sep 07, 2023 6:40 pm I spent 4 1/2 years in Sydney when I first left. After a while there and having met a lot of fellow expat Kiwis along with a host of people from all over the world, I formed the view that there were two types of Kiwis you'd meet living overseas. There are those who move but don't actually leave, especially in the eastern states of Australia... all the talk is of 'home' and flights back several times a year are normal. Then, there's those who really fucking Leave. We stay away for years, if not forever. The world has become a lot smaller and more crowded since i formed that view but essentially, I think it still stands. Poor economic policy and populist governments are only going to compel more to leave too... and the world being what it is now with opportunities all over the show, many won't be back. Good luck to them... and all of us.

ps Gramps... the Bay is a nice place to be but like most of the country, it's been spoiled. Poor planning, basically. Tauranga is a shitfight for traffic, outer suburbs are being 'developed' like mad with no real infrastructure to match and the region is awash with cheap labour and rich farmers. Oh, and roadworks.

Ymx wrote: Thu Sep 07, 2023 4:46 pm Jeez, you lot make me feel fresh off the boat.

Been in UK since 99.

My mates who came out here with me returned to NZ and some to Aus.

Ironically two of them who moved back to NZ have now just gone to Aus and one back here. Bloody economic migrants.

Grandpa wrote: Thu Sep 07, 2023 7:58 pm

Snooze wrote: Thu Sep 07, 2023 3:24 pm

Similar story here. Told Mum I'd be back in 18 months (work visa to England). That was 1990. Would love to go back to live, but cost of living and Irish wife won't hear of it. 1 kid in NZ doing Masters. 1 kid soon to be in Amsterdam doing Masters/PhD. What do I do??? Portugal most likely for retirement in the sun. Luckily our CDN house has good value and paid off, so can wind down 'relatively' (can someone define that) comfortably.

Was beginning to think you were one of my best mates! Three of us Kiwis toured Europe in 1990... and the other two went to Canada and married Canadians... and one lives near Vancouver! But he has no kids...

I love Vancouver... why would you want to leave? I think I'll end up living in NZ at some point... if I ever leave the UK. I think the weather here will bother me more and more as I age...

Snooze wrote: Thu Sep 07, 2023 8:20 pm

Grandpa wrote: Thu Sep 07, 2023 7:58 pm

Snooze wrote: Thu Sep 07, 2023 3:24 pm

Similar story here. Told Mum I'd be back in 18 months (work visa to England). That was 1990. Would love to go back to live, but cost of living and Irish wife won't hear of it. 1 kid in NZ doing Masters. 1 kid soon to be in Amsterdam doing Masters/PhD. What do I do??? Portugal most likely for retirement in the sun. Luckily our CDN house has good value and paid off, so can wind down 'relatively' (can someone define that) comfortably.

Was beginning to think you were one of my best mates! Three of us Kiwis toured Europe in 1990... and the other two went to Canada and married Canadians... and one lives near Vancouver! But he has no kids...

I love Vancouver... why would you want to leave? I think I'll end up living in NZ at some point... if I ever leave the UK. I think the weather here will bother me more and more as I age...

I like it here, and it was a really good place to bring the kids up, but we're leaving for a few reasons.
1. Its too expensive to retire here comfortably. We've never been great savers, and having to do trips half way round the world all the time didn't help that.
2. My dislike for the winters now (they're not bad by eastern Canada standards but still very cold for me). It was OK when were bringing kids up and having family ski days, but now . . .
3. Kids have moved on and who knows where they'll end up (NZ and Holland/Italy)
4. My Mrs wants to be closer to home (Limerick) and her brother lives in Portugal

Grandpa wrote: Thu Sep 07, 2023 8:22 pm

Snooze wrote: Thu Sep 07, 2023 8:20 pm

Grandpa wrote: Thu Sep 07, 2023 7:58 pm

Was beginning to think you were one of my best mates! Three of us Kiwis toured Europe in 1990... and the other two went to Canada and married Canadians... and one lives near Vancouver! But he has no kids...

I love Vancouver... why would you want to leave? I think I'll end up living in NZ at some point... if I ever leave the UK. I think the weather here will bother me more and more as I age...

I like it here, and it was a really good place to bring the kids up, but we're leaving for a few reasons.
1. Its too expensive to retire here comfortably. We've never been great savers, and having to do trips half way round the world all the time didn't help that.
2. My dislike for the winters now (they're not bad by eastern Canada standards but still very cold for me). It was OK when were bringing kids up and having family ski days, but now . . .
3. Kids have moved on and who knows where they'll end up (NZ and Holland/Italy)
4. My Mrs wants to be closer to home (Limerick) and her brother lives in Portugal

Think I'd prefer Vancouver weather to Limerick's... so Portugal it is!

Is NZ still home for you? Or not any more?

Grandpa wrote: Thu Sep 07, 2023 8:02 pm

Ymx wrote: Thu Sep 07, 2023 4:46 pm Jeez, you lot make me feel fresh off the boat.

Been in UK since 99.

My mates who came out here with me returned to NZ and some to Aus.

Ironically two of them who moved back to NZ have now just gone to Aus and one back here. Bloody economic migrants.

1999 I was living in Cambridgeshire back then... great times...

Snooze wrote: Thu Sep 07, 2023 9:57 pm

Grandpa wrote: Thu Sep 07, 2023 8:22 pm

Snooze wrote: Thu Sep 07, 2023 8:20 pm

I like it here, and it was a really good place to bring the kids up, but we're leaving for a few reasons.
1. Its too expensive to retire here comfortably. We've never been great savers, and having to do trips half way round the world all the time didn't help that.
2. My dislike for the winters now (they're not bad by eastern Canada standards but still very cold for me). It was OK when were bringing kids up and having family ski days, but now . . .
3. Kids have moved on and who knows where they'll end up (NZ and Holland/Italy)
4. My Mrs wants to be closer to home (Limerick) and her brother lives in Portugal

Think I'd prefer Vancouver weather to Limerick's... so Portugal it is!

Is NZ still home for you? Or not any more?

Good question. I want to say Yes, and I will never surrender my passport. But the maths make it hard for me to believe it myself any more. Was 27 when I left (late traveler), been here since '95 so been here longer. It sucks but it is what it is. Went home twice in quick succession (for me - May '22 and March '23), and loved it. That's not withstanding GS's comments. Not living there means I can block my ears to that shit (for the most part).

Guy Smiley wrote: Thu Sep 07, 2023 10:18 pm I've suspended my subscription to Bernard Hickey's excellent The Kaka

https://thekaka.substack.com/

as I've been through a bit of a grind lately and stopped reading because I found his sharp take on reality a bit too depressing. He describes NZ's economy as a housing market with bits tacked on. That's essentially it... we don't invest in 'hard' options like R&D, we don't diversify in our agriculture at any sort of scale, we rely on capital gains in the housing market to prop up the national sense of complacency and backslappery about being the 'best in the world' at whatever...

we continue to pollute and contaminate our freshwater sources, the idea that curbing greenhouse emissions is preposterous and something 'little old NZ' shouldn't have to worry about because China and the US, etc... decent public transport is the sort of thing you go to Melbourne for.

Stay where you are. NZ is a nostalgia trip but under the postcard surface, she's a bit cooked bro.

Ymx wrote: Fri Sep 08, 2023 6:59 am

Grandpa wrote: Thu Sep 07, 2023 8:02 pm

Ymx wrote: Thu Sep 07, 2023 4:46 pm Jeez, you lot make me feel fresh off the boat.

Been in UK since 99.

My mates who came out here with me returned to NZ and some to Aus.

Ironically two of them who moved back to NZ have now just gone to Aus and one back here. Bloody economic migrants.

1999 I was living in Cambridgeshire back then... great times...

One of my good kiwi mates moved to Cambridge in 98/99 was working for a mobile communications company, building software stack - elec engineering. I would have been there too had I landed a job at the place.

Instead, I moved to London.

Grandpa wrote: Fri Sep 08, 2023 11:01 am

Snooze wrote: Thu Sep 07, 2023 9:57 pm

Grandpa wrote: Thu Sep 07, 2023 8:22 pm

Think I'd prefer Vancouver weather to Limerick's... so Portugal it is!

Is NZ still home for you? Or not any more?

Good question. I want to say Yes, and I will never surrender my passport. But the maths make it hard for me to believe it myself any more. Was 27 when I left (late traveler), been here since '95 so been here longer. It sucks but it is what it is. Went home twice in quick succession (for me - May '22 and March '23), and loved it. That's not withstanding GS's comments. Not living there means I can block my ears to that shit (for the most part).

I wonder too if NZ would have the same fairy tale feel to it that it did for holidays since 1990... returning "home" as like returning to Walton's Mountain... mum, dad and the country home... even in winter NZ felt nice... July and it's 19 degrees in the afternoon... that's a great Yorkshire summer's day!

But would living there remove that idyllic feeling? Do I appreciate it more because I don't live there? Maybe I'll just take long holidays there instead... and keep the vibe... especially as my parents are no longer there...