NPR

Posted: **Mon Sep 04, 2023 7:40 pm**

Worth its own thread

Posted: **Tue Sep 05, 2023 7:10 am**

Argentina by 12.

Posted: **Tue Sep 05, 2023 1:11 pm**

Tricky one to call - both sides are prone to dropping their sh*t and shipping 30 or 40 points.

Reckon that Argentina will win it by 4 or 5 - providing they don't lose a player to a card/s.

Posted: **Tue Sep 05, 2023 2:19 pm**

As Farrell isn't playing, Lavanini must be favourite for this game's red card moment of madness

Posted: **Tue Sep 05, 2023 2:30 pm**

I'm really looking forward to this game and suspect it could be really close. It will be fascinating to see if England stick with their existing game plan or decide they need play more expansively to win a key match for them. If they spend all their time playing one out rugby and kicking to the Argies back 3 then they could regret it.I cant see England getting much change out of the Argies pack. If they play Smith at 10 and open up a little then we could see some tries for both sides. The Argies are not a bad side and if they play fast running rugby as they are capable of then England might be exposed. Both sides struggle with getting tackle height right so there might be a few cards and I suspect both sides will be right up for the game. My bet is Genge for first yellow/red card.

Posted: **Tue Sep 05, 2023 2:54 pm**

Have a feeling it will be decided by cards.

Posted: **Tue Sep 05, 2023 2:57 pm**

England by 9

Posted: **Tue Sep 05, 2023 3:10 pm**

Argentina will run this one a lot and scores tries. England will get left behind.
Argies by 16

Posted: **Tue Sep 05, 2023 3:13 pm**

dpedin wrote: Tue Sep 05, 2023 2:30 pm I'm really looking forward to this game and suspect it could be really close. It will be fascinating to see if England stick with their existing game plan or decide they need play more expansively to win a key match for them. If they spend all their time playing one out rugby and kicking to the Argies back 3 then they could regret it.I cant see England getting much change out of the Argies pack. If they play Smith at 10 and open up a little then we could see some tries for both sides. The Argies are not a bad side and if they play fast running rugby as they are capable of then England might be exposed. Both sides struggle with getting tackle height right so there might be a few cards and I suspect both sides will be right up for the game. My bet is Genge for first yellow/red card.

It would be insane if they did suddenly decide after playing one way to try something completely different that requires everyone to be on the same wavelength. They're going to double down on the approach. It's all about the "competitive animal" now. We're going to try and arm wrestle everyone to death, and hope that we're in with a shout towards the end of matches where some stardust might actually win a game.

Posted: **Tue Sep 05, 2023 5:17 pm**

I'm at a wedding, which I was somewhat peeved about when it was announced, but will actually serve to save me from succumbing to poor judgement and watch England spack around the pitch for another couple of hours.

dpedin wrote: Tue Sep 05, 2023 2:30 pm I'm really looking forward to this game and suspect it could be really close. It will be fascinating to see if England stick with their existing game plan or decide they need play more expansively to win a key match for them. If they spend all their time playing one out rugby and kicking to the Argies back 3 then they could regret it.I cant see England getting much change out of the Argies pack. If they play Smith at 10 and open up a little then we could see some tries for both sides. The Argies are not a bad side and if they play fast running rugby as they are capable of then England might be exposed. Both sides struggle with getting tackle height right so there might be a few cards and I suspect both sides will be right up for the game. My bet is Genge for first yellow/red card.

Someone must be I suppose. If Borthwick starts Smith at 10 for any reason other than Ford getting injured, I'll eat a wardrobe. He's about as anti-Borthball as a player gets.

Posted: **Tue Sep 05, 2023 6:37 pm**

Borthwick could have Antoin Dupont and 2005 vintage Dan Carter as his halfbacks and it would make zero difference to how he coached England to play.

Posted: **Tue Sep 05, 2023 6:58 pm**

https://comb.io/J7NHjB

Posted: **Tue Sep 05, 2023 7:21 pm**

Paddington Bear wrote: Tue Sep 05, 2023 6:58 pm https://comb.io/J7NHjB

You’re just dropping a mysterious and dodgy looking link with no explanation??

Posted: **Tue Sep 05, 2023 7:56 pm**

SaintK wrote: Tue Sep 05, 2023 2:57 pmEngland by 9

Yep, picking England for this one.

With all the criticism and expectations so low they're down with the bog people something has to give.

Posted: **Tue Sep 05, 2023 8:43 pm**

Argies by 10

Posted: **Tue Sep 05, 2023 9:34 pm**

England to win by a late catch and unopposed drive try, after being so shit and boring that everyone in the stadium (including the opposition) and watching worldwide has either fallen asleep or bleached their own eyeballs to escape it.

Posted: **Wed Sep 06, 2023 9:16 am**

sockwithaticket wrote: Tue Sep 05, 2023 5:17 pm I'm at a wedding, which I was somewhat peeved about when it was announced, but will actually serve to save me from succumbing to poor judgement and watch England spack around the pitch for another couple of hours.

dpedin wrote: Tue Sep 05, 2023 2:30 pm I'm really looking forward to this game and suspect it could be really close. It will be fascinating to see if England stick with their existing game plan or decide they need play more expansively to win a key match for them. If they spend all their time playing one out rugby and kicking to the Argies back 3 then they could regret it.I cant see England getting much change out of the Argies pack. If they play Smith at 10 and open up a little then we could see some tries for both sides. The Argies are not a bad side and if they play fast running rugby as they are capable of then England might be exposed. Both sides struggle with getting tackle height right so there might be a few cards and I suspect both sides will be right up for the game. My bet is Genge for first yellow/red card.
Someone must be I suppose. If Borthwick starts Smith at 10 for any reason other than Ford getting injured, I'll eat a wardrobe. He's about as anti-Borthball as a player gets.

Of course he's looking forward to it; its another opportunity for him to post more of his tedious 'England are shit' posts in the the English Rugby thread

Posted: **Wed Sep 06, 2023 9:22 am**

Lobby wrote: Wed Sep 06, 2023 9:16 am
sockwithaticket wrote: Tue Sep 05, 2023 5:17 pm I'm at a wedding, which I was somewhat peeved about when it was announced, but will actually serve to save me from succumbing to poor judgement and watch England spack around the pitch for another couple of hours.

dpedin wrote: Tue Sep 05, 2023 2:30 pm I'm really looking forward to this game and suspect it could be really close. It will be fascinating to see if England stick with their existing game plan or decide they need play more expansively to win a key match for them. If they spend all their time playing one out rugby and kicking to the Argies back 3 then they could regret it.I cant see England getting much change out of the Argies pack. If they play Smith at 10 and open up a little then we could see some tries for both sides. The Argies are not a bad side and if they play fast running rugby as they are capable of then England might be exposed. Both sides struggle with getting tackle height right so there might be a few cards and I suspect both sides will be right up for the game. My bet is Genge for first yellow/red card.
Someone must be I suppose. If Borthwick starts Smith at 10 for any reason other than Ford getting injured, I'll eat a wardrobe. He's about as anti-Borthball as a player gets.
Of course he's looking forward to it; its another opportunity for him to post more of his tedious 'England are shit' posts in the the English Rugby thread

Which he can do regardless of the result, of course

Posted: **Wed Sep 06, 2023 9:45 am**

Paddington Bear wrote: Wed Sep 06, 2023 9:22 am
Lobby wrote: Wed Sep 06, 2023 9:16 am
sockwithaticket wrote: Tue Sep 05, 2023 5:17 pm I'm at a wedding, which I was somewhat peeved about when it was announced, but will actually serve to save me from succumbing to poor judgement and watch England spack around the pitch for another couple of hours.

Someone must be I suppose. If Borthwick starts Smith at 10 for any reason other than Ford getting injured, I'll eat a wardrobe. He's about as anti-Borthball as a player gets.
Of course he's looking forward to it; its another opportunity for him to post more of his tedious 'England are shit' posts in the the English Rugby thread
Which he can do regardless of the result, of course

It's not much fun anymore now that everyone has joined in!

Posted: **Wed Sep 06, 2023 10:04 am**

I'll be in the pub in south Edinburgh watching this one - expecting a fair few gleeful jibes and not a great deal of exciting rugby.

Posted: **Wed Sep 06, 2023 11:45 am**

Torygraph reporting Smith is seen as a full back sub by the England management. No word on whether this is a Brexit Bonus or the fault of Harry and Megan.

I mean, a player who has exclusively played at fly half all his career and has little experience in fielding high balls and defensive positioning as the last line. What could possibly go wrong?

Posted: **Wed Sep 06, 2023 11:52 am**

Times going with this as the starting 15.

Mitchell, May and Cole the headline calls.

Probable England XV vs Argentina F Steward; J May, J Marchant, M Tuilagi, E Daly; G Ford, A Mitchell; E Genge, J George, D Cole, M Itoje, O Chessum, C Lawes, T Curry, B Earl.

Posted: **Wed Sep 06, 2023 12:15 pm**

Hands up anyone who thinks Tuilagi has earned his spot ahead of Lawrence. Anyone? Bueller?

Glad to see Mitchell & Marchant in there. Worried about Curry's lack of fitness. Is that Earl at 8 or 7? Cole starting, jesus christ. May better have a better defensive day than last time, ditto Steward who's been flogged to death so far.

Posted: **Wed Sep 06, 2023 12:24 pm**

Mitchell over Youngs to start is a massively surprising, but very positive call.

Question now is can be secure those rucks quickly enough. We can go with a simple game plan, plenty of kicking options, and potentially not be embarassed.

Posted: **Wed Sep 06, 2023 12:27 pm**

Raggs wrote: Wed Sep 06, 2023 12:24 pm Mitchell over Youngs to start is a massively surprising, but very positive call.

Question now is can be secure those rucks quickly enough. We can go with a simple game plan, plenty of kicking options, and potentially not be embarassed.

Mitchell being there just means we will be kicking the ball away more quickly.

Posted: **Wed Sep 06, 2023 12:28 pm**

JM2K6 wrote: Wed Sep 06, 2023 12:15 pm Hands up anyone who thinks Tuilagi has earned his spot ahead of Lawrence. Anyone? Bueller?

Glad to see Mitchell & Marchant in there. Worried about Curry's lack of fitness. Is that Earl at 8 or 7? Cole starting, jesus christ. May better have a better defensive day than last time, ditto Steward who's been flogged to death so far.

Play well in centres, get dropped for Tuilagi until he's injured again. That seems to be the lot of an English centre - I suppose at least now they can't be shunted out to shoehorn Farrell and Ford into the same XV.

Posted: **Wed Sep 06, 2023 12:28 pm**

Still, I know there's a huge amount of negativity but it's a World Cup and I'm getting excited.

Posted: **Wed Sep 06, 2023 12:41 pm**

The fact that Cole is still an option is a sad indictment of a nation that used to have tight five players falling out of our ears.

But Sinckler has fallen off a cliff, form wise, and Stuart is a back up at best.

Posted: **Wed Sep 06, 2023 1:10 pm**

inactionman wrote: Wed Sep 06, 2023 12:28 pm Still, I know there's a huge amount of negativity but it's a World Cup and I'm getting excited.

I'm excited for the tournament, just not our part in it. Of all the tournaments I've watched, I think only Japan rivalled the French in '07 for the extent to which they embraced the whole thing with a carnival atmosphere and really effusive support for the minnow nations.

Posted: **Wed Sep 06, 2023 1:11 pm**

Hal Jordan wrote: Wed Sep 06, 2023 12:41 pm The fact that Cole is still an option is a sad indictment of a nation that used to have tight five players falling out of our ears.

But Sinckler has fallen off a cliff, form wise, and Stuart is a back up at best.

Most of our problem positions don't lack a large number of England qualified players. It's just that very few of them look capable of competing at the thick end of the Heineken Cup, let alone international rugby.

Posted: **Wed Sep 06, 2023 1:18 pm**

sockwithaticket wrote: Wed Sep 06, 2023 1:10 pm
inactionman wrote: Wed Sep 06, 2023 12:28 pm Still, I know there's a huge amount of negativity but it's a World Cup and I'm getting excited.
I'm excited for the tournament, just not our part in it. Of all the tournaments I've watched, I think only Japan rivalled the French in '07 for the extent to which they embraced the whole thing with a carnival atmosphere and really effusive support for the minnow nations.

I've blocked out the Japan WC from memory, I was in Japan and had tickets for England's opening game up in Sapporo but had to fly home as my mum was dying - lost her a few weeks later. Just desperate, dreadful associations in my head, even the NZ game is tainted.

I say this not to be a miseryguts but to highlight that, no matter how woeful England are, from a personal perspective this year's WC is going to be an order of scale better than the last one.

Posted: **Wed Sep 06, 2023 1:22 pm**

inactionman wrote: Wed Sep 06, 2023 1:18 pm
sockwithaticket wrote: Wed Sep 06, 2023 1:10 pm
inactionman wrote: Wed Sep 06, 2023 12:28 pm Still, I know there's a huge amount of negativity but it's a World Cup and I'm getting excited.
I'm excited for the tournament, just not our part in it. Of all the tournaments I've watched, I think only Japan rivalled the French in '07 for the extent to which they embraced the whole thing with a carnival atmosphere and really effusive support for the minnow nations.
I've blocked out the Japan WC from memory, I was in Japan and had tickets for England's opening game up in Sapporo but had to fly home as my mum was dying - lost her a few weeks later. Just desperate, dreadful associations in my head, even the NZ game is tainted.

I say this not to be a miseryguts but to highlight that, no matter how woeful England are, from a personal perspective this year's WC is going to be an order of scale better than the last one.

Jesus Christ man. You are making it very hard to taunt you now ??!!!

Posted: **Wed Sep 06, 2023 1:54 pm**

sockwithaticket wrote: Wed Sep 06, 2023 1:10 pm
inactionman wrote: Wed Sep 06, 2023 12:28 pm Still, I know there's a huge amount of negativity but it's a World Cup and I'm getting excited.
I'm excited for the tournament, just not our part in it. Of all the tournaments I've watched, I think only Japan rivalled the French in '07 for the extent to which they embraced the whole thing with a carnival atmosphere and really effusive support for the minnow nations.

As much as It Never Happened, we were very good hosts all things considered in 2015.

Agree on the excitement. I’m expecting nothing so anything we do is a bonus, and the competitiveness will be up a notch on previous editions

Posted: **Wed Sep 06, 2023 1:59 pm**

inactionman wrote: Wed Sep 06, 2023 1:18 pm
sockwithaticket wrote: Wed Sep 06, 2023 1:10 pm
inactionman wrote: Wed Sep 06, 2023 12:28 pm Still, I know there's a huge amount of negativity but it's a World Cup and I'm getting excited.
I'm excited for the tournament, just not our part in it. Of all the tournaments I've watched, I think only Japan rivalled the French in '07 for the extent to which they embraced the whole thing with a carnival atmosphere and really effusive support for the minnow nations.
I've blocked out the Japan WC from memory, I was in Japan and had tickets for England's opening game up in Sapporo but had to fly home as my mum was dying - lost her a few weeks later. Just desperate, dreadful associations in my head, even the NZ game is tainted.

I say this not to be a miseryguts but to highlight that, no matter how woeful England are, from a personal perspective this year's WC is going to be an order of scale better than the last one.

Understandable. A belated sorry for your loss, hopefully this tournament gives you a double dose of enjoyment.

Posted: **Wed Sep 06, 2023 2:02 pm**

Paddington Bear wrote: Wed Sep 06, 2023 1:54 pm
sockwithaticket wrote: Wed Sep 06, 2023 1:10 pm
inactionman wrote: Wed Sep 06, 2023 12:28 pm Still, I know there's a huge amount of negativity but it's a World Cup and I'm getting excited.
I'm excited for the tournament, just not our part in it. Of all the tournaments I've watched, I think only Japan rivalled the French in '07 for the extent to which they embraced the whole thing with a carnival atmosphere and really effusive support for the minnow nations.
As much as It Never Happened, we were very good hosts all things considered in 2015.

Agree on the excitement. I’m expecting nothing so anything we do is a bonus, and the competitiveness will be up a notch on previous editions

I don't think any of the other tournaments have been bad, it's just that France and Japan as hosts were better.

As much as a packed Kingsholm cheering on minnows was good, French rugby fans are a different breed than English with all their singing and the stadium bands plus there were generally more of them in bigger, better venues (municipally funded stadia for the win).

Posted: **Wed Sep 06, 2023 2:18 pm**

Margin__Walker wrote: Wed Sep 06, 2023 11:52 am Times going with this as the starting 15.

Mitchell, May and Cole the headline calls.

Probable England XV vs Argentina F Steward; J May, J Marchant, M Tuilagi, E Daly; G Ford, A Mitchell; E Genge, J George, D Cole, M Itoje, O Chessum, C Lawes, T Curry, B Earl.

Just been reading that they predict Care on the bench too!

Posted: **Wed Sep 06, 2023 2:56 pm**

Resting Big Gun Youngs until the quarter finals when we need our undisputed no 1 veteran to lead us to glory.

Posted: **Wed Sep 06, 2023 3:15 pm**

inactionman wrote: Wed Sep 06, 2023 12:28 pm
JM2K6 wrote: Wed Sep 06, 2023 12:15 pm Hands up anyone who thinks Tuilagi has earned his spot ahead of Lawrence. Anyone? Bueller?

Glad to see Mitchell & Marchant in there. Worried about Curry's lack of fitness. Is that Earl at 8 or 7? Cole starting, jesus christ. May better have a better defensive day than last time, ditto Steward who's been flogged to death so far.
Play well in centres, get dropped for Tuilagi until he's injured again. That seems to be the lot of an English centre - I suppose at least now they can't be shunted out to shoehorn Farrell and Ford into the same XV.

Once farrell is back you know they will likely put Farrell at 12 move Tuilagi out to 13 and ditch Marchant.

Posted: **Wed Sep 06, 2023 6:20 pm**

Paddington Bear wrote: Wed Sep 06, 2023 1:54 pm
sockwithaticket wrote: Wed Sep 06, 2023 1:10 pm
inactionman wrote: Wed Sep 06, 2023 12:28 pm Still, I know there's a huge amount of negativity but it's a World Cup and I'm getting excited.
I'm excited for the tournament, just not our part in it. Of all the tournaments I've watched, I think only Japan rivalled the French in '07 for the extent to which they embraced the whole thing with a carnival atmosphere and really effusive support for the minnow nations.
As much as It Never Happened, we were very good hosts all things considered in 2015.

Agree on the excitement. I’m expecting nothing so anything we do is a bonus, and the competitiveness will be up a notch on previous editions

Yes, I agree. My favourite WC memory is being in a pub with my dad after a game at Twickenham and each countries supporters taking it in turns to sing a song, magical rugby moment

Posted: **Wed Sep 06, 2023 9:46 pm**

sockwithaticket wrote: Wed Sep 06, 2023 2:02 pm
Paddington Bear wrote: Wed Sep 06, 2023 1:54 pm
sockwithaticket wrote: Wed Sep 06, 2023 1:10 pm

I'm excited for the tournament, just not our part in it. Of all the tournaments I've watched, I think only Japan rivalled the French in '07 for the extent to which they embraced the whole thing with a carnival atmosphere and really effusive support for the minnow nations.
As much as It Never Happened, we were very good hosts all things considered in 2015.

Agree on the excitement. I’m expecting nothing so anything we do is a bonus, and the competitiveness will be up a notch on previous editions
I don't think any of the other tournaments have been bad, it's just that France and Japan as hosts were better.

SA in ‘95 was awesome. The whole country got behind the Boks and at the same time welcomed fans and teams from everywhere. Except Australia; wankers.

NPR

RWCR1 England vs Argentina

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