NPR

How on earth did she end up here?

Uncle fester wrote: Sat Mar 16, 2024 8:10 pm How on earth did she end up here?

Foolishly got involved in the TERF/Trans culture wars, went looking for allies and really got lost down the rabbit hole, I believe.

I have little experience of trannies, so hopefully that thread is not representative of them. If it is, then they have mental problems way beyond wanting to cut of their dicks.

Hal Jordan wrote: Sat Mar 16, 2024 10:43 pm

Uncle fester wrote: Sat Mar 16, 2024 8:10 pm How on earth did she end up here?

Foolishly got involved in the TERF/Trans culture wars, went looking for allies and really got lost down the rabbit hole, I believe.

Calculon is JK Rowling and I claim my autographed copies of all the Harry Potter books.

Deny the reality of women having penises and you may as well be a Nazi, it seems.

I'm confused. Is there an abridged version of JK's indiscretions with respect to holocaust denial and nazi ideology?

Kinda wish I didn’t go down that Twitter rabbit hole but apparently there’s a lot of Nazi stuff in the Harry Potter books, including disgusting antisemitism. Also, a lot of people only started reading the books because they agree with JK Rowlings Nazi views. She is, literally, a full on Holocaust denier and a Nazi terrorist, and would be locked up in Germany for her Holocaust denialism. So people should encourage her to travel to Germany

Margin__Walker wrote: Sun Mar 17, 2024 9:17 am I'm confused. Is there an abridged version of JK's indiscretions with respect to holocaust denial and nazi ideology?

Better for your mental health that you don't go there.

Uncle fester wrote: Sat Mar 16, 2024 8:10 pm How on earth did she end up here?

Because she is incapable of admitting she might have been wrong. Under criticism, she invariably doubles down, whatever the issue. On this one, she has dug herself a huge hole and keeps on digging rather than look for a way to climb out.

Yr Alban wrote: Mon Mar 18, 2024 6:00 pm

Uncle fester wrote: Sat Mar 16, 2024 8:10 pm How on earth did she end up here?

Because she is incapable of admitting she might have been wrong. Under criticism, she invariably doubles down, whatever the issue. On this one, she has dug herself a huge hole and keeps on digging rather than look for a way to climb out.

Yep. Symptom of the modern age, this refusal to accept you might have made a mistake, so double down and get into more polarised positions.

I like her, she seems eminently sensible to me

Rhubarb & Custard wrote: Tue Mar 19, 2024 9:10 am she seems eminently sensible to me

Said no husband ever.

Margin__Walker wrote: Sun Mar 17, 2024 9:17 am I'm confused. Is there an abridged version of JK's indiscretions with respect to holocaust denial and nazi ideology?

She didn't seem to believe that the Nazi's destroyed large amounts of medical texts to do with trans people, targeting them. Regardless of your position on the trans debate, the idea that they weren't targeted as part of the holocaust is wrong.

From what I can tell, she's not saying that the holocaust plain didn't happen, but that there wasn't a large amount of medical knowledge destroyed.

Were trans people targeted as part of the Holocaust?I thought a German court specifically came to the judgement that they weren't. Also it seems no one actually knows what books were burnt that particular night, but they weren't burned because some might have contained some very questionable "research" on what we would now call transsexuals. I fail to see this as some big gotcha for JK Rowling.

Also what exactly is the nazi ideology around gender? Did they even have one, and is JK wrong in disputing that she's desperate to uphold this ideology.

Seems that transvestites were actually protected by law in Nazi Germany.
https://de.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transvestitenschein

So as long as you weren't trying to bum other men the Nazi authorities didn't care if you dressed and acted like a woman in public.

Calculon wrote: Tue Mar 19, 2024 12:25 pm Were trans people targeted as part of the Holocaust?I thought a German court specifically came to the judgement that they weren't. Also it seems no one actually knows what books were burnt that particular night, but they weren't burned because some might have contained some very questionable "research" on what we would now call transsexuals. I fail to see this as some big gotcha for JK Rowling.

Also what exactly is the nazi ideology around gender? Did they even have one, and is JK wrong in disputing that she's desperate to uphold this ideology.

I mean the German government says they were: https://edition.cnn.com/2023/01/27/euro ... index.html

The court said, from what I could understand, that the person who was accused of holocaust denial was not denying that trans people were targeted, but rather than it shouldn't be used in certain ways. Skirting the edge of freedom of speech vs holocaust denial stuff, basically freedom of speech was considered the right option. They didn't say trans weren't targeted with that judgement.

The police used to be able to grant permits to trans people, so they could be allowed to cross dress etc and change their name. The Nazi's shut down the sexual institute that was led by someone who supported transgender people, and revoked the certificates for most people, so I'd say they had a stance on gender.

https://www.smithsonianmag.com/history/ ... 180982931/

Raggs wrote: Tue Mar 19, 2024 12:44 pm

Calculon wrote: Tue Mar 19, 2024 12:25 pm Were trans people targeted as part of the Holocaust?I thought a German court specifically came to the judgement that they weren't. Also it seems no one actually knows what books were burnt that particular night, but they weren't burned because some might have contained some very questionable "research" on what we would now call transsexuals. I fail to see this as some big gotcha for JK Rowling.

Also what exactly is the nazi ideology around gender? Did they even have one, and is JK wrong in disputing that she's desperate to uphold this ideology.

I mean the German government says they were: https://edition.cnn.com/2023/01/27/euro ... index.html

The court said, from what I could understand, that the person who was accused of holocaust denial was not denying that trans people were targeted, but rather than it shouldn't be used in certain ways. Skirting the edge of freedom of speech vs holocaust denial stuff, basically freedom of speech was considered the right option. They didn't say trans weren't targeted with that judgement.

The police used to be able to grant permits to trans people, so they could be allowed to cross dress etc and change their name. The Nazi's shut down the sexual institute that was led by someone who supported transgender people, and revoked the certificates for most people, so I'd say they had a stance on gender.

https://www.smithsonianmag.com/history/ ... 180982931/

It's not something I'm going to spend much time looking into but it seems they didn't revoke the certificates of most people and the people cited by the "queer academic" were not revoked because of being transexual (in fact some were not) but for unrelated reasons.



According to this the Nazis still issued certificate of transvestits to allow them to be unmolested by the police

https://de.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transvestitenschein

Hardly indicative of being targeted.

Also despite what the queer academic states it doesn't seem transvestitism = transexual. He seems to use transgended and transvestitism interchangable when it seems pretty clear that that how the Nazs understood the term transvestitism is quite different to how we understand the meaning, transgender person. Nazis obviously targeted many non conformist, gays, Jews etc but specifically transexuals? Maybe they did, but if so how many were murdered by the Nazis for being transexual rather than for the myriad of other reasons that the Nazis could come up with

I mean you could easily enough compile a list of thousands of people murdered by the Nazis specifically for being Jewish, or gay, or communist, or speaking out against them. For being transexual, 1 person?