NPR

Video at the top of this link

https://www.stuff.co.nz/world-news/3605 ... hington-dc

60 passengers and 4 crew - 3 crew on the Blackhawk.

The collision looks bad and I'll eat my hat if there is a survivor

If the explosion and the fall doesn't kill them then the water will be close to freezing.

Marine 1? Pity.

Kawazaki wrote: Thu Jan 30, 2025 7:37 am If the explosion and the fall doesn't kill them then the water will be close to freezing.

Great for mental health though

I don't understand what a training flight was doing dicking around in the landing path of a major airport.

Years ago there was a US crash where the plane ended up in a freezing river - most people died , but there was footage of a lady in the river who not only had suffered the crash , but was blinded temporarily because of the spilt aviation fuel in the water. This bystander or cop or whoever who had absolute balls of steel dived in and nabbed her just before she drowned and saved her , was one of the first truly heroic things I ever saw on telly.

Being killed in a crash is bad enough, but crashing and then drowning or freezing to death before you get rescued - sheesh

Yeeb wrote: Thu Jan 30, 2025 9:09 am Being killed in a crash is bad enough, but crashing and then drowning or freezing to death before you get rescued - sheesh

Try surviving, but the plane crashes in the Everglades, and some of the survivors were finished off by alligators, that happened some years ago.

robmatic wrote: Thu Jan 30, 2025 8:46 am I don't understand what a training flight was doing dicking around in the landing path of a major airport.

Read this Reddit thread for a possible explanation from a chopper pilot from DCA - v interesting.

Guess who dissolved the civilian aviation safety board and froze the hiring of air traffic controllers during his first 48 hours in power?

Hal Jordan wrote: Thu Jan 30, 2025 1:09 pm Guess who dissolved the civilian aviation safety board and froze the hiring of air traffic controllers during his first 48 hours in power?

I’m picking that it will be blamed on Hunter Biden. POTUS has already posted about it, after he had been officially briefed.

“The airplane was on a perfect and routine line of approach to the airport. The helicopter was going straight at the airplane for an extended period of time. It is a CLEAR NIGHT, the lights on the plane were blazing, why didn’t the helicopter go up or down, or turn. Why didn’t the control tower tell the helicopter what to do instead of asking if they saw the plane.”

“This is a bad situation that looks like it should have been prevented. NOT GOOD!!!”

Yeeb wrote: Thu Jan 30, 2025 9:09 am Years ago there was a US crash where the plane ended up in a freezing river - most people died , but there was footage of a lady in the river who not only had suffered the crash , but was blinded temporarily because of the spilt aviation fuel in the water. This bystander or cop or whoever who had absolute balls of steel dived in and nabbed her just before she drowned and saved her , was one of the first truly heroic things I ever saw on telly.

Being killed in a crash is bad enough, but crashing and then drowning or freezing to death before you get rescued - sheesh

It was one of the Aircraft Accident Investigation episodes. IIRC there were 2 survivors but the other didn't make it.

Enzedder wrote: Thu Jan 30, 2025 4:25 am Video at the top of this link

https://www.stuff.co.nz/world-news/3605 ... hington-dc

60 passengers and 4 crew - 3 crew on the Blackhawk.

The collision looks bad and I'll eat my hat if there is a survivor

Not a chance of anyone surviving that.

Maybe the beeb needed to think about this headline:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cn9370dny5xo

Torquemada 1420 wrote: Thu Jan 30, 2025 3:04 pm Maybe the beeb needed to think about this headline:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cn9370dny5xo

Thought they would be able to handle icy conditions ..

Good grief - Trump, in. his address to the nation about the collision, is now blaming Obama and Biden for the plane crash! Now blaming the DEI policies of the previous Govs suggesting they had appointed folk with learning disabilities into Air Traffic Controller jobs. The man is fecking evil and mad!

dpedin wrote: Thu Jan 30, 2025 4:30 pm Good grief - Trump, in. his address to the nation about the collision, is now blaming Obama and Biden for the plane crash! Now blaming the DEI policies of the previous Govs suggesting they had appointed folk with learning disabilities into Air Traffic Controller jobs. The man is fecking evil and mad!

Good god he is now trying to explain what happened to cause the accident! He is suggesting 'we had a pilot problem', the 'helicopter turned the wrong way' apparently, despite having 'great vision'! Please someone take the feckin mic away from him before he causes more problems for investigators and all the families involved. He now claims he is using 'plain common sense' to determine what happened! FFS STOP HIM PLEASE!!!

dpedin wrote: Thu Jan 30, 2025 4:37 pm

dpedin wrote: Thu Jan 30, 2025 4:30 pm Good grief - Trump, in. his address to the nation about the collision, is now blaming Obama and Biden for the plane crash! Now blaming the DEI policies of the previous Govs suggesting they had appointed folk with learning disabilities into Air Traffic Controller jobs. The man is fecking evil and mad!

Good god he is now trying to explain what happened to cause the accident! He is suggesting 'we had a pilot problem', the 'helicopter turned the wrong way' apparently, despite having 'great vision'! Please someone take the feckin mic away from him before he causes more problems for investigators and all the families involved. He now claims he is using 'plain common sense' to determine what happened! FFS STOP HIM PLEASE!!!

I cannot believe what I just listened to! Trump has gone completely loco, absolutely disgusting address and it will cause untold problems to the investigation, the families of those involved, to the organizations involved and to every non white or disabled person. BBC R5 had to apologise to their listeners for covering the presentation and quickly change tack to another subject - listeners were texting to show their utter disgust with Trump and his comments.

Was he trying to insinuate people with some kind of disability had been appointed to ATC or pilot ?
From what you say , he seems to have had a pretty terrible public response , funny if not so wtaf

Of course , if it does prove that somebody who ticked a certain box got over-promoted and caused this crash, he will be all I told you so.

Sharp as a tack, that Donald.

The helicopter was in the wrong place at the wrong time and a tragedy occurred

<slow handclap>

dpedin wrote: Thu Jan 30, 2025 4:46 pm

dpedin wrote: Thu Jan 30, 2025 4:37 pm

dpedin wrote: Thu Jan 30, 2025 4:30 pm Good grief - Trump, in. his address to the nation about the collision, is now blaming Obama and Biden for the plane crash! Now blaming the DEI policies of the previous Govs suggesting they had appointed folk with learning disabilities into Air Traffic Controller jobs. The man is fecking evil and mad!

Good god he is now trying to explain what happened to cause the accident! He is suggesting 'we had a pilot problem', the 'helicopter turned the wrong way' apparently, despite having 'great vision'! Please someone take the feckin mic away from him before he causes more problems for investigators and all the families involved. He now claims he is using 'plain common sense' to determine what happened! FFS STOP HIM PLEASE!!!

I cannot believe what I just listened to! Trump has gone completely loco, absolutely disgusting address and it will cause untold problems to the investigation, the families of those involved, to the organizations involved and to every non white or disabled person. BBC R5 had to apologise to their listeners for covering the presentation and quickly change tack to another subject - listeners were texting to show their utter disgust with Trump and his comments.

There's no point being outraged about it. He's a senile old dude who is basically incapable of being statesman-like at this stage.

Yeeb wrote: Thu Jan 30, 2025 5:10 pm Was he trying to insinuate people with some kind of disability had been appointed to ATC or pilot ?
From what you say , he seems to have had a pretty terrible public response , funny if not so wtaf

Of course , if it does prove that somebody who ticked a certain box got over-promoted and caused this crash, he will be all I told you so.

Problem is now Trump has spoken then there will be pressure on the investigation team and others to make sure they dont find anything that makes him look stupid, or more stupid! Remember the tornado and the sharpie on the map episode? He has already put pressure on the whole investigation and thrown real aspertions at the ATC folk that they aren't competent to do their job because they are all DEI hires, as he put it. He has also suggested the helicopter pilot was at fault as he could have gone up, down, left or right to avoid the airliner ... obviously based on his extensive experience of ATC or being a pilot. He has interfered with a live investigation and basically tried to say 'it's not my fault - it's his fault, Obama and Biden over there' even before the bodies have been recovered and the names released. He is a despicable human being and the worse thing is his acolytes will now be working feverishly to try and protect his shit covered, diaper wearing, big fat arse over this!!!

I think the suggestion is that the helicopter pilot and ATC thought that he had a visual on the aircraft but may have actually had a visual on a different plane further to the south.

Just to confirm Dpedin..

A future episode of Air Crash Investigations / Mayday is going to be interesting with NTSB personnel talking about the moronic President's complication of the incident.

You couldn't make this shit up!

Marylandolorian wrote: Thu Jan 30, 2025 10:59 pm I learn a new word today , thanks UK friends
Cockwomble (noun) A person, usually male, prone to making outrageously stupid statements and/or inappropriate behavior while generally having a very high opinion of their own wisdom and importance.

A good friend of mine (school mate and work colleague from the 60s) does not suffer fools and she has called him the Orange Cockwomble since his first election. I absolutely love it.

Pardon my ignorance, but couldn't the military find somewhere a bit safer for their training flights than the vicinity of a busy capital city airport?

Gumboot wrote: Fri Jan 31, 2025 2:27 am Pardon my ignorance, but couldn't the military find somewhere a bit safer for their training flights than the vicinity of a busy capital city airport?

I wonder if anyone knows how long they have been carrying out training flights in this area without any accidents having occurred.

Gumboot wrote: Fri Jan 31, 2025 2:27 am Pardon my ignorance, but couldn't the military find somewhere a bit safer for their training flights than the vicinity of a busy capital city airport?

I ask the same thing of learner drivers down the main road at rush hour, but I suppose they've got to practice it sometime.

TB63 wrote: Thu Jan 30, 2025 11:24 pm You couldn't make this shit up!

Fuçking hell, culture wars central.
Pmsl

Gumboot wrote: Fri Jan 31, 2025 2:27 am Pardon my ignorance, but couldn't the military find somewhere a bit safer for their training flights than the vicinity of a busy capital city airport?

I don't think it was a training flight? Wasn't it a proficiency flight i.e. periodically everyone has to be independently checked to make sure still up to spec? Civvies do most of this in sims these days.

Torquemada 1420 wrote: Fri Jan 31, 2025 9:43 am

Gumboot wrote: Fri Jan 31, 2025 2:27 am Pardon my ignorance, but couldn't the military find somewhere a bit safer for their training flights than the vicinity of a busy capital city airport?

I don't think it was a training flight? Wasn't it a proficiency flight i.e. periodically everyone has to be independently checked to make sure still up to spec? Civvies do most of this in sims these days.

There’s about a billion acres of America where you can check a pilot is certified to fly a helicopter that’s nowhere near a civilian airport. Either DCA airport (which is small and only exists because politicians and civil servants have just a 15 min drive to Capital Hill) should be shutdown or the military airfields should be moved.

Having them side by side and the two types of air traffic using different frequencies is dangerously foolish.

C69 wrote: Fri Jan 31, 2025 8:47 am

TB63 wrote: Thu Jan 30, 2025 11:24 pm You couldn't make this shit up!

Fuçking hell, culture wars central.
Pmsl

George Orwell, 1984:

'The party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command.'

TB63 wrote: Thu Jan 30, 2025 11:24 pm You couldn't make this shit up!

And why do you only have an Acting head of FAA? And what happened to the air safety committee not long ago? And why have a load of ATCs chosen to retire? And why, in an industry that was already understaffed, has there been an employment freeze?

I don't know if anyone from this tower retired due to Trumps offer, but if they were understaffed (and there's suggestions there was a single ATC covering things) and someone had retired, I know where the blame lies.

Sandstorm wrote: Fri Jan 31, 2025 9:57 am

Torquemada 1420 wrote: Fri Jan 31, 2025 9:43 am

Gumboot wrote: Fri Jan 31, 2025 2:27 am Pardon my ignorance, but couldn't the military find somewhere a bit safer for their training flights than the vicinity of a busy capital city airport?

I don't think it was a training flight? Wasn't it a proficiency flight i.e. periodically everyone has to be independently checked to make sure still up to spec? Civvies do most of this in sims these days.

There’s about a billion acres of America where you can check a pilot is certified to fly a helicopter that’s nowhere near a civilian airport. Either DCA airport (which is small and only exists because politicians and civil servants have just a 15 min drive to Capital Hill) should be shutdown or the military airfields should be moved.

Having them side by side and the two types of air traffic using different frequencies is dangerously foolish.

Not disagreeing with that. Just pointing out that I don't think it was some lad flying a whirlybird with L plates. On your last bit, I just checked on Flight Radar and Davison is only about 15 miles away so the bureaucrats could use that.

Marylandolorian wrote: Thu Jan 30, 2025 10:59 pm I learn a new word today , thanks UK friends
Cockwomble (noun) A person, usually male, prone to making outrageously stupid statements and/or inappropriate behavior while generally having a very high opinion of their own wisdom and importance.

Another for your dictionary is 'fuckwit' meaning stupid or contemptible person. Given your new president I thought it might come in handy as well?

Raggs wrote: Fri Jan 31, 2025 10:16 am

TB63 wrote: Thu Jan 30, 2025 11:24 pm You couldn't make this shit up!

And why do you only have an Acting head of FAA? And what happened to the air safety committee not long ago? And why have a load of ATCs chosen to retire? And why, in an industry that was already understaffed, has there been an employment freeze?

I don't know if anyone from this tower retired due to Trumps offer, but if they were understaffed (and there's suggestions there was a single ATC covering things) and someone had retired, I know where the blame lies.

Doubt whether trumps edict would have taken effect yet and directly or indirectly caused only one person to be on duty, surely in America there is some form of working your notice period on important jobs ?

Yeeb wrote: Fri Jan 31, 2025 11:01 am

Raggs wrote: Fri Jan 31, 2025 10:16 am

TB63 wrote: Thu Jan 30, 2025 11:24 pm You couldn't make this shit up!

And why do you only have an Acting head of FAA? And what happened to the air safety committee not long ago? And why have a load of ATCs chosen to retire? And why, in an industry that was already understaffed, has there been an employment freeze?

I don't know if anyone from this tower retired due to Trumps offer, but if they were understaffed (and there's suggestions there was a single ATC covering things) and someone had retired, I know where the blame lies.

Doubt whether trumps edict would have taken effect yet and directly or indirectly caused only one person to be on duty, surely in America there is some form of working your notice period on important jobs ?

His freezing of new hires would have taken effect, I don't know about the voluntary retirement thing.

Raggs wrote: Fri Jan 31, 2025 11:23 am

Yeeb wrote: Fri Jan 31, 2025 11:01 am

Raggs wrote: Fri Jan 31, 2025 10:16 am

And why do you only have an Acting head of FAA? And what happened to the air safety committee not long ago? And why have a load of ATCs chosen to retire? And why, in an industry that was already understaffed, has there been an employment freeze?

I don't know if anyone from this tower retired due to Trumps offer, but if they were understaffed (and there's suggestions there was a single ATC covering things) and someone had retired, I know where the blame lies.

Doubt whether trumps edict would have taken effect yet and directly or indirectly caused only one person to be on duty, surely in America there is some form of working your notice period on important jobs ?

His freezing of new hires would have taken effect, I don't know about the voluntary retirement thing.

Sure , but freezing of a new hire won’t have had any impact on two controllers being in there rather than one, even in America I think they would have a bit of training first ;)

I just don’t see how the don could have any impact on this accident at all, unlike future investigations / clamour of demand for people wanting to work ATC / anyone in a box he doesn’t like being put off applying