Nick Cave on Cancel Culture

[Quade]

He really is a fantastic writer.

What do you think of cancel culture?

FRANCES, LOS ANGELES, USA

Dear Valerio and Frances,

Mercy is a value that should be at the heart of any functioning and tolerant society. Mercy ultimately acknowledges that we are all imperfect and in doing so allows us the oxygen to breathe — to feel protected within a society, through our mutual fallibility. Without mercy a society loses its soul, and devours itself.

Mercy allows us the ability to engage openly in free-ranging conversation — an expansion of collective discovery toward a common good. If mercy is our guide we have a safety net of mutual consideration, and we can, to quote Oscar Wilde, “play gracefully with ideas.”

Yet mercy is not a given. It is a value we must nurture and aspire to. Tolerance allows the spirit of enquiry the confidence to roam freely, to make mistakes, to self-correct, to be bold, to dare to doubt and in the process to chance upon new and more advanced ideas. Without mercy society grows inflexible, fearful, vindictive and humourless.

Frances, you’ve asked about cancel culture. As far as I can see, cancel culture is mercy’s antithesis. Political correctness has grown to become the unhappiest religion in the world. Its once honourable attempt to reimagine our society in a more equitable way now embodies all the worst aspects that religion has to offer (and none of the beauty) — moral certainty and self-righteousness shorn even of the capacity for redemption. It has become quite literally, bad religion run amuck.

Cancel culture’s refusal to engage with uncomfortable ideas has an asphyxiating effect on the creative soul of a society. Compassion is the primary experience — the heart event — out of which emerges the genius and generosity of the imagination. Creativity is an act of love that can knock up against our most foundational beliefs, and in doing so brings forth fresh ways of seeing the world. This is both the function and glory of art and ideas. A force that finds its meaning in the cancellation of these difficult ideas hampers the creative spirit of a society and strikes at the complex and diverse nature of its culture.

But this is where we are. We are a culture in transition, and it may be that we are heading toward a more equal society — I don’t know — but what essential values will we forfeit in the process?

Love, Nick

[Kiap]

He also describes it well:

As far as I can see, cancel culture is mercy’s antithesis. Political correctness has grown to become the unhappiest religion in the world. Its once honourable attempt to reimagine our society in a more equitable way now embodies all the worst aspects that religion has to offer (and none of the beauty) — moral certainty and self-righteousness shorn even of the capacity for redemption. It has become quite literally, bad religion run amuck.

[Clogs]

Yep he nailed it. They may have started out with the best of intention but have arrived at the worst of outcome. Unintended consequence and all of that..

[mat the expat]

Cancel culture, Woke, etc....

It's worse when you call it that.

[Guy Smiley]

‘amuck’...

sigh.

I love Nick Cave and that is a lovely piece of writing...

but fucking amok, Nick.

[Tilly Orifice]

Good points there, but it's a bit sweeping. You can bet that his well thought out critique of some aspects of political correctness will encourage some to castigate "the left" in a way that's the exact mirror image of what he's complaining about.

[Guy Smiley]

Good points there, but it's a bit sweeping. You can bet that his well thought out critique of some aspects of political correctness will encourage some to castigate "the left" in a way that's the exact mirror image of what he's complaining about.

Isn’t that a wordy way of missing his point entirely?

[Kiap]

‘amuck’...

sigh.

I love Nick Cave and that is a lovely piece of writing...

but fucking amok, Nick.

Not Cecil narily

[mat the expat]

You can absolutely tell he's experienced the good shit over the years.

[Tilly Orifice]

Good points there, but it's a bit sweeping. You can bet that his well thought out critique of some aspects of political correctness will encourage some to castigate "the left" in a way that's the exact mirror image of what he's complaining about.

Isn’t that a wordy way of missing his point entirely?

Could be, could be.

[Quade]

‘amuck’...

sigh.

I love Nick Cave and that is a lovely piece of writing...

but fucking amok, Nick.

Is it though? Amok is a noun; amuck is the adjective - at least according to the massive amount of internet research I just did.

https://www.dictionary.com/browse/amuck

[Clogs]

‘amuck’...

sigh.

I love Nick Cave and that is a lovely piece of writing...

but fucking amok, Nick.

Is it though? Amok is a noun; amuck is the adjective - at least according to the massive amount of internet research I just did.

https://www.dictionary.com/browse/amuck

Am I alone in hoping to see a heartfelt apology to Nick Cave?

[Guy Smiley]

‘amuck’...

sigh.

I love Nick Cave and that is a lovely piece of writing...

but fucking amok, Nick.

Is it though? Amok is a noun; amuck is the adjective - at least according to the massive amount of internet research I just did.

https://www.dictionary.com/browse/amuck

Am I alone in hoping to see a heartfelt apology to Nick Cave?

You’re just alone.

[Guy Smiley]

‘amuck’...

sigh.

I love Nick Cave and that is a lovely piece of writing...

but fucking amok, Nick.

Is it though? Amok is a noun; amuck is the adjective - at least according to the massive amount of internet research I just did.

https://www.dictionary.com/browse/amuck

I’ve given this some thought.

Then I gave up and listened

[CrazyIslander]

The truth is in the middle. At the extreme it's vicious but those people who drives those campaigns are nasty regardless and would be doing it in some other form.

Cancel culture moderately practiced is a form of protest against real issues in society which affects people's daily lives.

The thing about celebrities and companies they make their money on attracting positive public sentiments. You'd have to change your tact to keep those fans/customers. If you slip up then you shouldn't conplain about jumping through the hoops to win them back.
Obviously at the extreme it's a problem.

[Quade]

The twittersphere is quite angry at our Nick.

Phrases such as "Nick Cave should go back to living in his cave" and "It's time to cancel Nick Cave" have been bandied about.

[Guy Smiley]

The twittersphere is quite angry at our Nick.

Phrases such as "Nick Cave should go back to living in his cave" and "It's time to cancel Nick Cave" have been bandied about.

Not surprising. He makes a point about cancel culture’s refusal to engage uncomfortable ideas... this is a sort of meme of the times. Attack that which challenges you, rather than consideration, reflection. He suggests we practise mercy and the challenge in that is a personal one. We could all stop blaming or finger pointing.

Of course a suggestion like that is going to excite exactly the reaction he suggests we give up. It’s too uncomfortable to consider, therefore I must attack and lash out. We’re a childish society with limited emotional development and perhaps we’ve always been like this. It’s just louder and more insistent with most having access to personal megaphones.

[Thommo]

Everyone has some sort of skeleton in their closet and those skeletons will be found if people dig hard enough. I'm not a fan of cancel culture at all but that doesn't mean people can't be held accountable for views they held in the past.

I do love it when it backfires though. Asian Australian actress and writer Michelle Law is quite tenacious on Twitter when it comes to cancelling people. Goes on a lot about white people etc. Someone pointed out how she donned blackface in a short film she did a few years ago and the fallout was delicious.

[Hugo]

When did cancel culture become a "thing"?

Obviously protesting and boycotting and such have been around since the dawn of time but when did this phenomenon of trying to turn people into unperson's become a widespread practice? My understanding is that it has become prevalent only in the last 10 years, more or less since twitter became pervasive but am happy to bow to someone who has more knowledge on the matter.

[Caley_Red]

When did cancel culture become a "thing"?

Obviously protesting and boycotting and such have been around since the dawn of time but when did this phenomenon of trying to turn people into unperson's become a widespread practice? My understanding is that it has become prevalent only in the last 10 years, more or less since twitter became pervasive but am happy to bow to someone who has more knowledge on the matter.

Correlates very strongly with social media and the continued concentration of opinion on it, Twitter- when weighted by post count- seems to be almost entirely inhabited by extremists, I left the platform in 2011 due to this and it seems to have got a whole lot worse if news coverage is anything to go by. It's amazing the extent to which this silly platform- populated by odd balls in the main- has such an influence in political and social discourse, I think part of the issue is that journalists are absolutely obsessed with it so seem to think that whatever is de rigeur du jour on there must constitute news to the wider population.

The seeds were definitely there 10 years ago but the whole rise of 'wokeness' (of which I include cancel culture) seems to have got a lot worse in the last 5 years, what was once confined to fringe lunatics in former polytechnic humanities departments has spread throughout academia and infected multiple institutions as well as the documented rise of the 'woke corporation'.

[Lemoentjie]

Sounds like a Nazi

[Random1]

The twittersphere is quite angry at our Nick.

Phrases such as "Nick Cave should go back to living in his cave" and "It's time to cancel Nick Cave" have been bandied about.

Not surprising. He makes a point about cancel culture’s refusal to engage uncomfortable ideas... this is a sort of meme of the times. Attack that which challenges you, rather than consideration, reflection. He suggests we practise mercy and the challenge in that is a personal one. We could all stop blaming or finger pointing.

Of course a suggestion like that is going to excite exactly the reaction he suggests we give up. It’s too uncomfortable to consider, therefore I must attack and lash out. We’re a childish society with limited emotional development and perhaps we’ve always been like this. It’s just louder and more insistent with most having access to personal megaphones.

I agree that it probably started out that way - i.e. that people were just sensitive about push back and were emboldened by their echo chambers to take an aggressive approach - and that’s all understandable, attacking what feels like the wrong culture/tribe is probably one of the basest human things out there.

But it feels like it’s gone past that stage for me now. It feels like people who didn’t have power, now have it. They have the power to cause significant damage to a person’s reputation. And they relish it.

one day I’m hoping they’ll see the irony of them getting some power, and then abusing it rather than being merciful (to steel nick cave’s sentiment)

It’s animal farm being played out.

[ticketlessinseattle]

The truth is in the middle. At the extreme it's vicious but those people who drives those campaigns are nasty regardless and would be doing it in some other form.

Cancel culture moderately practiced is a form of protest against real issues in society which affects people's daily lives.

The thing about celebrities and companies they make their money on attracting positive public sentiments. You'd have to change your tact to keep those fans/customers. If you slip up then you shouldn't conplain about jumping through the hoops to win them back.
Obviously at the extreme it's a problem.

yeah, it'll probably be retweeted by Trump and or his supporters that even the left have realized political correctness has gone too far....which in some cases it probably has but in plenty of cases it hasn't. PS he's clearly still pissed off at being called out on his Israel tour !

[Uncle fester]

There needs to be a line somewhere. Being balanced doesn't mean that somebody like David Irving should be given equal airtime to actual historians.
He shouldn't be getting serious platforms to air his nonsense.

Guardian had an excellent article on the myth of Tommy Robinson being denied a platform, when in fact he gets loads of coverage.

On the other hand, the uproar about GRRM presenting the Hugo awards is clearly confusing an old man, out of touch with modern literature with an actual racist.