NPR

Saints v UBB

Saints pen just inside UBB half on the right under adv. UBB asleep and Saints have a walk in 2 on 1 on the far left....... and blow it.

Whitehouse comes back for the pen.

If it’s a pen advantage (kickable) it shouldn’t finish in open play. It’s not an advantage if you could have had 3 points. So if time goes on, instead of advantage over, it gets called back to pen for that reason.

It’s just how long it goes on for is often the problem.

Missed it. I've seen wasps playing a French team in France when the French team won a penalty in their ownhalf, made a 40+m break to within 5m of wasps tryline, play 3 phases and then spill it and get to come back for the advantage.

So the answer is as long as the ref feels like.

Sh*tehouse is clueless. Swinging arm to the head of Botica is probably red under current directives but certainly yellow. Not even reviewed by ref or TMO.

Torquemada 1420 wrote: Fri Dec 11, 2020 6:43 pm Saints v UBB

Saints pen just inside UBB half on the right under adv. UBB asleep and Saints have a walk in 2 on 1 on the far left....... and blow it.

Whitehouse comes back for the pen.

Always been a bugbear of mine how the advantage is policed, so inconsistant. Surely something like 5 phases of play, or 10 meters gained or kicked and advantage is immediately over. If a team wants the penalty they drop the ball down and whistle goes.

Torquemada 1420 wrote: Fri Dec 11, 2020 6:53 pm Sh*tehouse is clueless. Swinging arm to the head of Botica is probably red under current directives but certainly yellow. Not even reviewed by ref or TMO.

Same player now taking out player in the air...... pen.

ASMO wrote: Fri Dec 11, 2020 6:56 pm

Torquemada 1420 wrote: Fri Dec 11, 2020 6:43 pm Saints v UBB

Saints pen just inside UBB half on the right under adv. UBB asleep and Saints have a walk in 2 on 1 on the far left....... and blow it.

Whitehouse comes back for the pen.

Always been a bugbear of mine how the advantage is policed, so inconsistant. Surely something like 5 phases of play, or 10 meters gained or kicked and advantage is immediately over. If a team wants the penalty they drop the ball down and whistle goes.

For me a pen advantage should be 30m of retained territory, so either a break, or working up to it, and then a successful breakdown once there, effectively similar to an OK kick to touch, following a likely retention of possession at lineout.

Torq gonna be incandesant with that

ASMO wrote: Fri Dec 11, 2020 7:07 pm Torq gonna be incandesant with that

Advantage is definitely over when you stamp on someone :D.

ASMO wrote: Fri Dec 11, 2020 6:56 pm

Torquemada 1420 wrote: Fri Dec 11, 2020 6:43 pm Saints v UBB

Saints pen just inside UBB half on the right under adv. UBB asleep and Saints have a walk in 2 on 1 on the far left....... and blow it.

Whitehouse comes back for the pen.

Always been a bugbear of mine how the advantage is policed, so inconsistant. Surely something like 5 phases of play, or 10 meters gained or kicked and advantage is immediately over. If a team wants the penalty they drop the ball down and whistle goes.

Don't know how much more adv that a simple try scoring chance you need.

Whitehouse doing a real homer on UBB on this one. Will bet Naiyaravoro gets a post match ban which is no adv to UBB when he should have been off. Meanwhile he's worked OT to find a reason to overturn a pen 5 out from Saints' line and yellow Lucu to add the icing. We are beyond the point where refs decide most games and another nail in the coffin of the game.

Unbelievable. Sh*tehouse is reviewing this nothing incident at the instruction of Biggar as dangerous.

Northampton utterly shitehouse

Comedy of errors there

And Sh*tehouse f**ks up again. No arms by Hutchison to prevent Woki grounding. Pen try.

Torquemada 1420 wrote: Fri Dec 11, 2020 7:24 pm And Sh*tehouse f**ks up again. No arms by Hutchison to prevent Woki grounding. Pen try.

Agree, that was a poor decision

Advantage should only be three phases of play imo


Anything more is a pisstake.

Not_Couch wrote: Fri Dec 11, 2020 8:28 pm Advantage should only be three phases of play imo


Anything more is a pisstake.

For a penalty??? Why would any team choose to play advantage?

Raggs wrote: Fri Dec 11, 2020 11:21 pm

Not_Couch wrote: Fri Dec 11, 2020 8:28 pm Advantage should only be three phases of play imo


Anything more is a pisstake.

For a penalty??? Why would any team choose to play advantage?

FFS you only need one phase to mount an attack worthy of a try. It's called growing some balls

Raggs wrote: Fri Dec 11, 2020 11:21 pm

Not_Couch wrote: Fri Dec 11, 2020 8:28 pm Advantage should only be three phases of play imo


Anything more is a pisstake.

For a penalty??? Why would any team choose to play advantage?

Too arbitrary for me. I prefer discretion from the ref but for it not to be moronic. Two changes I would :
1) adv is over immediately you kick the ball away.
2) If you've made 10m, adv is over. It can be called back earlier if it's going nowhere anyway.

Raggs wrote: Fri Dec 11, 2020 7:03 pm

ASMO wrote: Fri Dec 11, 2020 6:56 pm

Torquemada 1420 wrote: Fri Dec 11, 2020 6:43 pm Saints v UBB

Saints pen just inside UBB half on the right under adv. UBB asleep and Saints have a walk in 2 on 1 on the far left....... and blow it.

Whitehouse comes back for the pen.

Always been a bugbear of mine how the advantage is policed, so inconsistant. Surely something like 5 phases of play, or 10 meters gained or kicked and advantage is immediately over. If a team wants the penalty they drop the ball down and whistle goes.

For me a pen advantage should be 30m of retained territory, so either a break, or working up to it, and then a successful breakdown once there, effectively similar to an OK kick to touch, following a likely retention of possession at lineout.

Teams with the advantage will just immediately just drop the ball and take the penalty, particularly in today’s environment

Slick wrote: Sat Dec 12, 2020 7:52 am

Raggs wrote: Fri Dec 11, 2020 7:03 pm

ASMO wrote: Fri Dec 11, 2020 6:56 pm

Always been a bugbear of mine how the advantage is policed, so inconsistant. Surely something like 5 phases of play, or 10 meters gained or kicked and advantage is immediately over. If a team wants the penalty they drop the ball down and whistle goes.

For me a pen advantage should be 30m of retained territory, so either a break, or working up to it, and then a successful breakdown once there, effectively similar to an OK kick to touch, following a likely retention of possession at lineout.

Teams with the advantage will just immediately just drop the ball and take the penalty, particularly in today’s environment

That's why I suggested 30m and retained possession. 30m + guaranteed vs 30-40m and a lineout.

Anything less and no team is going to risk playing. They've got a kick and likely retention of possession (even better, a set piece to run a play off), if advantage is less than that, it's not worth taking.

Torquemada 1420 wrote: Sat Dec 12, 2020 7:48 am

Raggs wrote: Fri Dec 11, 2020 11:21 pm

Not_Couch wrote: Fri Dec 11, 2020 8:28 pm Advantage should only be three phases of play imo


Anything more is a pisstake.

For a penalty??? Why would any team choose to play advantage?

Too arbitrary for me. I prefer discretion from the ref but for it not to be moronic. Two changes I would :
1) adv is over immediately you kick the ball away.
2) If you've made 10m, adv is over. It can be called back earlier if it's going nowhere anyway.

So a team gets an pen advantage 15m out. Are we saying they probably shouldn’t go for a try?

For a knock on it should be over as soon as you kick the ball away. So many refs say, "no advantage, back for the scrum." What! Was only a knock on and they chose to kick it.

For pens we will always have disputes on what advantage over should be. My view is that refs often go on a bit too long but tis a moot point.

Slick wrote: Sat Dec 12, 2020 7:52 am

Raggs wrote: Fri Dec 11, 2020 7:03 pm

ASMO wrote: Fri Dec 11, 2020 6:56 pm

Always been a bugbear of mine how the advantage is policed, so inconsistant. Surely something like 5 phases of play, or 10 meters gained or kicked and advantage is immediately over. If a team wants the penalty they drop the ball down and whistle goes.

For me a pen advantage should be 30m of retained territory, so either a break, or working up to it, and then a successful breakdown once there, effectively similar to an OK kick to touch, following a likely retention of possession at lineout.

Teams with the advantage will just immediately just drop the ball and take the penalty, particularly in today’s environment

Happened in the Saints Bordeaux match last night

Ymx wrote: Sat Dec 12, 2020 10:21 am

Torquemada 1420 wrote: Sat Dec 12, 2020 7:48 am

Raggs wrote: Fri Dec 11, 2020 11:21 pm

For a penalty??? Why would any team choose to play advantage?

Too arbitrary for me. I prefer discretion from the ref but for it not to be moronic. Two changes I would :
1) adv is over immediately you kick the ball away.
2) If you've made 10m, adv is over. It can be called back earlier if it's going nowhere anyway.

So a team gets an pen advantage 15m out. Are we saying they probably shouldn’t go for a try?

How do you arrive at that conclusion?

Torquemada 1420 wrote: Sat Dec 12, 2020 1:24 pm

Ymx wrote: Sat Dec 12, 2020 10:21 am

Torquemada 1420 wrote: Sat Dec 12, 2020 7:48 am

Too arbitrary for me. I prefer discretion from the ref but for it not to be moronic. Two changes I would :
1) adv is over immediately you kick the ball away.
2) If you've made 10m, adv is over. It can be called back earlier if it's going nowhere anyway.

So a team gets an pen advantage 15m out. Are we saying they probably shouldn’t go for a try?

How do you arrive at that conclusion?

Won’t they lose advantage when they get within 5m?

So risk losing a nailed on 3 points by trying to go for the try.

Ymx wrote: Sat Dec 12, 2020 1:31 pm

Torquemada 1420 wrote: Sat Dec 12, 2020 1:24 pm

Ymx wrote: Sat Dec 12, 2020 10:21 am


So a team gets an pen advantage 15m out. Are we saying they probably shouldn’t go for a try?

How do you arrive at that conclusion?

Won’t they lose advantage when they get within 5m?

So risk losing a nailed on 3 points by trying to go for the try.

Well, I guess that's the side's call. Personally, see no reason why being there should be any exception. If the pen was for something that deliberately prevented a try or was serious, we already have sanctions for that.

And that’s why it wouldn’t work. There would be next to zero reason to take advantage. And instead they’d just opt to stop the match, to then punt it out, for a line out up to 30m further. But you’re right the game really needs more stoppages to be encouraged, and players ditching their own ball.