2021 Guinness PRO14 Rainbow Cup

[Sards]

He's made some good contributions in the last two games, but not much more.

Happy to give him the benefit of the doubt for the Rainbow Cup, as Venter and Richardson are injured. He'll have to up his game (as will most of his teammates) for the Bulls.

But I do agree, the $harks coaches are talking him up, unsurprisingly as he's the national captain and under the microscope.

Two wins from two so he's got to be doing something right.

Am is the captain

[Sards]

I can just imagine all the popped collars and wearing of sunglasses indoors of all the saarkies on here

No dude....this is normal for us. Nothing new.
Just like its normal for you , nothing new

[handyman]

I can just imagine all the popped collars and wearing of sunglasses indoors of all the saarkies on here

No dude....this is normal for us. Nothing new.
Just like its normal for you , nothing new

Do your coach cry when one of his players gets an injury? Do you have that family vibe in your team?

[Sards]

I can just imagine all the popped collars and wearing of sunglasses indoors of all the saarkies on here

No dude....this is normal for us. Nothing new.
Just like its normal for you , nothing new

Do your coach cry when one of his players gets an injury? Do you have that family vibe in your team?

Read all correspondence re the Sharks ethos. Its a family.

You lot have a real problem every season with injuries. I keep telling you. Its this physical gameplan. Try outmuscle the opposition instead of outplay them

[Sards]

Did anyone wish Sandstorm a good mother's day.

Happy mothers day girl

[handyman]

No dude....this is normal for us. Nothing new.
Just like its normal for you , nothing new

Do your coach cry when one of his players gets an injury? Do you have that family vibe in your team?

Read all correspondence re the Sharks ethos. Its a family.

You lot have a real problem every season with injuries. I keep telling you. Its this physical gameplan. Try outmuscle the opposition instead of outplay them

To me it's the complete opposite. As soon as the big offers come, the players are out the door. And now with all the ego's and Roc Nation contracts, how will that play out in a team environment?

[Sards]

Do your coach cry when one of his players gets an injury? Do you have that family vibe in your team?

Read all correspondence re the Sharks ethos. Its a family.

You lot have a real problem every season with injuries. I keep telling you. Its this physical gameplan. Try outmuscle the opposition instead of outplay them

To me it's the complete opposite. As soon as the big offers come, the players are out the door. And now with all the ego's and Roc Nation contracts, how will that play out in a team environment?

It was happening before Roc .... your lot always have the worst injury list.

[handyman]

Read all correspondence re the Sharks ethos. Its a family.

You lot have a real problem every season with injuries. I keep telling you. Its this physical gameplan. Try outmuscle the opposition instead of outplay them

To me it's the complete opposite. As soon as the big offers come, the players are out the door. And now with all the ego's and Roc Nation contracts, how will that play out in a team environment?

It was happening before Roc .... your lot always have the worst injury list.

Well boet, as someone who never played rugby, you don't understand how hard and uncompromising rugby is. It's a contact sport and injuries will happen.

[Sards]

Dude

[Rinkals]

Siya Kolisi is a better player, better leader and more succesful than Corne Krige, Andre Vos and Andre Strauss. I love how he triggers certain fans. In our unique rugby environment he's invaluable. You would think that after 30 years of living in the new South Africa that fans would become realista and learn to accept the situation.

Siya Kolisi is not the best South African no 7. flank. But he is the best man for the job. I'm hoping that when he wins a series against the Lions he does another bus top victory tour. And I hope it makes the haters so embittered that it triggers another chicken run to Australia.

Is Aus letting anyone in?

I thought the only option these days is the UK and Canada.

[Blake]

Siya Kolisi is a better player, better leader and more succesful than Corne Krige, Andre Vos and Andre Strauss. I love how he triggers certain fans. In our unique rugby environment he's invaluable. You would think that after 30 years of living in the new South Africa that fans would become realista and learn to accept the situation.

Siya Kolisi is not the best South African no 7. flank. But he is the best man for the job. I'm hoping that when he wins a series against the Lions he does another bus top victory tour. And I hope it makes the haters so embittered that it triggers another chicken run to Australia.

Agreed. Sometimes the best captain (for that moment in time) is not the best player, and sometimes the best player isn't the best captain.
At many times in the past it could have been argued that Francois Pienaar, Gary Teichman or John Smit were not the best players in their respective positions, but they were all great captains.

Similarly, your best players are sometimes footsoldiers and workers, but not great leaders, despite being the first name on the teamsheet.
That is the predicament the Stormers find themselves in. Kitshoff and PSdT are by far our 2 best players. Bongi in the mix as well. Given the options available it makes sense that one of those 3 be captain as they are the most experienced, perform consistently, and "lead by example" in their work ethic, but in my ideal world I wouldn't burden any of them with the captain duties if it could be avoided.

We took a big hit with Etzebeth, Kolisi and DDA all leaving. There is a massive "senior player / leadership" void in our team at the moment. Even more so in the backline than in the pack. We need some veterans to help the skipper. For the Boks Duane and Eben and Flouw helped Siya a lot, and at the back Pollard and Frans provided direction. That's the problem when you become a cash strapped union. I honestly wouldn't mind if the Stormers brought in a jouneyman player or two that have been around the block and can just guide some of the young talent.

In all the the rugby biographies by all the captains I've read, they always give a lot of credit to their lieutenants.

[OomStruisbaai]

Siya Kolisi is an excellent captain. Captaincy also bring out the best of him. He is already a legend. The only problem is that we already have PSdT as 7. Kolisi is a perfect 7 not 6. Luckily for the Bokke we have Vermeulen who play the 6 role (playing to the ball). In fact Vermeulen can play any vokken role in a loose trio.

[OomStruisbaai]

I dunno why I post that kak. Should rather keep quiet and post vokkel at all.

[Chilli]

Siya Kolisi is a better player, better leader and more succesful than Corne Krige, Andre Vos and Andre Strauss. I love how he triggers certain fans. In our unique rugby environment he's invaluable. You would think that after 30 years of living in the new South Africa that fans would become realista and learn to accept the situation.

Siya Kolisi is not the best South African no 7. flank. But he is the best man for the job. I'm hoping that when he wins a series against the Lions he does another bus top victory tour. And I hope it makes the haters so embittered that it triggers another chicken run to Australia.

Who is Andre Strauss?

[Chilli]

Siya Kolisi is a better player, better leader and more succesful than Corne Krige, Andre Vos and Andre Strauss.

Who de vok is Andre Strauss?

Jammer oom! I meant Adriaan. He was actually a very good hooker earlier on but by the time he captained the boks he was very average.

He was an excellent hooker, player and captain. The coach was dog shit bad with some very poor selections.

[assfly]

He was an excellent hooker, player and captain. The coach was dog shit bad with some very poor selections.

You're on your own there. This must be the first time I've heard his name since he stopped playing for the Boks.

[Chilli]

He was an excellent hooker, player and captain. The coach was dog shit bad with some very poor selections.

You're on your own there. This must be the first time I've heard his name since he stopped playing for the Boks.

Perhaps you will remember his under his nom de plum?
The Vanilla Gorilla

[Fangle]

He was an excellent hooker, player and captain. The coach was dog shit bad with some very poor selections.

You're on your own there. This must be the first time I've heard his name since he stopped playing for the Boks.

I really rated him as a player and provincial captain, until he was made captain of the boks.

[FalseBayFC]

He was an excellent hooker, player and captain. The coach was dog shit bad with some very poor selections.

You're on your own there. This must be the first time I've heard his name since he stopped playing for the Boks.

Perhaps you will remember his under his nom de plum?
The Vanilla Gorilla

At one stage our hookers options were Vanilla and Chilliboy. 2016 -2018 under Allister Coetzee.

[Chilli]

He was an excellent hooker, player and captain. The coach was dog shit bad with some very poor selections.

You're on your own there. This must be the first time I've heard his name since he stopped playing for the Boks.

I really rated him as a player and provincial captain, until he was made captain of the boks.

True.

[Rinkals]

You're on your own there. This must be the first time I've heard his name since he stopped playing for the Boks.

I really rated him as a player and provincial captain, until he was made captain of the boks.

True.

I never rated him.

As a former hooker myself, I thought he was bone idle, always last to the ruck, spending far too much time on the wings.

[assfly]

Perhaps you will remember his under his nom de plum?
The Vanilla Gorilla

I know who he is. But when we talk about great Springbok hookers or captains, I don't think his name will come up.

I feel sorry for him, of course he's going to accept being given the captaincy but he ended up walking into an absolute shit-show.

[Chilli]

I really rated him as a player and provincial captain, until he was made captain of the boks.

True.

I never rated him.

As a former hooker myself, I thought he was bone idle, always last to the ruck, spending far too much time on the wings.

You understand that he was following the AC gameplan?

He was an excellent hooker.

[Chilli]

Perhaps you will remember his under his nom de plum?
The Vanilla Gorilla

I know who he is. But when we talk about great Springbok hookers or captains, I don't think his name will come up.

I feel sorry for him, of course he's going to accept being given the captaincy but he ended up walking into an absolute shit-show.

Nowhere is he touted as a great Bok hooker or captain. The most of his caps were under HM and AC. No players really stood out with them as cpahes.

He was a player who did the basics of his job as a hooker very well. He was also a very successful Cheetahs captain.

[handyman]

Strauss was unfortunate that he played at a time when the Boks were sh1t. He was a very good player.

[Chilli]

Strauss was unfortunate that he played at a time when the Boks were sh1t. He was a very good player.

Yip!

[Sards]

Strauss was unfortunate that he played at a time when the Boks were sh1t. He was a very good player.

Yip!

Was his the shortest reign or was that Corne Krige

[Rinkals]

True.

I never rated him.

As a former hooker myself, I thought he was bone idle, always last to the ruck, spending far too much time on the wings.

You understand that he was following the AC gameplan?

He was an excellent hooker.

Bone. Fucking. Idle.

Any decent hooker gets himself around the park. Almost like an extra loosie.

Strauss was just too fat.

[OomStruisbaai]

RAINBOW CUP SA FIXTURES – ROUNDS THREE TO SIX (all times local)

Saturday, May 15

13.30: Lions v Stormers (Ellis Park, Johannesburg)

18.15: Bulls v Sharks (Loftus Versfeld, Pretoria)

Saturday, May 22

13.00: Sharks v Stormers (Kings Park, Durban)

15.30: Lions v Bulls (Ellis Park, Johannesburg)

Friday, June 4

19.00: Bulls v Stormers (Loftus Versfeld, Pretoria)

Saturday, June 5

16.00: Lions v Sharks (Ellis Park, Johannesburg)

Saturday, June 12

16.00: Stormers v Lions (Cape Town Stadium, Cape Town)

18.15: Sharks v Bulls (Kings Park, Durban)

[Chilli]

I never rated him.

As a former hooker myself, I thought he was bone idle, always last to the ruck, spending far too much time on the wings.

You understand that he was following the AC gameplan?

He was an excellent hooker.

Bone. Fucking. Idle.

Any decent hooker gets himself around the park. Almost like an extra loosie.

Strauss was just too fat.

Ja Rinkey. Whatever

[average joe]

Rinkey played hooker for the Bulawayo Bushwhackers, you can't tell him nothing about playing hooker.

[Rinkals]

Rinkey played hooker for the Bulawayo Bushwhackers, you can't tell him nothing about playing hooker.

Anyone who has played the position understands what it entails.

You don't have to be Keith Woods.

On the other hand, if you've only ever played in the backs you probably think Adrien Strauss was an excellent hooker.

[Chilli]

Rinkey played hooker for the Bulawayo Bushwhackers, you can't tell him nothing about playing hooker.

Anyone who has played the position understands what it entails.

You don't have to be Keith Woods.

On the other hand, if you've only ever played in the backs you probably think Adrien Strauss was an excellent hooker.

How fukken arrogant is this?

[Rinkals]

Rinkey played hooker for the Bulawayo Bushwhackers, you can't tell him nothing about playing hooker.

Anyone who has played the position understands what it entails.

You don't have to be Keith Woods.

On the other hand, if you've only ever played in the backs you probably think Adrien Strauss was an excellent hooker.

How fukken arrogant is this?

Arrogant?

I was told that my opinion can be disregarded because I've never played representative Rugby.

I was just saying that you don't need to be an International to know that Strauss was lazy.

Besides, us front rowers are very well aware that you non-pack okes know fokkall .

[Blake]

Adriaan Strauss maybe isn't Dane Coles or Schalk Brits fast, but I'd wager he was quicker than John Smit and at least on par if not faster than Gary Botha, Bismarck and Marx. All the other hookers of this playing era.

I honestly don't think the problem with Strauss' tenure was his play, or his captaincy; the problem was Alistair Coetzee's overly complex gameplan and playing style, and the legacy of Meyer's poor talent identification and lack of squad depth that he left behind. Neither of those are Struass' fault.

[Blake]

This is the team Adriaan Strauss captained to a 26-24 loss against Argentina in Argentina.
This was Coetzee's 5 match in charge.

1. Tendai Mtawarira 79 caps
2. Adriaan Strauss 58 caps
3. Vincent Koch 3 caps
4. Eben Etzebeth 48 caps
5. Lood de Jager 21 caps
6. Francois Louw 47 caps
7. Oupa Mohoje 9 caps
8. Warren Whiteley 7 caps
9. Faf de Klerk 4 caps
10. Elton Jantjies 6 caps
11. Bryan Habana 118 caps
12. Damian de Allende 17 caps
13. Lionel Mapoe 5 caps
14. Ruan Combrinck 3 caps
15. Johan Goosen 7 caps

16. Lourens Adriaanse 1 caps
17. Steven Kitshoff 2 caps
18. Pieter-Steph du Toit 12 caps
19. Jaco Kriel 2 caps
20. Rudy Paige 3 caps
21. Morné Steyn 61 caps
22. Jesse Kriel 13 caps

Look at all those sub 10 cap players in that match day 22! Yes, many of those would become established greats over time, but you can't chuck so many newbies and youngsters into the deep end at once. It's just setting yourself (and them) up for failure.

Meyer had 48 tests (3rd longest tenure of any Bok coach) to build a core team knowing that his Bulls warhorses from a decade ago (Victor Matfield and Fourie Du Preez) would retire after the World Cup, as would Schalk Burger, Jean de Villiers and Bryan Habana all the way from Jake White's tenure. Meyer was particularly terrible at identifying talented players. He handed out so many caps to one-season-wonders, thereby making it impossible to build depth behind veteran players, many approaching their sell-by dates.

So when Coetzee took over he had a problem. He had this crazy, intricate game plan of "total rugby" in mind, and few players with the international experience to actually try and implement it at the highest level. At the time, the Lions' were having some success in Super Rugby playing a unique brand of rugby (for South Africa at least) so Coetzee loaded the Bok team with Lions play makers. But the plan was just too much of departure from what the other players were used to, and the Lions players were just too green to make the gamplan work in isolation.

It's tough to put that on Strauss. You can only do so much as captain when you have a bad coach that instructs the selections, gameplan and training and preparation, but doesn't really have buy-in from the players.

[OomStruisbaai]

Springbok Captains success rate

Captain Tests Wins Win %
Hennie Muller 9 8 88
Phil Nel 8 7 87
Morné du Plessis 15 13 86
Joost van der Westhuizen 10 8 80
Billy Millar 5 4 80
Bennie Osler 5 4 80
Victor Matfield 23 17 73
Gary Teichmann 36 26 72
Wynand Claassen 7 5 71
Johan Claassen 9 6 66
John Smit 83 54 65
Francois Pienaar 29 19 65
Siya Kolisi 20 13 65
Jean de Villiers 37 24 64
Basie Vivier 5 3 60
Dawie de Villiers 22 13 59
André Vos 16 9 56
Hannes Marais 11 6 54
Bobby Skinstad 12 6 50
Eben Etzebeth 12 6 50
Avril Malan 10 5 50
Naas Botha 9 4 44
Corné Krige 18 7 38
Adriaan Strauss 12 4 33

[average joe]

I would argue that the Lions team back then was greater as a whole than the sum of it's parts. They were a very well drilled team that played well together but when you removed the players from the team and placed them in another team they were found to be very average.

Strauss was mobile enough for a hooker and very strong over the ball. He secured many turn overs by himself and he made his tackles. Also preformed his core duties better than most hookers I've seen over the years.

[Chilli]

Anyone who has played the position understands what it entails.

You don't have to be Keith Woods.

On the other hand, if you've only ever played in the backs you probably think Adrien Strauss was an excellent hooker.

How fukken arrogant is this?

Arrogant?

I was told that my opinion can be disregarded because I've never played representative Rugby.

I was just saying that you don't need to be an International to know that Strauss was lazy.

Besides, us front rowers are very well aware that you non-pack okes know fokkall .

I played prop & hooker for 20 years.

[Chilli]

Adriaan Strauss maybe isn't Dane Coles or Schalk Brits fast, but I'd wager he was quicker than John Smit and at least on par if not faster than Gary Botha, Bismarck and Marx. All the other hookers of this playing era.

I honestly don't think the problem with Strauss' tenure was his play, or his captaincy; the problem was Alistair Coetzee's overly complex gameplan and playing style, and the legacy of Meyer's poor talent identification and lack of squad depth that he left behind. Neither of those are Struass' fault.

Ja.