This used to be a good topic over on the other bored.
I will start my second season in charge of our U16s after the summer. Last season was corona'd with one match of the regular season to go and our U16 First XV second in the country, one final good result away from qualifying for the national final. I'm not expecting a run like that in the coming season. Also, we'll have 48 players for just 2 teams and finding ways of giving everyone sufficient game time without a constant tombola of line-ups will be an interesting challenge.
Anyone else on here also an obnoxious dad pretending to know what they are doing?
Adventures in kids coaching
That's me. Thankfully only u9s this season, with a group of dads. Though I've ended up being head coach for some reason. Desperately hoping that we're allowed to do contact in time for the season start. Guess we'll have to wait and see.clydecloggie wrote: Mon Jul 27, 2020 1:29 pm This used to be a good topic over on the other bored.
I will start my second season in charge of our U16s after the summer. Last season was corona'd with one match of the regular season to go and our U16 First XV second in the country, one final good result away from qualifying for the national final. I'm not expecting a run like that in the coming season. Also, we'll have 48 players for just 2 teams and finding ways of giving everyone sufficient game time without a constant tombola of line-ups will be an interesting challenge.
Anyone else on here also an obnoxious dad pretending to know what they are doing?
Give a man a fire and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.
I coached schoolboy rugby from 1998-2002. Not the First XV stuff so much. The lower grades. In New Zealand school rugby you have different grades that take age and weight into account.
I had a lot of fun doing it, but it was so time-consuming. I can't say I miss all the time it took out of my weekends. I had excellent assistant coaches and managers working with me. A lot of the mums and dads were a lot of help too. But still, so time consuming.
It could get stressful, too. I remember sometimes not enough boys showing up. Or showing up without their mouth guards.
Once my team got into a massive brawl (lots of handbag swinging more than actual bloodthirsty violence) and I had to go to a judicial hearing at North Harbour HQ.
I had a lot of fun doing it, but it was so time-consuming. I can't say I miss all the time it took out of my weekends. I had excellent assistant coaches and managers working with me. A lot of the mums and dads were a lot of help too. But still, so time consuming.
It could get stressful, too. I remember sometimes not enough boys showing up. Or showing up without their mouth guards.
Once my team got into a massive brawl (lots of handbag swinging more than actual bloodthirsty violence) and I had to go to a judicial hearing at North Harbour HQ.
Yeah. Some parents are bloody painful. Demanding that their kids get game time, or play in a different position.
And occasionally the parents of opposition teams could be really rude and aggressive. For us, it was some of the parents from the rich, posh schools that went out of their way to make us feel unwelcome.
And occasionally the parents of opposition teams could be really rude and aggressive. For us, it was some of the parents from the rich, posh schools that went out of their way to make us feel unwelcome.
Parents are good so far, but we're not at serious games yet. Given the half time rule that's in place, I don't think it'll be too hard to deal with them on that later.
Have had a few coaches up their own arses though. We had a festival that unfortunately couldn't be done on the usual ground. The replacement had issues that were dealt with as best as possible. Unfortunately some teams pulled out. Most coaches were happy to try and find solutions, work around issues etc, the kids were 7 and just wanted to play, one coach however had things to say about almost every pitch, so I (as head coach for the "home" team I basically ended up being in charge of our little bit, our manager isn't much use). We agreed that we could organise the schedule would only play on the pitches he was happy with. We got to the last pitch, and he was moaning about it being "undulating"... OK, it wasn't perfectly flat, but ffs.
Thankfully all the other coaches there were rolling their eyes, so I didn't have to. And a few came up after to call him a dick. Again, not something I could do, but it was appreciated :D.
Have had a few coaches up their own arses though. We had a festival that unfortunately couldn't be done on the usual ground. The replacement had issues that were dealt with as best as possible. Unfortunately some teams pulled out. Most coaches were happy to try and find solutions, work around issues etc, the kids were 7 and just wanted to play, one coach however had things to say about almost every pitch, so I (as head coach for the "home" team I basically ended up being in charge of our little bit, our manager isn't much use). We agreed that we could organise the schedule would only play on the pitches he was happy with. We got to the last pitch, and he was moaning about it being "undulating"... OK, it wasn't perfectly flat, but ffs.
Thankfully all the other coaches there were rolling their eyes, so I didn't have to. And a few came up after to call him a dick. Again, not something I could do, but it was appreciated :D.
Give a man a fire and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.
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clydecloggie
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Aye, the parents...
Some are absolutely wonderful and put unbelievable amounts of time and energy into the club. Others suck all that energy right out, either through being completely uninterested in their kids or demanding a paved road straight into the national team for their half-talented sprog.
I did U12 before I moved over to the U16 last season. Must admit I like the U16 age group a lot better to train and coach. The downside is they're all fitter and more skillful than I ever was, but I like working out good game plans that play to their strengths - which you don't have at all yet at U12.
Some are absolutely wonderful and put unbelievable amounts of time and energy into the club. Others suck all that energy right out, either through being completely uninterested in their kids or demanding a paved road straight into the national team for their half-talented sprog.
I did U12 before I moved over to the U16 last season. Must admit I like the U16 age group a lot better to train and coach. The downside is they're all fitter and more skillful than I ever was, but I like working out good game plans that play to their strengths - which you don't have at all yet at U12.
Is this ‘parents being dicks’ a new thing, as I can only recall decent parents being the coaches and driving us to games ? They also turned the other way and allowed our underage drinking. The parents then seems to fall into 3 camps:
1. The coaches - ex first teamers who although old and fat , could still teach us and got involved on the pitch pre game with some very old tracksuits and boots from the 70’s
2. The drivers - those who did the admin and drove us to games, but didn’t ever really seem to know that much about rugby and would just come up with helpful comments like ‘lads, those Berry Hill lads really pasted you didn’t they ho ho ho!’
3. The disinterested - men and women who were often around, usually in the bar, rather than watching the games. This was pre mobile phones, the use of which you can spot disinterested parents.
1. The coaches - ex first teamers who although old and fat , could still teach us and got involved on the pitch pre game with some very old tracksuits and boots from the 70’s
2. The drivers - those who did the admin and drove us to games, but didn’t ever really seem to know that much about rugby and would just come up with helpful comments like ‘lads, those Berry Hill lads really pasted you didn’t they ho ho ho!’
3. The disinterested - men and women who were often around, usually in the bar, rather than watching the games. This was pre mobile phones, the use of which you can spot disinterested parents.
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clydecloggie
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I'd say 90% of parents are no problem at all apart from the ones who are so disinterested in their kids it makes my heart bleed for them, 5% are irreplaceable and keep the club afloat, the remaining 5% are why I'm seriously considering chucking the whole coaching thing after the coming season.
Last game we played, we came up against a team with ferocious breakdown work. As a result, we kept having very slow ball. One dad kept volleying abuse at our scrum half for being too slow. He was very obviously not considering that perhaps his front-row son who was trundling along nowhere near the action unless it came his way by chance, might have made a difference by putting a bit of effort in to get to more breakdowns himself. When I told him to stop insulting my players he went off in a huff which improved touchline atmosphere no end.
And then there's the guy who is the self-declared keeper of rugby values, constantly berating others for 'soccer behaviour'. He is also the guy who, in any tight game and regardless of ref quality, will holler constant abuse at the ref, arms out wide in his jesus christ pose, head shakes, throw away arm gestures. Doesn't help he's an ex-international player that half the club looks up to.
The trouble is that as head coach, apparently these people are my responsibility because their kids play in my team...
Last game we played, we came up against a team with ferocious breakdown work. As a result, we kept having very slow ball. One dad kept volleying abuse at our scrum half for being too slow. He was very obviously not considering that perhaps his front-row son who was trundling along nowhere near the action unless it came his way by chance, might have made a difference by putting a bit of effort in to get to more breakdowns himself. When I told him to stop insulting my players he went off in a huff which improved touchline atmosphere no end.
And then there's the guy who is the self-declared keeper of rugby values, constantly berating others for 'soccer behaviour'. He is also the guy who, in any tight game and regardless of ref quality, will holler constant abuse at the ref, arms out wide in his jesus christ pose, head shakes, throw away arm gestures. Doesn't help he's an ex-international player that half the club looks up to.
The trouble is that as head coach, apparently these people are my responsibility because their kids play in my team...
Speaking of ex-international pricks.
My last year of coaching, 2002, I was promoted to assistant coach of the First XV at our school, the peak of my coaching career.
Buck Shelford came and watched our annual local derby, played for "The Stott Cup". We came away with a narrow win.
Later that year, Buck was the guest speaker at our school graduation. He started his speech by saying he'd been at the match, had thought the opposition were a better team than us, but noted that we'd won anyway.
He said, "It just goes to show..."
And we all waited to hear some wisdom about perseverance, or beating the odds or something like that.
"...that sometimes the donkeys win."
It could have been funny if he'd said it with any comic timing, or irony or lightness. But he said it with withering scorn and contempt.
His whole speech was a nasty, cynical rant. It was pretty horrifying. A prick of a man.
My last year of coaching, 2002, I was promoted to assistant coach of the First XV at our school, the peak of my coaching career.
Buck Shelford came and watched our annual local derby, played for "The Stott Cup". We came away with a narrow win.
Later that year, Buck was the guest speaker at our school graduation. He started his speech by saying he'd been at the match, had thought the opposition were a better team than us, but noted that we'd won anyway.
He said, "It just goes to show..."
And we all waited to hear some wisdom about perseverance, or beating the odds or something like that.
"...that sometimes the donkeys win."
It could have been funny if he'd said it with any comic timing, or irony or lightness. But he said it with withering scorn and contempt.
His whole speech was a nasty, cynical rant. It was pretty horrifying. A prick of a man.
Was it the scrotum thing you think? Would definitely piss me off.FujiKiwi wrote: Tue Jul 28, 2020 8:00 am Buck just seems an angry, angry man. I think I saw an in-depth magazine profile a few years ago that suggests he feels life has screwed him over.
Well, life is screwing you over when someone rips your ball out of your bag.
But no, I think his grievances are to do with the way he has been treated by New Zealand rugby, going right back to his axing as a player, but also in his being denied coaching opportunities, I think. Something like that, as I recall.
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clydecloggie
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Nah, not naming him. Thing is, either side of the game he'll be a textbook positive coach, he puts so many things in motion at the club, it's knighthood material. But Mr Hyde comes out to play when the match starts - guess he's just so invested in getting a result that he loses all sense of perspective.Yeeb wrote: Tue Jul 28, 2020 7:25 am Ex international or not, he sounds like a prick
Care to name him ?
Yelling at kids on a pitch just isn’t cool no matter how you package it
Anyway, enough of that.
Have any of you guys had to work with the half-game rule yet? I'm very worried - I'm starting the season with 48 players for 2 teams, probably growing to 50+ as the season progresses. We can put 22 players on the match form. If I do that though, 14 players will only get 30 minutes of rugby (U16 play 2x30 mins) a week and the constant chopping an changing of the line up during the match will annoy the players and adversely affect the quality of play (and by extension the fun the players have) - that's the experience we had last season. What I'm thinking of is going down to match day squads of 20 instead - but that means if there are few injuries, players that are fit to play won't play at all. I'm thinking it's better to get good game time 4 weeks out of 5 and sit one out, than to get limited game time every week all season long. Thoughts?
Alternatively, I'll just make training extra brutal and ensure we have at least 8 injured players every week
Far younger age than you. But it's important to remember that the guys who aren't getting to play, would almost certainly rather play in a losing game, than just spectate a winning one. And whilst we can get drunk after a match, I've had a great time playing with my mates and after, in losing games, as well as winning ones.clydecloggie wrote: Tue Jul 28, 2020 9:17 amNah, not naming him. Thing is, either side of the game he'll be a textbook positive coach, he puts so many things in motion at the club, it's knighthood material. But Mr Hyde comes out to play when the match starts - guess he's just so invested in getting a result that he loses all sense of perspective.Yeeb wrote: Tue Jul 28, 2020 7:25 am Ex international or not, he sounds like a prick
Care to name him ?
Yelling at kids on a pitch just isn’t cool no matter how you package it
Anyway, enough of that.
Have any of you guys had to work with the half-game rule yet? I'm very worried - I'm starting the season with 48 players for 2 teams, probably growing to 50+ as the season progresses. We can put 22 players on the match form. If I do that though, 14 players will only get 30 minutes of rugby (U16 play 2x30 mins) a week and the constant chopping an changing of the line up during the match will annoy the players and adversely affect the quality of play (and by extension the fun the players have) - that's the experience we had last season. What I'm thinking of is going down to match day squads of 20 instead - but that means if there are few injuries, players that are fit to play won't play at all. I'm thinking it's better to get good game time 4 weeks out of 5 and sit one out, than to get limited game time every week all season long. Thoughts?
Alternatively, I'll just make training extra brutal and ensure we have at least 8 injured players every week
I think the idea is also to try and spread gametime over the season (as well as a game), so I think you can probably setup a broad plan at the start, tell all the parents and players what the plan is, and why. Then rather than making massive changes each week, percolate them through. Obviously injuries/absentees will need to be slotted in somehow.
Give a man a fire and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.
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clydecloggie
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That's what I thought until funnily enough the 1st XV subs came to me last season to say they'd rather not play than continue the constant subbing on and off to get game time and jeopardise the resultRaggs wrote: Tue Jul 28, 2020 9:24 amFar younger age than you. But it's important to remember that the guys who aren't getting to play, would almost certainly rather play in a losing game, than just spectate a winning one. And whilst we can get drunk after a match, I've had a great time playing with my mates and after, in losing games, as well as winning ones.clydecloggie wrote: Tue Jul 28, 2020 9:17 amNah, not naming him. Thing is, either side of the game he'll be a textbook positive coach, he puts so many things in motion at the club, it's knighthood material. But Mr Hyde comes out to play when the match starts - guess he's just so invested in getting a result that he loses all sense of perspective.Yeeb wrote: Tue Jul 28, 2020 7:25 am Ex international or not, he sounds like a prick
Care to name him ?
Yelling at kids on a pitch just isn’t cool no matter how you package it
Anyway, enough of that.
Have any of you guys had to work with the half-game rule yet? I'm very worried - I'm starting the season with 48 players for 2 teams, probably growing to 50+ as the season progresses. We can put 22 players on the match form. If I do that though, 14 players will only get 30 minutes of rugby (U16 play 2x30 mins) a week and the constant chopping an changing of the line up during the match will annoy the players and adversely affect the quality of play (and by extension the fun the players have) - that's the experience we had last season. What I'm thinking of is going down to match day squads of 20 instead - but that means if there are few injuries, players that are fit to play won't play at all. I'm thinking it's better to get good game time 4 weeks out of 5 and sit one out, than to get limited game time every week all season long. Thoughts?
Alternatively, I'll just make training extra brutal and ensure we have at least 8 injured players every week
I think the idea is also to try and spread gametime over the season (as well as a game), so I think you can probably setup a broad plan at the start, tell all the parents and players what the plan is, and why. Then rather than making massive changes each week, percolate them through. Obviously injuries/absentees will need to be slotted in somehow.
. So within that team we went down to some players only getting 10 minutes play time, which made me very uncomfortable. Especially because they tended to be the younger guys who were playing one year up from their own age group due to being the best of that group...It's what I desperately want to avoid this time around.For the 2nd XV, we'll possibly keep it going at 22 players and spread the game time around to develop everyone as well as we can. It's the 1st XV where in my view the 'participation thinking' of the Union (use 22 players and give them a half game each at least) isn't entirely aligned with the mindset of the top players at that age - which can potentially be solved by not using 22 players.
Hmm. That's awkward.clydecloggie wrote: Tue Jul 28, 2020 9:34 amThat's what I thought until funnily enough the 1st XV subs came to me last season to say they'd rather not play than continue the constant subbing on and off to get game time and jeopardise the result
For the 2nd XV, we'll possibly keep it going at 22 players and spread the game time around to develop everyone as well as we can. It's the 1st XV where in my view the 'participation thinking' of the Union (use 22 players and give them a half game each at least) isn't entirely aligned with the mindset of the top players at that age - which can potentially be solved by not using 22 players.
Maybe explain to them that this is not professional rugby, this is not international rugby. This is sport and a game. It's nice to win, but if they dream of reaching the serious stuff, then gametime is important for everyone. Getting used to playing with others, improving weaknesses, adapting etc. Point out that this is still training, not the end point.
Give a man a fire and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.
Anything to do with him being a prick?FujiKiwi wrote: Tue Jul 28, 2020 8:59 am
But no, I think his grievances are to do with the way he has been treated by New Zealand rugby, going right back to his axing as a player, but also in his being denied coaching opportunities, I think. Something like that, as I recall.
Bit of a bump.
How has everyone found the last season or so???
It's completely screwed over my u9s, supposed to be learning to tackle. Was deliberately taking it slow, especially as only allowed limited contact, then along came lockdowns, and I feel like we've barely got anywhere. Now the ground is rock hard and I've no interest in making the kids hate the idea of tackling because the ground is like a rock. We'll get to it eventually I guess.
Also seemed to have lost a coach permanently, and another is off doing sailing for the summer (mostly). So it's usually just the two of us, was hoping/aiming to be upto 5! so a bit of a bump to earth.
RFU have said that the first 3 months of the new season (sept-dec) will be run on the previous seasons rules, so we'll have time to introduce just tackling again, before introducing rucks and mauls I believe.
Membership has fluctuated a bit, I expected tackling to make a dent, and it has done (even though we've barely done any), but the pandemic has taken a bite too. Still getting around 13 regularly (was getting upto 18-20 before), and probably have 17-18 on the books as such. The whole club has taken a knock, and there seems to be little organisation at the moment, just people getting on with it and almost waiting for the new season and hopefully normality.
Found myself watching u10s games that are on youtube, to try and see what level I should be hoping for. Don't think we're far off thankfully, we run sideways and backwards with the best of them, rarely string together passes when actually in a game, however I'm definitely doing something wrong, since our defence doesn't always clump together after each touch, perhaps that will resolve itself once we get to tackling/rucking though.
Watching some southern hemisphere (I'd guess NZ/Aus?) u10s matches too. They look like they've got 13-15 players a side, 5 man scrums I think, 5 man lineouts. All far more similar to the senior game in that sense, all too familiar in watching them all clump up, run sideways, and the big/quick ones scoring the tries through individual ability though :D. I just wonder how many kids go through a game doing almost nothing at all when there's that many on the pitch.
How has everyone found the last season or so???
It's completely screwed over my u9s, supposed to be learning to tackle. Was deliberately taking it slow, especially as only allowed limited contact, then along came lockdowns, and I feel like we've barely got anywhere. Now the ground is rock hard and I've no interest in making the kids hate the idea of tackling because the ground is like a rock. We'll get to it eventually I guess.
Also seemed to have lost a coach permanently, and another is off doing sailing for the summer (mostly). So it's usually just the two of us, was hoping/aiming to be upto 5! so a bit of a bump to earth.
RFU have said that the first 3 months of the new season (sept-dec) will be run on the previous seasons rules, so we'll have time to introduce just tackling again, before introducing rucks and mauls I believe.
Membership has fluctuated a bit, I expected tackling to make a dent, and it has done (even though we've barely done any), but the pandemic has taken a bite too. Still getting around 13 regularly (was getting upto 18-20 before), and probably have 17-18 on the books as such. The whole club has taken a knock, and there seems to be little organisation at the moment, just people getting on with it and almost waiting for the new season and hopefully normality.
Found myself watching u10s games that are on youtube, to try and see what level I should be hoping for. Don't think we're far off thankfully, we run sideways and backwards with the best of them, rarely string together passes when actually in a game, however I'm definitely doing something wrong, since our defence doesn't always clump together after each touch, perhaps that will resolve itself once we get to tackling/rucking though.
Watching some southern hemisphere (I'd guess NZ/Aus?) u10s matches too. They look like they've got 13-15 players a side, 5 man scrums I think, 5 man lineouts. All far more similar to the senior game in that sense, all too familiar in watching them all clump up, run sideways, and the big/quick ones scoring the tries through individual ability though :D. I just wonder how many kids go through a game doing almost nothing at all when there's that many on the pitch.
Give a man a fire and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.
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clydecloggie
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Coming to the end of another season killed by Covid.
We actually started league matches back in September, but that was stopped after two games and never restarted.
We were lucky in a way that we were allowed to keep training, and play matches among ourselves within the club. We can field two full XVs in all age groups, so they've all had their weekly games. The quality wasn't great but we were pretty successful in making two equal teams week in week out, meaning we've had a few draws and loads of one-score games in that time.
The big positive for me has been the development of new players. In the U16s, we've had about 10 new kids show up, who have all stayed and have developed much more quickly than in a normal season where the emphasis would have been on bringing them into the 2nd XV at some point. But now, by playing matches within the group, they've come on as players so quickly it's quite amazing to see.
It was more difficult to keep the top boys interested, as they were p[laying well below their own level in those matches - occasional bursts to manage the scoreline followed by a lot of bored plodding in second gear. We actually moved 8 of them up to the U18s in February, which was the right call for everyone.
Really hoping for a normal season next...
We actually started league matches back in September, but that was stopped after two games and never restarted.
We were lucky in a way that we were allowed to keep training, and play matches among ourselves within the club. We can field two full XVs in all age groups, so they've all had their weekly games. The quality wasn't great but we were pretty successful in making two equal teams week in week out, meaning we've had a few draws and loads of one-score games in that time.
The big positive for me has been the development of new players. In the U16s, we've had about 10 new kids show up, who have all stayed and have developed much more quickly than in a normal season where the emphasis would have been on bringing them into the 2nd XV at some point. But now, by playing matches within the group, they've come on as players so quickly it's quite amazing to see.
It was more difficult to keep the top boys interested, as they were p[laying well below their own level in those matches - occasional bursts to manage the scoreline followed by a lot of bored plodding in second gear. We actually moved 8 of them up to the U18s in February, which was the right call for everyone.
Really hoping for a normal season next...
Our club starts at u6s I believe, but there is a tots rugby group locally.tc27 wrote: Tue May 18, 2021 2:21 pm Question that might do well here - when is the right age to get them started?
I'd say early as possible. It's sport, it's socialising, there's no immediate bad side. The issue as always, would be the coaches. I'm not a professional coach, I'm not a trained coach, I'm a dad who plays at a very low level himself. Whilst I am obviously trying to make sure they get better at rugby, I'm mostly focusing on trying to make sure they have fun playing, since if they are having fun, they'll want to keep playing.
Some coaches seem to take it differently, you read/see videos, of young kids doing bleep tests at start of season etc etc.
Give a man a fire and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.
Agree with this. Until I had kids I was all up for getting them involved and playing as soon as possible but they are just not that interested in it all, apart from the running about bit.Raggs wrote: Tue May 18, 2021 2:34 pmOur club starts at u6s I believe, but there is a tots rugby group locally.tc27 wrote: Tue May 18, 2021 2:21 pm Question that might do well here - when is the right age to get them started?
I'd say early as possible. It's sport, it's socialising, there's no immediate bad side. The issue as always, would be the coaches. I'm not a professional coach, I'm not a trained coach, I'm a dad who plays at a very low level himself. Whilst I am obviously trying to make sure they get better at rugby, I'm mostly focusing on trying to make sure they have fun playing, since if they are having fun, they'll want to keep playing.
Some coaches seem to take it differently, you read/see videos, of young kids doing bleep tests at start of season etc etc.
Our 2 (just 3 and 4.5) do rugbytots which they both love. It's mainly about getting them to think as a team but also subtly throws in some very basic skills development, its great.
All the money you made will never buy back your soul
To be honest, at that age, I'd give them all foam balls, and tell them to run around like idiots throwing them at each other. Evasion, space seeking, picking up objects on the move, and distributing (albeit not quite the aim). Anyone who caught a ball would get bonus praise :D.Slick wrote: Tue May 18, 2021 2:39 pmAgree with this. Until I had kids I was all up for getting them involved and playing as soon as possible but they are just not that interested in it all, apart from the running about bit.Raggs wrote: Tue May 18, 2021 2:34 pmOur club starts at u6s I believe, but there is a tots rugby group locally.tc27 wrote: Tue May 18, 2021 2:21 pm Question that might do well here - when is the right age to get them started?
I'd say early as possible. It's sport, it's socialising, there's no immediate bad side. The issue as always, would be the coaches. I'm not a professional coach, I'm not a trained coach, I'm a dad who plays at a very low level himself. Whilst I am obviously trying to make sure they get better at rugby, I'm mostly focusing on trying to make sure they have fun playing, since if they are having fun, they'll want to keep playing.
Some coaches seem to take it differently, you read/see videos, of young kids doing bleep tests at start of season etc etc.
Our 2 (just 3 and 4.5) do rugbytots which they both love. It's mainly about getting them to think as a team but also subtly throws in some very basic skills development, its great.
Give a man a fire and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.
That's the boy's favourite bit! I watched him last week looking for a bit of space and then throwing in an outrageous sidestep which had 3 defenders clutching at thin air. I nearly cried. Really didRaggs wrote: Tue May 18, 2021 2:42 pmTo be honest, at that age, I'd give them all foam balls, and tell them to run around like idiots throwing them at each other. Evasion, space seeking, picking up objects on the move, and distributing (albeit not quite the aim). Anyone who caught a ball would get bonus praise :D.Slick wrote: Tue May 18, 2021 2:39 pmAgree with this. Until I had kids I was all up for getting them involved and playing as soon as possible but they are just not that interested in it all, apart from the running about bit.Raggs wrote: Tue May 18, 2021 2:34 pm
Our club starts at u6s I believe, but there is a tots rugby group locally.
I'd say early as possible. It's sport, it's socialising, there's no immediate bad side. The issue as always, would be the coaches. I'm not a professional coach, I'm not a trained coach, I'm a dad who plays at a very low level himself. Whilst I am obviously trying to make sure they get better at rugby, I'm mostly focusing on trying to make sure they have fun playing, since if they are having fun, they'll want to keep playing.
Some coaches seem to take it differently, you read/see videos, of young kids doing bleep tests at start of season etc etc.
Our 2 (just 3 and 4.5) do rugbytots which they both love. It's mainly about getting them to think as a team but also subtly throws in some very basic skills development, its great.
All the money you made will never buy back your soul
Lovely :D.Slick wrote: Tue May 18, 2021 2:45 pmThat's the boy's favourite bit! I watched him last week looking for a bit of space and then throwing in an outrageous sidestep which had 3 defenders clutching at thin air. I nearly cried. Really did
Just wait until some of them start working together! My lot now are getting good at screaming shield (our word for defensive line), not so good at actually listening and acting on it yet, but for me the biggest part of rugby at lower levels is communication, so if they're happy to yell at each other (positively) it's a big step. It's nice when you see a proper defensive line being made after several touches, when so often you could throw a blanket over all the players on both sides at that point.
My boy seems to be gravitating to a scrum half role, mostly because he's always chasing the ball so he's first there, but a few weeks ago, the girl on our team (really good rugby brain), spotted space on one side, rushed over, my son spotted she'd gone to space, gave a nice pass and a good try resulted. So satisfying to see them click a little. Desperate to get them tackling, feels like that will move them forwards a lot more now.
Give a man a fire and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.
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clydecloggie
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Agree with all of the above. Should you have the misfortune of running into a kiddie coach with delusions of grandeur, either run a mile to the next club or start coaching yourself.
My boys started at 4 years old, mainly busied themselves with counting blades of grass and spotting interesting clouds for a few years before emerging as players who actually know what they're doing.
It's all about fun, running around, learning some very basic skills. It won't resemble proper rugby until they're about 11-12, and any coach insisting it should look like rugby sooner than that should be gently shown the door. All IMO of course.
My boys started at 4 years old, mainly busied themselves with counting blades of grass and spotting interesting clouds for a few years before emerging as players who actually know what they're doing.
It's all about fun, running around, learning some very basic skills. It won't resemble proper rugby until they're about 11-12, and any coach insisting it should look like rugby sooner than that should be gently shown the door. All IMO of course.
So how's everyone's coaching season going?
My lot are now getting into the tackling full on. u10s, but as last season was basically buggered, they've only really got on with tackling this season. Some are actually not too terrible. Plenty of wavy arms, but we're working on trying to keep that to a minimum. Had an unfortunate concussion very early on, with two players tackling either side, and meeting in the middle (tall and small, tall ones jaw hit the little ones head, poor bugger was in tears when I told him he couldn't play for a few weeks now :(). Freak incident unfortunately, both were in good safe tackling positions.
Lost a lot of the other progress made previously though, with disruption, summer, and now having to think about tackling, getting into decent defensive positions has been lost a bit, and we flock like seagulls around a chip. But there again, getting slightly better at standing behind the player with the ball, rather than in front! Progress!
Got our first festival for ages, in a few weeks, playing u9s laws, so really looking forward to that, going to use the next 3 training sessions to hopefully make it so they don't look too awful :D.
Actually getting quite a few new players recently, most of them are on the larger side too, which of course doesn't hurt to have. Still hoping that a mate brings his kid. Severely overweight, but also generally enormous, his dad is a big fella too who still plays, so he's hoping to get him along too. He'd come before a couple of seasons back, and had really nice handling skills, would love to see what he could do now it's not tag!
It does make me feel slightly better to have seen research (actually based on VR) that children are still having to actively develop motor skills until the age of 10 at least, so expecting them to not only think about physically moving, but also looking for space, organising defensively etc, is still a lofty goal, and not necessarily achievable for all of them at the moment. Have got a couple that are starting to actively call out if they're in space though!
My lot are now getting into the tackling full on. u10s, but as last season was basically buggered, they've only really got on with tackling this season. Some are actually not too terrible. Plenty of wavy arms, but we're working on trying to keep that to a minimum. Had an unfortunate concussion very early on, with two players tackling either side, and meeting in the middle (tall and small, tall ones jaw hit the little ones head, poor bugger was in tears when I told him he couldn't play for a few weeks now :(). Freak incident unfortunately, both were in good safe tackling positions.
Lost a lot of the other progress made previously though, with disruption, summer, and now having to think about tackling, getting into decent defensive positions has been lost a bit, and we flock like seagulls around a chip. But there again, getting slightly better at standing behind the player with the ball, rather than in front! Progress!
Got our first festival for ages, in a few weeks, playing u9s laws, so really looking forward to that, going to use the next 3 training sessions to hopefully make it so they don't look too awful :D.
Actually getting quite a few new players recently, most of them are on the larger side too, which of course doesn't hurt to have. Still hoping that a mate brings his kid. Severely overweight, but also generally enormous, his dad is a big fella too who still plays, so he's hoping to get him along too. He'd come before a couple of seasons back, and had really nice handling skills, would love to see what he could do now it's not tag!
It does make me feel slightly better to have seen research (actually based on VR) that children are still having to actively develop motor skills until the age of 10 at least, so expecting them to not only think about physically moving, but also looking for space, organising defensively etc, is still a lofty goal, and not necessarily achievable for all of them at the moment. Have got a couple that are starting to actively call out if they're in space though!
Give a man a fire and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.
Mine has started P1 (5 yrs) mini rugby at the local club. I don’t think he’s enjoying it that much though as a lot of the other kids know each other and it’s making him feel a bit left out - may leave it until next season. Although he’s really coming on when he does get stuck in.
Amusingly when I was signing him up I mentioned 3 times that I’d be keen on getting involved in the coaching but the administrator always seemed to dodge the question. Found out why at the first session - 4 Scotland internationals (1 present, 3 past) have kids in the group and are leading the coaching! Anyway, they have been great about me getting involved as it helps the boy keep interested
Amusingly when I was signing him up I mentioned 3 times that I’d be keen on getting involved in the coaching but the administrator always seemed to dodge the question. Found out why at the first session - 4 Scotland internationals (1 present, 3 past) have kids in the group and are leading the coaching! Anyway, they have been great about me getting involved as it helps the boy keep interested
All the money you made will never buy back your soul
Even with 4 coaches like that, I'd still want more. Extra pairs of eyes are always handy. There again, I'm talking from a position of us lot just being dads, one of whom I don't think has ever played himself!Slick wrote: Wed Oct 27, 2021 9:37 pm Mine has started P1 (5 yrs) mini rugby at the local club. I don’t think he’s enjoying it that much though as a lot of the other kids know each other and it’s making him feel a bit left out - may leave it until next season. Although he’s really coming on when he does get stuck in.
Amusingly when I was signing him up I mentioned 3 times that I’d be keen on getting involved in the coaching but the administrator always seemed to dodge the question. Found out why at the first session - 4 Scotland internationals (1 present, 3 past) have kids in the group and are leading the coaching! Anyway, they have been great about me getting involved as it helps the boy keep interested
Don't think there's been issues with kids being left out, but they do like to pass to their friends, especially at that age, or if not friends, then the quickest one of the group. Trying to make sure everyone gets involved is tricky.
Give a man a fire and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.
So had a festival today. First time my lot have played another team with contact, against teams that have most likely had at least some experience of it for over a season. Plus I don't know what's going on with the breeding pools, but apparently our lot haven't been eating right, since I only saw perhaps one other player as small as our smaller ones (and we've got 3 of them), with most of the kids I refer to as our bigger ones, being only average for the teams we played against!
First game was a little embarrassing to be honest. It almost looked like they were waving as the other team ran past :(. By the 3rd game though things were improving, but to give an idea, that was the game we scored our first try in, and didn't score any more in that game either.
However, by the fifth and final game, despite probably playing against the biggest side we'd come up against (and a few high/early shots from them), basically all of them had started putting in their tackles, and running with a bit more purpose themselves, I'd perhaps even go so far as to suggest (despite no one keeping score) we may have even "won" that one.
So after that, and everyone having a good time, it was extremely nice to receive this message on the group chat (slightly paraphrased).
"My son absolutely loved it! Thank you. He told me Raggs was really encouraging and didn't get cross when they lost. And that my son felt you just wanted them all to enjoy themselves and play their best."
Absolutely dead chuffed to get that message. I couldn't give a rat's bum about winning/losing, I really do just want them to try their best and have fun, and to know that at least one kid gets that, makes me really happy.
So there's my proud coach moment :D. Proud dad moment was my son, as probably the smallest, was one of the main tacklers on those big lumps.
First game was a little embarrassing to be honest. It almost looked like they were waving as the other team ran past :(. By the 3rd game though things were improving, but to give an idea, that was the game we scored our first try in, and didn't score any more in that game either.
However, by the fifth and final game, despite probably playing against the biggest side we'd come up against (and a few high/early shots from them), basically all of them had started putting in their tackles, and running with a bit more purpose themselves, I'd perhaps even go so far as to suggest (despite no one keeping score) we may have even "won" that one.
So after that, and everyone having a good time, it was extremely nice to receive this message on the group chat (slightly paraphrased).
"My son absolutely loved it! Thank you. He told me Raggs was really encouraging and didn't get cross when they lost. And that my son felt you just wanted them all to enjoy themselves and play their best."
Absolutely dead chuffed to get that message. I couldn't give a rat's bum about winning/losing, I really do just want them to try their best and have fun, and to know that at least one kid gets that, makes me really happy.
So there's my proud coach moment :D. Proud dad moment was my son, as probably the smallest, was one of the main tacklers on those big lumps.
Give a man a fire and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.
Started helping My club with the Kids (My official position is in the committee and photographer)
The Kids are great and we have a thriving bunch thanks to a PE teacher doing a fantastic job recruiting.
Enjoying it (can't do the games as this would be too much) with the rest of my duties (Senior Training and games).
The Kids are great and we have a thriving bunch thanks to a PE teacher doing a fantastic job recruiting.
Enjoying it (can't do the games as this would be too much) with the rest of my duties (Senior Training and games).
That's awesome, Raggs. Well done mate.
Our problem at the moment is too many kids, think we must have had over 40 on Sunday. The obvious solution is to split it into two separate sessions running concurrently but for some reason the main coaches don't want to do that.
Our problem at the moment is too many kids, think we must have had over 40 on Sunday. The obvious solution is to split it into two separate sessions running concurrently but for some reason the main coaches don't want to do that.
All the money you made will never buy back your soul
The problem with splitting is it can be seen as streaming, which is frowned on (and rightly so). If you mix it up every week you're probably alright though.Slick wrote: Mon Nov 22, 2021 9:55 am That's awesome, Raggs. Well done mate.
Our problem at the moment is too many kids, think we must have had over 40 on Sunday. The obvious solution is to split it into two separate sessions running concurrently but for some reason the main coaches don't want to do that.
I'm starting to struggle with things when we get 16+, can't imagine what it's like with 40. I love encouraging each one individually during/after a session, and just don't have the time already. Can't imagine how you're supposed to cope with 40!
Give a man a fire and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.
Yes, it certainly wouldn't be streaming, just a random line down the middle each week.Raggs wrote: Mon Nov 22, 2021 10:41 amThe problem with splitting is it can be seen as streaming, which is frowned on (and rightly so). If you mix it up every week you're probably alright though.Slick wrote: Mon Nov 22, 2021 9:55 am That's awesome, Raggs. Well done mate.
Our problem at the moment is too many kids, think we must have had over 40 on Sunday. The obvious solution is to split it into two separate sessions running concurrently but for some reason the main coaches don't want to do that.
I'm starting to struggle with things when we get 16+, can't imagine what it's like with 40. I love encouraging each one individually during/after a session, and just don't have the time already. Can't imagine how you're supposed to cope with 40!
That's the main problem for me, not being able to give encouragement or a little tap on the head to everyone. I think we had about 5 kids leave early because they got a bit bored or were feeling left out. I guess it's a good problem to have at the moment, but it's an issue long term if these kids don't want to go back to rugby because of earlier issues.
All the money you made will never buy back your soul