The Official English Rugby Thread

[SaintK]

Kruis retiring from rugby in May.

No prem homecoming on the horizon from him.

That's a bit of a surprise given the previous comments he's made!
Must be a lucrative opportunity off the field for him to change his mind

There have been approaches and offers to return to the Premiership but he added: 'I wouldn't play for another UK club apart from Sarries. I've taken a few months thinking this over. I've been very lucky to still have some really good offers on the table, whether it's in Japan or some clubs back home, but I need to cut my career short as there's such an opportunity off-field.'

[SaintK]

Jonathan Joseph staying at Bath after all.

England international centre Jonathan Joseph has agreed terms for a new two-year contract extension to stay at the Rec according to the latest reports.
Joseph, 30, is out of contract at Bath at the end of the season and the club had reportedly offered him a new one-year deal at the turn of the year, but now an improved two-year deal has been agreed with the 54-cap England international centre to extend his stay despite Sale Sharks reportedly keen to lure the outside centre north.

[Phredd]

Wasps have signed Burger Odendaal from the Lions

[duke]

Jonathan Joseph staying at Bath after all.

England international centre Jonathan Joseph has agreed terms for a new two-year contract extension to stay at the Rec according to the latest reports.
Joseph, 30, is out of contract at Bath at the end of the season and the club had reportedly offered him a new one-year deal at the turn of the year, but now an improved two-year deal has been agreed with the 54-cap England international centre to extend his stay despite Sale Sharks reportedly keen to lure the outside centre north.

They've just binned the attack coach as well and the rumour mill has Van Graan bringing De Allende with him from Munster.

[JM2K6]

The power of money.

Bath have some pretty good young players so I want them to turn it around, but it's still a bit grim that this is what it takes.

[duke]

The power of money.

Bath have some pretty good young players so I want them to turn it around, but it's still a bit grim that this is what it takes.

Tight forwards and removing Hooper also need to be on the list.

[JM2K6]

The power of money.

Bath have some pretty good young players so I want them to turn it around, but it's still a bit grim that this is what it takes.

Tight forwards and removing Hooper also need to be on the list.

Yeah. They have some beef in the pack but it lacks out and out class; when everyone's fit it's a decent bunch but no-one who you'd really fear. Obano, Dunn, Boyce, Stuart, Ewels, McNally, Williams, Reid, Ellis, Bayliss - they'd all be useful squad players in most sides, but very few of them would start in the top 6 teams at full strength. They don't have an LCD / George / Marler / Sinckler / Itoje / Launchbury / Simmonds level player at all.

[notfatcat]

The power of money.

Bath have some pretty good young players so I want them to turn it around, but it's still a bit grim that this is what it takes.

Tight forwards and removing Hooper also need to be on the list.

The Scottish like their forwards to play in the homeland.

[inactionman]

I think it's all leading up to more changes in backroom in the offseason. I'd hope that's what compelled Joseph to re-sign.

It's an odd time at present, we've upped performances in recent weeks - although from very low base - but feels like we're in a holding pattern waiting for the end of season coaching changes (although not sure what the ultimate extent of that will be). Sad thing is we seem to constantly have these resets, and a few false dawns.

Wondering if Williams (outgoing attack coach) didn't agree with where he'd fit in the new structure. His exit seems a bit rapid and perfunctory.

[ASMO]

The power of money.

Bath have some pretty good young players so I want them to turn it around, but it's still a bit grim that this is what it takes.

Tight forwards and removing Hooper also need to be on the list.

Yeah. They have some beef in the pack but it lacks out and out class; when everyone's fit it's a decent bunch but no-one who you'd really fear. Obano, Dunn, Boyce, Stuart, Ewels, McNally, Williams, Reid, Ellis, Bayliss - they'd all be useful squad players in most sides, but very few of them would start in the top 6 teams at full strength. They don't have an LCD / George / Marler / Sinckler / Itoje / Launchbury / Simmonds level player at all.

Of all that list i think Reid is the standout for me, really good player and theyt need to keep hold of him.

[inactionman]

The power of money.

Bath have some pretty good young players so I want them to turn it around, but it's still a bit grim that this is what it takes.

Tight forwards and removing Hooper also need to be on the list.

Yeah. They have some beef in the pack but it lacks out and out class; when everyone's fit it's a decent bunch but no-one who you'd really fear. Obano, Dunn, Boyce, Stuart, Ewels, McNally, Williams, Reid, Ellis, Bayliss - they'd all be useful squad players in most sides, but very few of them would start in the top 6 teams at full strength. They don't have an LCD / George / Marler / Sinckler / Itoje / Launchbury / Simmonds level player at all.

What is it with you and Underhill? Should also include Faletau, for the 10 minutes or however much longer we'll see him for.

[JM2K6]

Tight forwards and removing Hooper also need to be on the list.

Yeah. They have some beef in the pack but it lacks out and out class; when everyone's fit it's a decent bunch but no-one who you'd really fear. Obano, Dunn, Boyce, Stuart, Ewels, McNally, Williams, Reid, Ellis, Bayliss - they'd all be useful squad players in most sides, but very few of them would start in the top 6 teams at full strength. They don't have an LCD / George / Marler / Sinckler / Itoje / Launchbury / Simmonds level player at all.

What is it with you and Underhill? Should also include Faletau, for the 10 minutes or however much longer we'll see him for.

I was going through their squad list on the site and honestly missed Underhill. Though I've not been impressed by his club displays at all - his best form has certainly been for England. You can definitely add him in as the sort of name they need a few of, though.

Faletau, however, has been a bag of shit for the majority of his time at Bath. Miles off the required standard.

[inactionman]

Yeah. They have some beef in the pack but it lacks out and out class; when everyone's fit it's a decent bunch but no-one who you'd really fear. Obano, Dunn, Boyce, Stuart, Ewels, McNally, Williams, Reid, Ellis, Bayliss - they'd all be useful squad players in most sides, but very few of them would start in the top 6 teams at full strength. They don't have an LCD / George / Marler / Sinckler / Itoje / Launchbury / Simmonds level player at all.

What is it with you and Underhill? Should also include Faletau, for the 10 minutes or however much longer we'll see him for.

I was going through their squad list on the site and honestly missed Underhill. Though I've not been impressed by his club displays at all - his best form has certainly been for England. You can definitely add him in as the sort of name they need a few of, though.

Faletau, however, has been a bag of shit for the majority of his time at Bath. Miles off the required standard.

Some very good early performance and then pretty much always injured. He's barely featured, sad to say.

[JM2K6]

What is it with you and Underhill? Should also include Faletau, for the 10 minutes or however much longer we'll see him for.

I was going through their squad list on the site and honestly missed Underhill. Though I've not been impressed by his club displays at all - his best form has certainly been for England. You can definitely add him in as the sort of name they need a few of, though.

Faletau, however, has been a bag of shit for the majority of his time at Bath. Miles off the required standard.

Some very good early performance and then pretty much always injured. He's barely featured, sad to say.

Sadly even when he played he was awful. Didn't stop Gatland giving him a Lions freebie, of course.

[Ovals]

Barbeary, Launchbury and Marchant all released

FORWARDS (15)
Ollie Chessum (Leicester Tigers, 1 cap)
Luke Cowan-Dickie (Exeter Chiefs, 33 caps)
Tom Curry (Sale Sharks, 38 caps)
Alex Dombrandt (Harlequins, 6 caps)
Charlie Ewels (Bath Rugby, 28 caps)
Ellis Genge (Leicester Tigers, 33 caps)
Jamie George (Saracens, 63 caps)
Maro Itoje (Saracens, 53 caps)
Nick Isiekwe (Saracens, 5 caps)
Courtney Lawes (Northampton Saints, 90 caps)
Joe Marler (Harlequins, 76 caps)
Bevan Rodd (Sale Sharks, 2 caps)
Sam Simmonds (Exeter Chiefs, 11 caps)
Kyle Sinckler (Bristol Bears, 49 caps)
Will Stuart (Bath Rugby, 17 caps)

BACKS (10)
Elliot Daly (Saracens, 54 caps)
George Ford (Leicester Tigers, 79 caps)
Max Malins (Saracens, 12 caps)
Jack Nowell (Exeter Chiefs, 36 caps)
Harry Randall (Bristol Bears, 3 caps)
Henry Slade (Exeter Chiefs, 45 caps)
Marcus Smith (Harlequins, 7 caps)
Freddie Steward (Leicester Tigers, 7 caps)
Manu Tuilagi (Sale Sharks, 46 caps)
Ben Youngs (Leicester Tigers, 114 caps)

[Hal Jordan]

So, probably

Genge
LCD
Sinckler
Itoje
Ewels
Lawes
Curry
Dombrandt

Youngs
Smith

Nowell
Tuilagi
Slade
Malins
Steward

Stuart
Marler
George
Isiekwe
Simmonds
Chessun
Randall
Daly

Standard almost no wingers, loads of locks, rush back Tuilagi to break inside 20 minutes and make use of that 6-2 bench with Randall probably ending up at wing at the end of the match.

[mos_eisely_]

George Kruis retiring from all rugby at the end of the season

[sockwithaticket]

Kruis retiring from rugby in May.

No prem homecoming on the horizon from him.

That's a bit of a surprise given the previous comments he's made!
Must be a lucrative opportunity off the field for him to change his mind

There have been approaches and offers to return to the Premiership but he added: 'I wouldn't play for another UK club apart from Sarries. I've taken a few months thinking this over. I've been very lucky to still have some really good offers on the table, whether it's in Japan or some clubs back home, but I need to cut my career short as there's such an opportunity off-field.'

Yeah, he seemed pretty set on coming back to give the next world cup a shot. Makes you wonder what the oppotunity is.

[SaintK]

Kruis retiring from rugby in May.

No prem homecoming on the horizon from him.

That's a bit of a surprise given the previous comments he's made!
Must be a lucrative opportunity off the field for him to change his mind

There have been approaches and offers to return to the Premiership but he added: 'I wouldn't play for another UK club apart from Sarries. I've taken a few months thinking this over. I've been very lucky to still have some really good offers on the table, whether it's in Japan or some clubs back home, but I need to cut my career short as there's such an opportunity off-field.'

Yeah, he seemed pretty set on coming back to give the next world cup a shot. Makes you wonder what the oppotunity is.

It's his own company that he set up with Dom Day. It was a CBD venture that has developed and expanded into a general "health and wellbeing" company and is doing pretty well.

[Margin__Walker]

England U20 squad for Friday. Good to see Arundell back and Cleaves get a first start.

1. Fin Baxter
2. Finn Theobald-Thomas (Worcester Warriors, Caps 1)
3. Will Hobson
4. Charlie Rice
5. Alfie Bell
6. Chandler Cunningham-South (London Irish, Caps 0)
7. Toby Knight
8. Emeka Ilione
9. Sam Edwards
10. Jamie Benson
11. Cassius Cleaves (Harlequins, Caps 0)
12. Ethan Grayson
13. Jacob Cusick (Leicester Tigers, Caps 0)
14. Deago Bailey
15. Henry Arundell

Replacements

16. Joe Vajner (London Irish, Caps 0)
17. Archie McArthur (Wasps, Caps 0)
18. Mike Summerfield
19. Lewis Chessum (Leicester Tigers, Caps 0)
20. Kofi Cripps
21. Matty Jones
22. Louie Johnson
23. Rekeiti Ma’asi White (Wasps, Caps 0)

[Raggs]

England U20 squad for Friday. Good to see Arundell back and Cleaves get a first start.

1. Fin Baxter
2. Finn Theobald-Thomas (Worcester Warriors, Caps 1)
3. Will Hobson
4. Charlie Rice
5. Alfie Bell
6. Chandler Cunningham-South (London Irish, Caps 0)
7. Toby Knight
8. Emeka Ilione
9. Sam Edwards
10. Jamie Benson
11. Cassius Cleaves (Harlequins, Caps 0)
12. Ethan Grayson
13. Jacob Cusick (Leicester Tigers, Caps 0)
14. Deago Bailey
15. Henry Arundell

Replacements

16. Joe Vajner (London Irish, Caps 0)
17. Archie McArthur (Wasps, Caps 0)
18. Mike Summerfield
19. Lewis Chessum (Leicester Tigers, Caps 0)
20. Kofi Cripps
21. Matty Jones
22. Louie Johnson
23. Rekeiti Ma’asi White (Wasps, Caps 0)

Didn't realise Ma'asi White was still young enough. He's big, but doesn't look huge now he's playing with adults, and from the bits I've seen of him, hasn't looked special in the championship, hoping he gets a bit of a spark.

[JM2K6]

Andy Bull has done a soft-focus piece on Ben Youngs: https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2022/ ... ugby-union

Remarkable just how hard he tries to praise him and can only come up with... he was fast, once, he's been around ages so has scored more tries than most, he's been picked by everyone, and he "is good at everything".

Meanwhile, while trying to praise him, he also points out that Youngs is notoriously thick; that other players are better attackers, better kickers, better passers, more creative; that Youngs' pass is slow (he doesn't mention inaccurate); that he's never be in the running for 6 Nations player of the tournament, let alone world player of the year; that he's just not as good as pretty much every other major country's 9.

But let's blow smoke up his arse anyway, because if he's been around that long he must be really good, right?

Right?

[SaintK]

Andy Bull has done a soft-focus piece on Ben Youngs: https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2022/ ... ugby-union

Remarkable just how hard he tries to praise him and can only come up with... he was fast, once, he's been around ages so has scored more tries than most, he's been picked by everyone, and he "is good at everything".

Meanwhile, while trying to praise him, he also points out that Youngs is notoriously thick; that other players are better attackers, better kickers, better passers, more creative; that Youngs' pass is slow (he doesn't mention inaccurate); that he's never be in the running for 6 Nations player of the tournament, let alone world player of the year; that he's just not as good as pretty much every other major country's 9.

But let's blow smoke up his arse anyway, because if he's been around that long he must be really good, right?

Right?

Quite

When Ben Youngs got married in 2015, his best man, Tom Croft, pulled together a collection of his favourite things Youngs had come out with in the years they’d been playing together and published them in a book called … Stuff Ben Said. There was the time Youngs asked if Danny DeVito and Arnold Schwarzenegger “were really twins”, when he said he “had only just learned he had two lungs”, asked whether the “place with all the stone heads was called Easter Egg Island”, and the one when he called his brother Tom Youngs to ask why his stew was so dry. “Did you add stock?” Tom asked: “Yes, two cubes.” “And did you add water to the cubes?” Pause. “Do I need to?”

[Paddington Bear]

Me reading all the PR this week about how Youngs is a great bloke

[Slick]

Good to see Arundell back

Poaching bastards

[Margin__Walker]

Good to see Arundell back

Poaching bastards

We're pretty shameless tbf

[Oxbow]

Saints have signed Callum Braley for 22/23. Seems a bit of an odd signing, I don't remember him tearing it up for either Gloucester or Italy and we're not really short at scrum half, though word is Lomani is off to Irish at the end of the season. Presumably backup to Mitchell, who seems unlikely to be away with England with the way Eddie sees things right now. Average signing for a sadly average club at the moment.

[JM2K6]

Me reading all the PR this week about how Youngs is a great bloke

If you want to annoy yourself at all, have all look at how many people are furiously defending him from any criticism in the comments.

[fishfoodie]

Me reading all the PR this week about how Youngs is a great bloke

If you want to annoy yourself at all, have all look at how many people are furiously defending him from any criticism in the comments.

We still want him in situ for as long as possible

[JM2K6]

That's low, man

[fishfoodie]

That's low, man

Sorry

Youngs provides a rare, comedy element to International Rugby games, & part of that is watching England fans going mental, when he does the same shit he's been doing for years, & then Eddie still leaves him on for 78 minutes

[Kawazaki]

Me reading all the PR this week about how Youngs is a great bloke

If you want to annoy yourself at all, have all look at how many people are furiously defending him from any criticism in the comments.

You see it all the time. The same people think Eddie Jones is a genius. They watch Youngs play like dogshit time and time again then say to themselves, "well, he's got 114 caps so he must be good" and then disbelieve their own eyes. Remember Eddie Jones telling the world that a team must have x-number of caps to win a RWC. He followed that up with a team that wins the RWC kicks the ball x-number of times. It becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy. And it's utter madness.

[SaintK]

Saints have signed Callum Braley for 22/23. Seems a bit of an odd signing, I don't remember him tearing it up for either Gloucester or Italy and we're not really short at scrum half, though word is Lomani is off to Irish at the end of the season. Presumably backup to Mitchell, who seems unlikely to be away with England with the way Eddie sees things right now. Average signing for a sadly average club at the moment.

Yes, an odd one. I thought Tom James is a reasonable replacement when Mitchell is out. Has Tupai's development stalled?

[Paddington Bear]

Me reading all the PR this week about how Youngs is a great bloke

If you want to annoy yourself at all, have all look at how many people are furiously defending him from any criticism in the comments.

You see it all the time. The same people think Eddie Jones is a genius. They watch Youngs play like dogshit time and time again then say to themselves, "well, he's got 114 caps so he must be good" and then disbelieve their own eyes. Remember Eddie Jones telling the world that a team must have x-number of caps to win a RWC. He followed that up with a team that wins the RWC kicks the ball x-number of times. It becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy. And it's utter madness.

I think in fairness a lot of this comes down to most rugby fans only watch c.10 games a year. And Youngs does, tbf to him, score a lot more tries than the average. So if you ask people somewhat less pathologically obsessed with the man than us what he's been up to the answer is probably scoring tries and doing so as long as anyone can remember.

[Oxbow]

Saints have signed Callum Braley for 22/23. Seems a bit of an odd signing, I don't remember him tearing it up for either Gloucester or Italy and we're not really short at scrum half, though word is Lomani is off to Irish at the end of the season. Presumably backup to Mitchell, who seems unlikely to be away with England with the way Eddie sees things right now. Average signing for a sadly average club at the moment.

Yes, an odd one. I thought Tom James is a reasonable replacement when Mitchell is out. Has Tupai's development stalled?

He's been playing down at Bedford, though I don't really know how he's been getting on. I think a lot of those type of players are struggling to push on without regular games in the A league. I've always been impressed with James, he's never let the side down when he has played.

[ASMO]

https://www.rugbypass.com/news/nothings ... 0Ti4_8zC6o

Gleeson talking about the possibility of Tuilagi making an appearance in the back row on Saturday, what a fucking complete arse clown and an insult to all the back rowers in the wider squad who got sent back to their clubs.

[Hal Jordan]

https://www.rugbypass.com/news/nothings ... 0Ti4_8zC6o

Gleeson talking about the possibility of Tuilagi making an appearance in the back row on Saturday, what a fucking complete arse clown and an insult to all the back rowers in the wider squad who got sent back to their clubs.

Andy Farrell: "I've been there, trust me, you don't want that."

[JM2K6]

Gosh it's very hard to understand why sane coaches don't hang around the English side long

[Paddington Bear]

Randall starting!

[JM2K6]

Wow.

Ben Youngs finally gets some positive press and gets dropped!

edit: Oh, Ewels starts. He giveth and he taketh away...