Young People are Lazy Bastards: It's Official

[Uncle fester]

I think they've got it sussed.
Instead of working themselves to the bone so that boomers can enjoy retirement (like gen z), they are going to crash everything so so they can buy it cheap later while having had a great time during their youth.

[petej]

https://www.bbc.com/worklife/article/20 ... burned-out

I knew, you knew it, they knew it and now it's official. Some shite about them having more stress but we can ignore that as they are also officially the moaniest shits that ever existed as well.

The inability to switch off is part of this. I've worked a job that due to its nature you couldn't take it home. Worked harder than I've ever worked but I switched off better because work couldn't follow me home. There is also the bullshit nature of modern work being called out.

I think they've got it sussed.
Instead of working themselves to the bone so that boomers can enjoy retirement (like gen z), they are going to crash everything so so they can buy it cheap later while having had a great time during their youth.

This as well. My pension is balls compared to older workers. Better to work 4 day weeks now than break myself working to retire when I might never be able to retire or if like my dad die before retiring or like my mum just after retiring. Also I will have spent more time with my son in 3.5 years than my dad did with me in 20 years.

[Niegs]

That article seems like a major generalization based on people who work shitty jobs that don't let them switch off. Don't like it? Find something different.

I worked for a college the last three years where lots are training for new careers, and worker shortages now would suggest people still are. (I'm back at school myself, going for a dream job in sport, and reckon half the people I see on this other college campus are over 25).

[OomStruisbaai]

To work is a privilege. Make the most of it.

[inactionman]

To work is a privilege. Make the most of it.

I feel blessed.

[sockwithaticket]

It's not just the Zers, me and my social circle are all mid-millenials (late 20s to early 30s) and we don't want to work either. There's a sense of futility to it. All the things work and putting in a solid effort were supposed to provide are at best uncertain these days. We'll probably never get retire and that's if the world hasn't already stopped being liveable due to climate change by then. Along the way we get to watch house prices continue to spiral out of reach while rent funnels money into someone else's pockets, wages lagging ever further behind the cost of living while those in certain socio-economic brackets become richer than ever. More wealth in fewer hands and the erosion of living conditions for the masses. And it's our efforts, our labour that generates the wealth being hoarded. Why on earth would we want to work?

Get the fucking guillotines out.

[sockwithaticket]

Oh Jesus when I saw the word futility I knew you were lying back on your chaise lounge in your cardigan and cords reading Proust. Read some proper shit like James Patterson and you would have some get up and go

Maybe once I'm done with Engels.

Also, I have never owned a cardigan, so there.

[Paddington Bear]

I think we're very aware that a lot of us have had a lot of education to sit on a laptop doing stuff of very questionable value.

[Torquemada 1420]

That article seems like a major generalization based on people who work shitty jobs that don't let them switch off. Don't like it? Find something different.

Don't like it, then get a qualification in something meaningful other than meeejuh studies or pollliticks.

[Torquemada 1420]

It's not just the Zers, me and my social circle are all mid-millenials (late 20s to early 30s) and we don't want to work either. There's a sense of futility to it. All the things work and putting in a solid effort were supposed to provide are at best uncertain these days. We'll probably never get retire and that's if the world hasn't already stopped being liveable due to climate change by then. Along the way we get to watch house prices continue to spiral out of reach while rent funnels money into someone else's pockets, wages lagging ever further behind the cost of living while those in certain socio-economic brackets become richer than ever. More wealth in fewer hands and the erosion of living conditions for the masses. And it's our efforts, our labour that generates the wealth being hoarded. Why on earth would we want to work?

Get the fucking guillotines out.

Sorry to say climate change and screwing the planet is a done deal whilst capitalism exists in its current form and people continue to breed like flies.

I've been saying for 2 decades that the UK (and US) mortgages systems are insane. It should be illegal to get a mortgage on a BTL for, say, more than 50% LTV. Instead we've had ludicrously cheap money and BTL deals even over 100% LTV which has now locked swathes out of home ownership forever.

Whether you want to work or not is not the point though. If you don't like it, vote to change the system.

[dpedin]

I am so glad I am not a youngster in the UK today! I know my kids (in their mid 20s) and their friends work incredibly hard in responsible jobs and have struggled through pandemic and all the shit thrown their way when they should be out enjoying themselves and having the times of their lives. Many have left Uni with huge debts, can't afford deposits for a house, struggle on stagnant wages and any savings for a house are disappearing fast due to inflation. I had a student grant, no loan to pay back, could afford to get onto the housing ladder relatively easily, job progress was relatively guaranteed, could travel/work around Europe with ease and I now have a comfortable life in my own home with a solid final salary, index linked pension. I get completely pissed off with the ignorant views that todays kids are lazy and have it easy - we middle age/older baby boomers have shat upon them from a great hight and yet expect them to work hard, pay higher taxes and retire at age 68+ not for their own benefit but to keep us in the luxury we have become accustomed to. I wouldn't do it - I would feck off!

[Raggs]

It's not just the Zers, me and my social circle are all mid-millenials (late 20s to early 30s) and we don't want to work either. There's a sense of futility to it. All the things work and putting in a solid effort were supposed to provide are at best uncertain these days. We'll probably never get retire and that's if the world hasn't already stopped being liveable due to climate change by then. Along the way we get to watch house prices continue to spiral out of reach while rent funnels money into someone else's pockets, wages lagging ever further behind the cost of living while those in certain socio-economic brackets become richer than ever. More wealth in fewer hands and the erosion of living conditions for the masses. And it's our efforts, our labour that generates the wealth being hoarded. Why on earth would we want to work?

Get the fucking guillotines out.

Late 30s here. Not expecting to be able to retire, don't believe there will even be a national pension by the time I get there to be honest, maybe a basic income, but not much. Just managed to become first time buyers, mortgaged until 70 years old.

EDIT - And definitely consider us as part of the lucky ones! Better off than many others.

[Paddington Bear]

It's not just the Zers, me and my social circle are all mid-millenials (late 20s to early 30s) and we don't want to work either. There's a sense of futility to it. All the things work and putting in a solid effort were supposed to provide are at best uncertain these days. We'll probably never get retire and that's if the world hasn't already stopped being liveable due to climate change by then. Along the way we get to watch house prices continue to spiral out of reach while rent funnels money into someone else's pockets, wages lagging ever further behind the cost of living while those in certain socio-economic brackets become richer than ever. More wealth in fewer hands and the erosion of living conditions for the masses. And it's our efforts, our labour that generates the wealth being hoarded. Why on earth would we want to work?

Get the fucking guillotines out.

Sorry to say climate change and screwing the planet is a done deal whilst capitalism exists in its current form and people continue to breed like flies.

I've been saying for 2 decades that the UK (and US) mortgages systems are insane. It should be illegal to get a mortgage on a BTL for, say, more than 50% LTV. Instead we've had ludicrously cheap money and BTL deals even over 100% LTV which has now locked swathes out of home ownership forever.

Whether you want to work or not is not the point though. If you don't like it, vote to change the system.

It just breeds a sense of futility. I diligently save and invest sensibly (for the most part...), and have done since I started working. The money I saved was essentially irrelevant to buying a house, which I was only able to do courtesy of my late grandparents. Now my mortgage is significantly less than my rent was, meaning I am able to save/invest more than my friends who rent. It's mad and you can see why people get fatalistic about it all. Hard work doesn't get you places as it appears it did (or at least we imagine it did) 20/30 years ago, so why work hard?
Not to mention, in a British context, that it is hard to overstate the difference between what schools sold us going to uni would be like compared to reality. We were under no illusions that a 2:1 from a half decent uni would leave us walking into six figure jobs. Fine to say that was naïve, obviously it was, but this is quite genuinely what we were force fed every day from about Year 9 onwards.

[C69]

I can't wait to retire. I was going to go at 55 but now it's looking like 60.
I am one of the lucky
ones in the Public sector who will retire young with a decent pension. The youth of today are so fecked especially with their parents living longer.

[Blake]

It's not just the Zers, me and my social circle are all mid-millenials (late 20s to early 30s) and we don't want to work either. There's a sense of futility to it. All the things work and putting in a solid effort were supposed to provide are at best uncertain these days. We'll probably never get retire and that's if the world hasn't already stopped being liveable due to climate change by then. Along the way we get to watch house prices continue to spiral out of reach while rent funnels money into someone else's pockets, wages lagging ever further behind the cost of living while those in certain socio-economic brackets become richer than ever. More wealth in fewer hands and the erosion of living conditions for the masses. And it's our efforts, our labour that generates the wealth being hoarded. Why on earth would we want to work?

Get the fucking guillotines out.

This. It's infuriating when companies are posting record profits and very little if any of it is being passed back to the consumer or the workers.
It's not sustainable. That money has to get back into the general population or the system will collapse. If it can't / won't be done through responsible corporate citizenship (increasing wages and/or lowering prices) because the incentives of Wall street won't allow for that, then it will have to be done via taxation and initiatives like UBI.

Trillions of capital lying idle in tax havens or being invested in vanity assets like yachts and luxury real estate has to moved and used it is needed and where more can benefit from it.

[sockwithaticket]

It's not just the Zers, me and my social circle are all mid-millenials (late 20s to early 30s) and we don't want to work either. There's a sense of futility to it. All the things work and putting in a solid effort were supposed to provide are at best uncertain these days. We'll probably never get retire and that's if the world hasn't already stopped being liveable due to climate change by then. Along the way we get to watch house prices continue to spiral out of reach while rent funnels money into someone else's pockets, wages lagging ever further behind the cost of living while those in certain socio-economic brackets become richer than ever. More wealth in fewer hands and the erosion of living conditions for the masses. And it's our efforts, our labour that generates the wealth being hoarded. Why on earth would we want to work?

Get the fucking guillotines out.

Sorry to say climate change and screwing the planet is a done deal whilst capitalism exists in its current form and people continue to breed like flies.

I've been saying for 2 decades that the UK (and US) mortgages systems are insane. It should be illegal to get a mortgage on a BTL for, say, more than 50% LTV. Instead we've had ludicrously cheap money and BTL deals even over 100% LTV which has now locked swathes out of home ownership forever.

Whether you want to work or not is not the point though. If you don't like it, vote to change the system.

We're past the point of no return with the environment anyway, but we can stop it getting still worse. It would require the sort of drastic and unpopular policy shifts that can only be achieved by authoritarian states at this point, though. Elected politicians seem incapable of doing something that will be for the benefit of the people in the long run even at the expense of their electability and that's before the pernicious influence of lobbying gets to them. Huge economic restructuring and punitive regulation seem like pipe dreams.

I've voted in every election I'm able and always for change. So far the best I've seen my votes do is contribute to removing a couple of Tory councillors.

It's not just the Zers, me and my social circle are all mid-millenials (late 20s to early 30s) and we don't want to work either. There's a sense of futility to it. All the things work and putting in a solid effort were supposed to provide are at best uncertain these days. We'll probably never get retire and that's if the world hasn't already stopped being liveable due to climate change by then. Along the way we get to watch house prices continue to spiral out of reach while rent funnels money into someone else's pockets, wages lagging ever further behind the cost of living while those in certain socio-economic brackets become richer than ever. More wealth in fewer hands and the erosion of living conditions for the masses. And it's our efforts, our labour that generates the wealth being hoarded. Why on earth would we want to work?

Get the fucking guillotines out.

Sorry to say climate change and screwing the planet is a done deal whilst capitalism exists in its current form and people continue to breed like flies.

I've been saying for 2 decades that the UK (and US) mortgages systems are insane. It should be illegal to get a mortgage on a BTL for, say, more than 50% LTV. Instead we've had ludicrously cheap money and BTL deals even over 100% LTV which has now locked swathes out of home ownership forever.

Whether you want to work or not is not the point though. If you don't like it, vote to change the system.

It just breeds a sense of futility. I diligently save and invest sensibly (for the most part...), and have done since I started working. The money I saved was essentially irrelevant to buying a house, which I was only able to do courtesy of my late grandparents. Now my mortgage is significantly less than my rent was, meaning I am able to save/invest more than my friends who rent. It's mad and you can see why people get fatalistic about it all. Hard work doesn't get you places as it appears it did (or at least we imagine it did) 20/30 years ago, so why work hard?
Not to mention, in a British context, that it is hard to overstate the difference between what schools sold us going to uni would be like compared to reality. We were under no illusions that a 2:1 from a half decent uni would leave us walking into six figure jobs. Fine to say that was naïve, obviously it was, but this is quite genuinely what we were force fed every day from about Year 9 onwards.

Careers advice was limited entirely to that: go to uni, get your 2:1 and you'll be fine. Then the GFC happened in my first year

I've got three friends who own houses. One's an engineer with a fossil fuel giant and in Scotland, one married into a fairly well off family and the other's dad died, leaving enough money for a deposit.

[Hal Jordan]

Me and the wife are both in the traditional professional classes, but still wouldn't have been able to get on the property ladder (we moved up a rung 8 years ago from the first house) without:-

A). Inheritance from an uncle who died too young;
B). Support from the Banks of Mum and Dad; and
C). Laying off the avocados.

That was a decade and a half ago, looking at prices for similar properties to our first one in the same area now, it's frankly off the chart.

And people are right about assets getting stuck in a generation who are living longer, one would hope not to rely on an inheritance to have to get on, but as an example my wife's grandmother is pushing 100 and might outlive one of her sons who has cancer. Not that she would know, she has dementia and is existing as opposed to living thanks to advances in medicine, whereas back in the day she would have been carried off by something at least five years ago.

[Torquemada 1420]

Not to mention, in a British context, that it is hard to overstate the difference between what schools sold us going to uni would be like compared to reality. We were under no illusions that a 2:1 from a half decent uni would leave us walking into six figure jobs. Fine to say that was naïve, obviously it was, but this is quite genuinely what we were force fed every day from about Year 9 onwards.

I don't know how old you are but when I attended university, it was intended for the educational elite and only around 5% went. Granted there was a representation disparity between those from state and public school sources. Now, more than 50% go to university. The system is completely devalued from all angles
- number of degrees awarded
- types of degree e.g. meejuh studies
- quality of degree i.e. the grade system is so badly watered down that a degree now is little better than an A level of 40 years ago

I repeatedly see and hear about graduates who come into the real world of employment with a massively inflated sense of entitlement and many of them can barely count or write.

[Torquemada 1420]

Me and the wife are both in the traditional professional classes, but still wouldn't have been able to get on the property ladder (we moved up a rung 8 years ago from the first house) without:-

A). Inheritance from an uncle who died too young;
B). Support from the Banks of Mum and Dad; and
C). Laying off the avocados.

That was a decade and a half ago, looking at prices for similar properties to our first one in the same area now, it's frankly off the chart.

And people are right about assets getting stuck in a generation who are living longer, one would hope not to rely on an inheritance to have to get on, but as an example my wife's grandmother is pushing 100 and might outlive one of her sons who has cancer. Not that she would know, she has dementia and is existing as opposed to living thanks to advances in medicine, whereas back in the day she would have been carried off by something at least five years ago.

Yes. This is what happens when Govts print money like a banana republic and set debt servicing rates at practically zero. We are debt free. No inheritances and no bank of parent got us there. Our household income would now be considered as high against the norm. And yet if we tried to buy our home now from scratch (we've been there 30 years), it would hurt plenty.

[ASMO]

Me and the wife are both in the traditional professional classes, but still wouldn't have been able to get on the property ladder (we moved up a rung 8 years ago from the first house) without:-

A). Inheritance from an uncle who died too young;
B). Support from the Banks of Mum and Dad; and
C). Laying off the avocados.

That was a decade and a half ago, looking at prices for similar properties to our first one in the same area now, it's frankly off the chart.

And people are right about assets getting stuck in a generation who are living longer, one would hope not to rely on an inheritance to have to get on, but as an example my wife's grandmother is pushing 100 and might outlive one of her sons who has cancer. Not that she would know, she has dementia and is existing as opposed to living thanks to advances in medicine, whereas back in the day she would have been carried off by something at least five years ago.

Yes. This is what happens when Govts print money like a banana republic and set debt servicing rates at practically zero. We are debt free. No inheritances and no bank of parent got us there. Our household income would now be considered as high against the norm. And yet if we tried to buy our home now from scratch (we've been there 30 years), it would hurt plenty.

The market cannot sustain this level of prices, the arse is going to fall out of it in the not too distant future as first time buyers (the lifeblood of the market) simply wont be able to afford to buy, even when subsidised by the parents.

[robmatic]

Not to mention, in a British context, that it is hard to overstate the difference between what schools sold us going to uni would be like compared to reality. We were under no illusions that a 2:1 from a half decent uni would leave us walking into six figure jobs. Fine to say that was naïve, obviously it was, but this is quite genuinely what we were force fed every day from about Year 9 onwards.

In many ways my degree from Edinburgh Uni 20 years ago was utterly pointless and career-wise, I just ended up working my way up from admin roles in financial services that I could have got into straight from school. However, socially it was pretty valuable for me as a farmer's son without much of a clue before I rocked up in the big city. I met and spoke to actual posh people and shared flats with people from social strata far above mine. Ended up meeting and marrying an exotic foreign girl who was the daughter of an Ambassador - I doubt that would have happened if I'd stayed at home on the farm.

[Paddington Bear]

Not to mention, in a British context, that it is hard to overstate the difference between what schools sold us going to uni would be like compared to reality. We were under no illusions that a 2:1 from a half decent uni would leave us walking into six figure jobs. Fine to say that was naïve, obviously it was, but this is quite genuinely what we were force fed every day from about Year 9 onwards.

I don't know how old you are but when I attended university, it was intended for the educational elite and only around 5% went. Granted there was a representation disparity between those from state and public school sources. Now, more than 50% go to university. The system is completely devalued from all angles
- number of degrees awarded
- types of degree e.g. meejuh studies
- quality of degree i.e. the grade system is so badly watered down that a degree now is little better than an A level of 40 years ago

I repeatedly see and hear about graduates who come into the real world of employment with a massively inflated sense of entitlement and many of them can barely count or write.

Rapidly approaching 30. I basically agree with your point and know a lot of people who absolutely should not have been anywhere near a degree, and would say most friends/acquaintances are good at passing exams rather than acquiring/applying knowledge. My point stands (and others have made it), we were promised something very different to what we ended up with by going to uni, which I think is where what you term the sense of entitlement comes from.
I.e. if you are told repeatedly from the age of 13/14 that your 2:1 from a half decent uni is a passport to six figure salaries and running firms then data entry etc as you enter the world of work will hit you like a train. I know it did for me.

[Torquemada 1420]

The market cannot sustain this level of prices, the arse is going to fall out of it in the not too distant future as first time buyers (the lifeblood of the market) simply wont be able to afford to buy, even when subsidised by the parents.

Very possibly although 1st time buyers have been almost an irrelevancy in the market since 2008.

The 3 potential killers are
- the changes in tax laws preventing BTL borrowers claiming higher anything other than basic rate tax relief against mortgage payments as an expense. The higher they are geared, the worse it is.
- interest rates rising. A shift from 0.25% base rate to 1.25% base rate will severely impact those with high gearing.
- over supply of the wrong type of housing in the wrong areas

In addition, the massive rise in input costs in construction means developers are caught between trying to ask for higher prices and the need to get shot quickly because most of them borrow to the 9s during the build stage. And many developments are way behind schedule due to COVID.

[C69]

I can't wait to retire. I was going to go at 55 but now it's looking like 60.
I am one of the lucky
ones in the Public sector who will retire young with a decent pension. The youth of today are so fecked especially with their parents living longer.

Young lads I know who can hardly scratch their arses are on 100k plus pretending to press buttons in Google and Facebag. They'll be alright. I like you have an extremely average job befitting my extremely average effort and will retire nice and early to go on very average trips. We can't all be Gen Z tech or pharma high flyers pretending they have proper jobs

I am now officially winding down.
Coasting along for the next few years

[Torquemada 1420]

Rapidly approaching 30. I basically agree with your point and know a lot of people who absolutely should not have been anywhere near a degree, and would say most friends/acquaintances are good at passing exams rather than acquiring/applying knowledge. My point stands (and others have made it), we were promised something very different to what we ended up with by going to uni, which I think is where what you term the sense of entitlement comes from.
I.e. if you are told repeatedly from the age of 13/14 that your 2:1 from a half decent uni is a passport to six figure salaries and running firms then data entry etc as you enter the world of work will hit you like a train. I know it did for me.

1/2 my age (you b*st*rd).

I find those representations (presumably from teachers) staggering although it probably ought not to have taken Richard Feynman to work out that with the nos going to university and the real world experiences of 6 figure pays, something was amiss. Most of those same teachers would have graduated with weak degrees and only a small % of them would be on that level of pay even in the massively overpaid public sector.

[Paddington Bear]

Rapidly approaching 30. I basically agree with your point and know a lot of people who absolutely should not have been anywhere near a degree, and would say most friends/acquaintances are good at passing exams rather than acquiring/applying knowledge. My point stands (and others have made it), we were promised something very different to what we ended up with by going to uni, which I think is where what you term the sense of entitlement comes from.
I.e. if you are told repeatedly from the age of 13/14 that your 2:1 from a half decent uni is a passport to six figure salaries and running firms then data entry etc as you enter the world of work will hit you like a train. I know it did for me.

1/2 my age (you b*st*rd).

I find those representations (presumably from teachers) staggering although it probably ought not to have taken Richard Feynman to work out that with the nos going to university and the real world experiences of 6 figure pays, something was amiss. Most of those same teachers would have graduated with weak degrees and only a small % of them would be on that level of pay even in the massively overpaid public sector.

Yeah it remains pretty inexplicable to me (and incidentally particularly coming from teachers. The teachers I know are generally the most resentful of career prospects etc among grads) - something a few of my mates and I were discussing a couple of weeks ago. Just I think this wasn't atypical for my generation and I think it helps explain part of people's approach to work and life.

[SaintK]

Rapidly approaching 30. I basically agree with your point and know a lot of people who absolutely should not have been anywhere near a degree, and would say most friends/acquaintances are good at passing exams rather than acquiring/applying knowledge. My point stands (and others have made it), we were promised something very different to what we ended up with by going to uni, which I think is where what you term the sense of entitlement comes from.
I.e. if you are told repeatedly from the age of 13/14 that your 2:1 from a half decent uni is a passport to six figure salaries and running firms then data entry etc as you enter the world of work will hit you like a train. I know it did for me.

1/2 my age (you b*st*rd).

I find those representations (presumably from teachers) staggering although it probably ought not to have taken Richard Feynman to work out that with the nos going to university and the real world experiences of 6 figure pays, something was amiss. Most of those same teachers would have graduated with weak degrees and only a small % of them would be on that level of pay even in the massively overpaid public sector.

1/2? You should be so lucky

[Line6 HXFX]

Youngsters should feel entitled. Jesus I weep for them. I mean we had it bad..in our jobless enclaves..
I was told when being redundanced from British Steel the early nineties at 21. oh you need get lots of qualifications (believe it or not no one gave a shit about them before, when there was plenty of jobs..it wasn't what you knew but who) ..so off I went to get lots of qualifications..travelled back and fourth on the train and bus for 6 hours a day, to get a Btec National Diploma, for two years.. I did a Higher National Diploma in Business information technology by actually using the library computers, as I couldn't afford a computer. Even got accepted to do post grad studies..

then it was " ohh no one is going to employ you as you need experience" so did years and years working on the quite dangerous front line of substance misuse... creating and managing database systems with extremely f'king confidential information..that would be seriously desired by most of the shadey fuckers in the UK.

So having tons of experience and qualifications and being still unemployed, it was
Nothing, no advice..so..just
"You feckless lazy cunt, get a job". Or "no one is entitled to a job..you feckless lazy cunt".
Then I got so stressed by unemployment and so fucking anxious my heart just gave out.

Threats of sanctions, where you don't know what the Job advisor needs only that she could fuck my life up in in instant, made me live in absolute fucking terror.
A year later my GP actually had to put me back on the sick because the job centre were stressing me out,, and trying to kill me off again.a year after nearly doing so.
So I weep for youngsters.

[notfatcat]

Life is hard. Who knew.

[SaintK]

Youngsters should feel entitled. Jesus I weep for them. I mean we had it bad..in our jobless enclaves..
I was told when being redundanced from British Steel the early nineties at 21. oh you need get lots of qualifications (believe it or not no one gave a shit about them before, when there was plenty of jobs..it wasn't what you knew but who) ..so off I went to get lots of qualifications..travelled back and fourth on the train and bus for 6 hours a day, to get a Btec National Diploma, for two years.. I did a Higher National Diploma in Business information technology by actually using the library computers, as I couldn't afford a computer. Even got accepted to do post grad studies..

then it was " ohh no one is going to employ you as you need experience" so did years and years working on the quite dangerous front line of substance misuse... creating and managing database systems with extremely f'king confidential information..that would be seriously desired by most of the shadey fuckers in the UK.

So having tons of experience and qualifications and being still unemployed, it was
Nothing, no advice..so..just
"You feckless lazy cunt, get a job". Or "no one is entitled to a job..you feckless lazy cunt".
Then I got so stressed by unemployment and so fucking anxious my heart just gave out.

Threats of sanctions, where you don't know what the Job advisor needs only that she could fuck my life up in in instant, made me live in absolute fucking terror.
A year later my GP actually had to put me back on the sick because the job centre were stressing me out,, and trying to kill me off again.a year after nearly doing so.
So I weep for youngsters.

Fuck me you suck the air out of every thread you moan on
What a joyless, miserabalist

[sefton]

Managing a database is front line dangerous work.

[Hellraiser]

That article seems like a major generalization based on people who work shitty jobs that don't let them switch off. Don't like it? Find something different.

Don't like it, then get a qualification in something meaningful other than meeejuh studies or pollliticks.

Is being a barista a job that doesn't let you switch off?

[Fonz]

I can't wait to retire. I was going to go at 55 but now it's looking like 60.
I am one of the lucky
ones in the Public sector who will retire young with a decent pension. The youth of today are so fecked especially with their parents living longer.

Young lads I know who can hardly scratch their arses are on 100k plus pretending to press buttons in Google and Facebag. They'll be alright. I like you have an extremely average job befitting my extremely average effort and will retire nice and early to go on very average trips. We can't all be Gen Z tech or pharma high flyers pretending they have proper jobs

Yeah, this generally comports with my experience. As I entered the white collar world I realized the amount of do-nothing jobs out there that pay extraordinarily well really is staggering.

Some jobs do require serious work; if I had tried harder or been less retarded, I could be like my classmates who started out at $160-180k coming out of school, but then again they're working 60 to 70 hours a week. I'm not close to those sorts of earnings, but on the other hand I'm home everyday by 5:15 or earlier and spend my weekends scratching my balls.

I can't help but have contempt for most people with office jobs who claim they can't handle the workload. I worked way, way harder in my blue collar wagie days doing retail, groundskeeping, and loading packages at UPS (toughest job I ever had) than I ever did in school or in my current job. I doubt I'm some wasted genius.

If you're doing 70 hours a week and feeling burned out, that's one thing, but idk how the fuck you get burned out doing 40.

[mat the expat]

I repeatedly see and hear about graduates who come into the real world of employment with a massively inflated sense of entitlement and many of them can barely count or write.

Last edited by Torquemada 1420 on Mon May 30, 2022 10:23 pm, edited 2 times in total.

[JM2K6]

Amusing to see the old slow guys not realise that jobs where you actually have to use your brain all the time can instigate burnout even if you're not, I dunno, chopping wood or delivering mail for 70 hours a week

Besides, every single tech type I know who's experienced some level of burnout, including me, worked way beyond regular hours almost constantly. And the guys I know who've worked for the absolute shitshows that are Amazon/Twitter/Facebook have all chucked that in for the "easier" life of a 40-50 hour job doing high end tech work in a regular high pressure company.

Seriously though you guys have to realise that constant stress can happen in any job and there's plenty of jobs where working more hours in a week does not actually help the core problem at all

[Biffer]

Torq in full on boomer mode I see.

I love sitting in gen X and watching the boomers and Millennials scream at each other, not realising that they're two cheeks of the same arse. Gen Z seem to be much more like gen X, a roll of the eyes and an 'I'm just going to be over here getting on with my own stuff when you guys have finished howling' mentality.

[Biffer]

Torq in full on boomer mode I see.

I love sitting in gen X and watching the boomers and Millennials scream at each other, not realising that they're two cheeks of the same arse. Gen Z seem to be much more like gen X, a roll of the eyes and an 'I'm just going to be over here getting on with my own stuff when you guys have finished howling' mentality.

[inactionman]

Amusing to see the old slow guys not realise that jobs where you actually have to use your brain all the time can instigate burnout even if you're not, I dunno, chopping wood or delivering mail for 70 hours a week

Besides, every single tech type I know who's experienced some level of burnout, including me, worked way beyond regular hours almost constantly. And the guys I know who've worked for the absolute shitshows that are Amazon/Twitter/Facebook have all chucked that in for the "easier" life of a 40-50 hour job doing high end tech work in a regular high pressure company.

Seriously though you guys have to realise that constant stress can happen in any job and there's plenty of jobs where working more hours in a week does not actually help the core problem at all

Yep. I'd add two points of amplification:

It's not easy to switch off from many jobs - I've had many late nights dealing with out of hours queries or in making last minute trips to godforsaken places. Many countries have implemented laws to restrict employees from being contacted out of hours. When I've worked on manufacturing lines my work has finished the second I punch out. It's also having things on your mind, it's hard to mentally tune out, whereas on certain more manual jobs I've had I've barely tuned in.

Second, and related to the above - there's no real accountability in many manual jobs. If things feck up, it's someone else's issue, and in some places I've worked in people would purposefully feck it up to get a half hour fag break. (I of course recognise that many more manual roles are craft-based, and have conscientious, accountable people in the role, and companies like amazon are utter shameless arses in micromanaging warehouse staff and making their lives a misery). In more white-collar roles, I've had many project managers burn out as they're on the hook for a badly specified, poorly resourced project where they don't really control the performance of staff but they just spend the whole day taking a kicking from sponsors and seniors who won't accept that they're the true cause of the problems. For anyone who takes a pride in their work and enjoys being part of a team, or just simply doesn't want an adversarial workplace, this is a horrible way to work.

[JM2K6]

Amusing to see the old slow guys not realise that jobs where you actually have to use your brain all the time can instigate burnout even if you're not, I dunno, chopping wood or delivering mail for 70 hours a week

Besides, every single tech type I know who's experienced some level of burnout, including me, worked way beyond regular hours almost constantly. And the guys I know who've worked for the absolute shitshows that are Amazon/Twitter/Facebook have all chucked that in for the "easier" life of a 40-50 hour job doing high end tech work in a regular high pressure company.

Seriously though you guys have to realise that constant stress can happen in any job and there's plenty of jobs where working more hours in a week does not actually help the core problem at all

Burnout my hoop. Now chopping wood is a proper job. Imagine being able to go home to the missus and say ' a tree fell on today' rather than 'I am very tired of eating my spicy cous cous while on mute pretending to listen on teams. I'M EXHAUSTED'

If a tree falls on, and there's no Irish parody account around to report on it, did it even happen?

[Fonz]

Amusing to see the old slow guys not realise that jobs where you actually have to use your brain all the time can instigate burnout even if you're not, I dunno, chopping wood or delivering mail for 70 hours a week

Besides, every single tech type I know who's experienced some level of burnout, including me, worked way beyond regular hours almost constantly. And the guys I know who've worked for the absolute shitshows that are Amazon/Twitter/Facebook have all chucked that in for the "easier" life of a 40-50 hour job doing high end tech work in a regular high pressure company.

Seriously though you guys have to realise that constant stress can happen in any job and there's plenty of jobs where working more hours in a week does not actually help the core problem at all

I will concede that tech does seem fucking horrible.

Dunno, perhaps it's down to the individual, but it's just hard for me to get too upset about sitting in an office banging out memos and brainstorming about ultimately meaningless bullshit for substantially greater sums than when I had to load packages in a truck in the middle of the night, weedwhack around headstones in 100F Midwestern heat, or wait on 20+ tables while also mixing drinks, 8-10 hours at a time without really making much more than survival money.

In those days I sometimes woke up regretting my existence -- although I suppose looking back, the ever-present saving grace was that I knew I wouldn't be doing it forever. Though of course, and I know a career change is easier said than done, you can say the same of the white collar professions.

One possibly revealing anecdote: in law school (was trying to dance around it but everyone finds out I'm a cunt eventually anyway), one professor asked the class who among us had had a job before; of ~90 students mostly in or approaching mid-20s, maybe 1/3 raised their hands, certainly less than half. My jaw dropped. But, it does lead me to wonder if part of the problem is many white collar types lack a frame of reference to realize how shit work can truly be.

Btw idk if you were referring to my post, but I was implying that working more hours would lead to more burnout, not less. Frankly I don't see how anybody could think more hours would be helpful in that regard, barring a few of the workaholic nuts we all invariably know.

For the record, before anyone Ok Boomers me, I just turned 30.