Interesting post. I would also say that with the pandemic I'm not sure how lucrative contracts are going to be for the next wee while, as everyone is going to be under financial strain, so can definitely see bird in the hand type mentality kicking in.dpedin wrote: Wed Sep 02, 2020 9:34 am The top SA guys are on good contracts in Scotland and are looked after and will be capped in due course. If they decide to play for SA then they will need to find a new club as soon as their contracts run out or even before. Scotland can't keep them if they are not committing to playing for us. Its a choice they will need to make. At the moment, even though they are top players it might be difficult to get a good contract, particularly with the salary cap down south coming into force. They all pick up big money in France but there is a cost to that particularly for forwards, in terms of conditioning, being looked after and being overplayed.
VdM came to us from Montpellier where he had been injured and not well looked after, Embra brought him in, got him top class medical treatment, nursed him back to health and look after him well. I think that meant a lot to him and he is on record as saying they probably saved his career. I hope he repays us with playing for Scotland on the wing. Kebble looks like he has developed from a big fat beast into a fit big beast who can now scrummage on both sides and is carrying better than ever. We have developed him physically into a top international class player in much the same way we have done with Berghan who was also a big fat lump when he first arrived. Whilst we might not offer top dollar I think we do offer a good package for these guys and of course they get to live in Gods Own Country!
The Official Scottish Rugby Thread
- Northern Lights
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Scotland just cut salaries. It's a brutal market for players so maybe the business decision is the Scotland cap.Northern Lights wrote: Wed Sep 02, 2020 4:11 pmInteresting post. I would also say that with the pandemic I'm not sure how lucrative contracts are going to be for the next wee while, as everyone is going to be under financial strain, so can definitely see bird in the hand type mentality kicking in.dpedin wrote: Wed Sep 02, 2020 9:34 am The top SA guys are on good contracts in Scotland and are looked after and will be capped in due course. If they decide to play for SA then they will need to find a new club as soon as their contracts run out or even before. Scotland can't keep them if they are not committing to playing for us. Its a choice they will need to make. At the moment, even though they are top players it might be difficult to get a good contract, particularly with the salary cap down south coming into force. They all pick up big money in France but there is a cost to that particularly for forwards, in terms of conditioning, being looked after and being overplayed.
VdM came to us from Montpellier where he had been injured and not well looked after, Embra brought him in, got him top class medical treatment, nursed him back to health and look after him well. I think that meant a lot to him and he is on record as saying they probably saved his career. I hope he repays us with playing for Scotland on the wing. Kebble looks like he has developed from a big fat beast into a fit big beast who can now scrummage on both sides and is carrying better than ever. We have developed him physically into a top international class player in much the same way we have done with Berghan who was also a big fat lump when he first arrived. Whilst we might not offer top dollar I think we do offer a good package for these guys and of course they get to live in Gods Own Country!
Duhan is a very interesting case, I wonder who made the decision to fund a young guy with little rugby medical costs. I guess the thought that Scotland don't produce many 6'4 wingers. No doubt you feel loyalty to the SRU and Edinburgh in that situation but I just can't believe it wouldn't be a very hard decision to turn down the Boks.
Just an interesting thought.
Talking of Scottish wingers, I'll tell you who I thought played well in the 1872s : Tagive
- clydecloggie
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I like neeps wrote: Wed Sep 02, 2020 8:11 pmScotland just cut salaries. It's a brutal market for players so maybe the business decision is the Scotland cap.Northern Lights wrote: Wed Sep 02, 2020 4:11 pmInteresting post. I would also say that with the pandemic I'm not sure how lucrative contracts are going to be for the next wee while, as everyone is going to be under financial strain, so can definitely see bird in the hand type mentality kicking in.dpedin wrote: Wed Sep 02, 2020 9:34 am The top SA guys are on good contracts in Scotland and are looked after and will be capped in due course. If they decide to play for SA then they will need to find a new club as soon as their contracts run out or even before. Scotland can't keep them if they are not committing to playing for us. Its a choice they will need to make. At the moment, even though they are top players it might be difficult to get a good contract, particularly with the salary cap down south coming into force. They all pick up big money in France but there is a cost to that particularly for forwards, in terms of conditioning, being looked after and being overplayed.
VdM came to us from Montpellier where he had been injured and not well looked after, Embra brought him in, got him top class medical treatment, nursed him back to health and look after him well. I think that meant a lot to him and he is on record as saying they probably saved his career. I hope he repays us with playing for Scotland on the wing. Kebble looks like he has developed from a big fat beast into a fit big beast who can now scrummage on both sides and is carrying better than ever. We have developed him physically into a top international class player in much the same way we have done with Berghan who was also a big fat lump when he first arrived. Whilst we might not offer top dollar I think we do offer a good package for these guys and of course they get to live in Gods Own Country!
Duhan is a very interesting case, I wonder who made the decision to fund a young guy with little rugby medical costs. I guess the thought that Scotland don't produce many 6'4 wingers. No doubt you feel loyalty to the SRU and Edinburgh in that situation but I just can't believe it wouldn't be a very hard decision to turn down the Boks.
Just an interesting thought.
Talking of Scottish wingers, I'll tell you who I thought played well in the 1872s : Tagive
Absolutely. Excellent under the high ball, solid defensively. The games were atrocious and gave little opportunity for a winger to shine in attack, unfortunately.
clydecloggie wrote: Thu Sep 03, 2020 6:48 amI like neeps wrote: Wed Sep 02, 2020 8:11 pmScotland just cut salaries. It's a brutal market for players so maybe the business decision is the Scotland cap.Northern Lights wrote: Wed Sep 02, 2020 4:11 pm
Interesting post. I would also say that with the pandemic I'm not sure how lucrative contracts are going to be for the next wee while, as everyone is going to be under financial strain, so can definitely see bird in the hand type mentality kicking in.
Duhan is a very interesting case, I wonder who made the decision to fund a young guy with little rugby medical costs. I guess the thought that Scotland don't produce many 6'4 wingers. No doubt you feel loyalty to the SRU and Edinburgh in that situation but I just can't believe it wouldn't be a very hard decision to turn down the Boks.
Just an interesting thought.
Talking of Scottish wingers, I'll tell you who I thought played well in the 1872s : Tagive
Absolutely. Excellent under the high ball, solid defensively. The games were atrocious and gave little opportunity for a winger to shine in attack, unfortunately.
Apart from maybe the two Edinburgh tries scored down the wings.
And are there two g’s in Bugger Off?
https://www.theoffsideline.com/london-s ... ised-land/
Saw this on Twitter. It’s an interesting read.
My preference would be for a third pro team based on the Caledonia district. However, we don’t seem to be getting any closer to that, and in the meantime Scottish have been kicking about being irrelevant for a long time. There are a lot of Scots in London, many of whom are from middle-class backgrounds (which, let’s face it, is the core of Scottish rugby). There’s certainly a market there and I expect they could draw crowds if they were in the Pro14.
Is there any way to get around the fact that they would be operating in the RFU’s jurisdiction? I’d guess no, but it’s worth investigating all the same. If we can have teams from SA, why not one based in London...
Saw this on Twitter. It’s an interesting read.
My preference would be for a third pro team based on the Caledonia district. However, we don’t seem to be getting any closer to that, and in the meantime Scottish have been kicking about being irrelevant for a long time. There are a lot of Scots in London, many of whom are from middle-class backgrounds (which, let’s face it, is the core of Scottish rugby). There’s certainly a market there and I expect they could draw crowds if they were in the Pro14.
Is there any way to get around the fact that they would be operating in the RFU’s jurisdiction? I’d guess no, but it’s worth investigating all the same. If we can have teams from SA, why not one based in London...
It is in truth not for glory, nor riches, nor honours that we are fighting, but for freedom - for that alone, which no honest man gives up but with life itself.
It would be amazing and I could quite easily see them getting regular crowds of 10K plus and they certainly wouldn't have a problem attracting talent.Yr Alban wrote: Thu Sep 03, 2020 1:08 pm https://www.theoffsideline.com/london-s ... ised-land/
Saw this on Twitter. It’s an interesting read.
My preference would be for a third pro team based on the Caledonia district. However, we don’t seem to be getting any closer to that, and in the meantime Scottish have been kicking about being irrelevant for a long time. There are a lot of Scots in London, many of whom are from middle-class backgrounds (which, let’s face it, is the core of Scottish rugby). There’s certainly a market there and I expect they could draw crowds if they were in the Pro14.
Is there any way to get around the fact that they would be operating in the RFU’s jurisdiction? I’d guess no, but it’s worth investigating all the same. If we can have teams from SA, why not one based in London...
It's really good to hear that LS and the SRU are having sensible, grown up conversations as that certainly hasn't been the case in years gone by. I have no idea how it would work re the RFU but presumably if they were taking no funding from them they can play wherever they want?
I'd actually prefer this option to another club in Scotland to be honest.
All the money you made will never buy back your soul
I can’t see that happening, because of the Pandora’s box it opens up. If you can have teams moving from one league to another, then what’s to stop one league pursuing all the big teams and all the money. Then you end up with a European super league which we would be shut out of because we don’t bring money, advertising or tv revenue.Yr Alban wrote: Thu Sep 03, 2020 1:08 pm https://www.theoffsideline.com/london-s ... ised-land/
Saw this on Twitter. It’s an interesting read.
My preference would be for a third pro team based on the Caledonia district. However, we don’t seem to be getting any closer to that, and in the meantime Scottish have been kicking about being irrelevant for a long time. There are a lot of Scots in London, many of whom are from middle-class backgrounds (which, let’s face it, is the core of Scottish rugby). There’s certainly a market there and I expect they could draw crowds if they were in the Pro14.
Is there any way to get around the fact that they would be operating in the RFU’s jurisdiction? I’d guess no, but it’s worth investigating all the same. If we can have teams from SA, why not one based in London...
And are there two g’s in Bugger Off?
I don’t disagree, though it’s interesting as a concept. Less of an issue in rugby than in football (which has a lot of big fish in small ponds who would love to get access to the big bucks on offer in the country next door) but still not a precedent they are likely to wish to set.
It is in truth not for glory, nor riches, nor honours that we are fighting, but for freedom - for that alone, which no honest man gives up but with life itself.
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It's an interesting concept but I am not sure I agree with the idea there is a massive Scottish diaspora just waiting to see Pro14 rugby. The figure of 200k Scottish or Scottish decended people in London may be accurate, I don't know, but London is a massive place. The real question is how many live within around around an hour of travel of the ground which is a fairly reasonable limit for regular travel. Of those, how many are actually interested in rugby, and then of those how many are interested in club rugby and of those how many are interested in watching what is likely to be a losing and low quality Pro14 side? Edinburgh has a highly engaged rugby population with well more than 200k within an hour traveltime and struggles to draw in much over 5k people except for the biggest of matches.
Of course there might be a decent number of Irish, Welsh and maybe even South African background keen to watch their teams too, but it seems a hell of a gamble to be honest. What it really needs is a billionaire looking to splash some cash who can a) buy them a ground, b) buy them a squad and c) continue to bankroll the squad for many many years.
Of course there might be a decent number of Irish, Welsh and maybe even South African background keen to watch their teams too, but it seems a hell of a gamble to be honest. What it really needs is a billionaire looking to splash some cash who can a) buy them a ground, b) buy them a squad and c) continue to bankroll the squad for many many years.
True, but I guess with their own clubhouse and facilities there is an opportunity to perhaps make it a “Scottish Hub”. Could have London Scottish netball, touch rugby, cricket etc as well as other non sporting clubs and societies. I’d certainly have gravitated to something like that when I was in London.
All the money you made will never buy back your soul
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I'd guess an hour from Richmond get's you to maybe the City in the east, Wimbledon north, Epsom south and as far as the M25 west? It is a fair size of an area, more or less half of London. If they could become a Barcelona type club as you say including all sorts of sports then maybe it would work as a concept. The more central the new ground the better, but that comes at a cost.
- Northern Lights
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Jock42 wrote: Thu Sep 03, 2020 3:28 pm I'm certainly not against a London Scottish pro team but it has far too many obstacles to it. From a purely selfish pov a Reds team is my preferred option (as I've probably said many times before).
What sort of crowds do LS get atm?



About 1500 as an average. The problem with Richmond is it’s seen as quite difficult to get to,, but it’s not really. The club itself isn’t terribly welcoming if you are not part of the crowd to be perfectly honest which maybe puts a few folk off. It’s also quite an old crowd who have been on London for years, they don’t seem very good, or haven’t bothered, trying to reach out to younger Scots in LondonJock42 wrote: Thu Sep 03, 2020 3:28 pm I'm certainly not against a London Scottish pro team but it has far too many obstacles to it. From a purely selfish pov a Reds team is my preferred option (as I've probably said many times before).
What sort of crowds do LS get atm?
All the money you made will never buy back your soul
Thats a decent base to start with but if people are not welcoming it has shades of the Borders and doomed to failure. Caley it is.Slick wrote: Thu Sep 03, 2020 3:44 pmAbout 1500 as an average. The problem with Richmond is it’s seen as quite difficult to get to,, but it’s not really. The club itself isn’t terribly welcoming if you are not part of the crowd to be perfectly honest which maybe puts a few folk off. It’s also quite an old crowd who have been on London for years, they don’t seem very good, or haven’t bothered, trying to reach out to younger Scots in LondonJock42 wrote: Thu Sep 03, 2020 3:28 pm I'm certainly not against a London Scottish pro team but it has far too many obstacles to it. From a purely selfish pov a Reds team is my preferred option (as I've probably said many times before).
What sort of crowds do LS get atm?
Peas in a pod NL
As I’ve often said, I think they should at least try to launch the Reds as a pro team. Bigger population than the borders and less football to contend with than in the central belt. But they’d have to be funded properly, and there is the sticking point.
It is in truth not for glory, nor riches, nor honours that we are fighting, but for freedom - for that alone, which no honest man gives up but with life itself.
- Northern Lights
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Keep fighting the good fight OJ, I'm here nodding awayJock42 wrote: Thu Sep 03, 2020 3:51 pmThats a decent base to start with but if people are not welcoming it has shades of the Borders and doomed to failure. Caley it is.Slick wrote: Thu Sep 03, 2020 3:44 pmAbout 1500 as an average. The problem with Richmond is it’s seen as quite difficult to get to,, but it’s not really. The club itself isn’t terribly welcoming if you are not part of the crowd to be perfectly honest which maybe puts a few folk off. It’s also quite an old crowd who have been on London for years, they don’t seem very good, or haven’t bothered, trying to reach out to younger Scots in LondonJock42 wrote: Thu Sep 03, 2020 3:28 pm I'm certainly not against a London Scottish pro team but it has far too many obstacles to it. From a purely selfish pov a Reds team is my preferred option (as I've probably said many times before).
What sort of crowds do LS get atm?
Peas in a pod NL

Still going to need the best part of £7million a year. Even with the wage reductions. I’d love it to happen but I don’t see where we get the money (and players) without crippling the other two teams.Yr Alban wrote: Thu Sep 03, 2020 3:58 pm As I’ve often said, I think they should at least try to launch the Reds as a pro team. Bigger population than the borders and less football to contend with than in the central belt. But they’d have to be funded properly, and there is the sticking point.
When Scottish were full time I was all in favour of farming lads from the academy out to them. But if they’re continuing to be part time, that’s not so good. We need to be getting the young guys used to being full time pros. At least with Super6 when they’re not with their team, the academy can do further training and development with them.
And are there two g’s in Bugger Off?
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The Championship isn't an exciting proposition really. Richmond for me is 2 hours but I'd 100% go if there were pro team games. And whilst I'm not too young anymore, I think younger professionals would be interested in a Friday night out in Richmond to watch London Scottish with Scottish internationals and Scottish academy players lining up to play a Pro14 side with internationals.Slick wrote: Thu Sep 03, 2020 3:44 pmAbout 1500 as an average. The problem with Richmond is it’s seen as quite difficult to get to,, but it’s not really. The club itself isn’t terribly welcoming if you are not part of the crowd to be perfectly honest which maybe puts a few folk off. It’s also quite an old crowd who have been on London for years, they don’t seem very good, or haven’t bothered, trying to reach out to younger Scots in LondonJock42 wrote: Thu Sep 03, 2020 3:28 pm I'm certainly not against a London Scottish pro team but it has far too many obstacles to it. From a purely selfish pov a Reds team is my preferred option (as I've probably said many times before).
What sort of crowds do LS get atm?
They're moving from Richmond anyway. Which I agree isn't hard to get to but it is out of the way. LS are decamping to Esher is it? Which is further out of the way. So would need to look at sharing a different ground in London.
I think London makes more sense to have a third pro team population wise and cash wise. But who knows post pandemic London when people are keener on the shires and there's probably much less money sloshing about. And equally, I cannot for the life of me see why the RFU would accept a Scottish pro team in London.
Also, fanwise I could not agree more with Jock42. How large is that captive population anyway? Considering the rugby capital in Scotland is now Edinburgh and private schools who have the disposable income for games but don't show up. I can accept that under the pish of old but Cockers is building something exciting. Where are those fans?
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If I recall the Esher move is a temp one pending a permanent solution.
Playing the amateurs is great as they were potted at a pub around the corner like a banishment but the banished land has glorious food Vs clubhouse schlop.
Playing the amateurs is great as they were potted at a pub around the corner like a banishment but the banished land has glorious food Vs clubhouse schlop.
A third team needs forty four or so players, if they are to be competitive the side needs at least half of that to be either on their way up to international level or on their way down from it, plus they need about half a dozen or so or young academy players who are pushing for a first team spot, the rest will be the guys who shore up the team when the others are off on international duty or injured.
Then you need coaches, S&C, medical and physio staff, logistics, managers at various levels and a ground ans everything that entails. £10M minimum imo.
Aside from the lack of money, we don’t have that level of players or staff to start a team from scratch.
Then you need coaches, S&C, medical and physio staff, logistics, managers at various levels and a ground ans everything that entails. £10M minimum imo.
Aside from the lack of money, we don’t have that level of players or staff to start a team from scratch.
The lack of money is the main issue (I think 7 million is the current running cost of a shite team). Players can be found, I'd take current pro teams cast offs there's a few of them each season, especially after a couple of years of super 6. I'm not expecting, or even looking for, a competitive team straight away . I'd gladly go and watch a Connacht style development side for a few years.
Scotland are having a relatively good patch atm but the union can't keep up without more pro players. The money has to be found at some point probably with outside investment.
Scotland are having a relatively good patch atm but the union can't keep up without more pro players. The money has to be found at some point probably with outside investment.
For what it’s worth, i think the SRU genuinely wants to do this, but isn’t going to talk about it publicly because They’ll end up being tied to artificial deadlines and have the rugby press all over them screaming about it for years before and after.
The key things we need are more money and more players. If you look at the last few years, they’ve been quite clear that those are their key aims; Dodson has banged on endlessly about increasing revenue and to be fair has been reasonably successful in that area. Similarly, there have been many statements about increasing the player pool - the Super6 and in particular the expansion of the academy are clearly all about that.
Also, the reputation we’re building for looking after players and the record we have of taking overseas players, in particular from Fiji and South Africa, lends itself to being able to bring in a few overseas pros in the first few seasons to help build the team.
I think it will happen, it’s just going to be five or ten years away.
The key things we need are more money and more players. If you look at the last few years, they’ve been quite clear that those are their key aims; Dodson has banged on endlessly about increasing revenue and to be fair has been reasonably successful in that area. Similarly, there have been many statements about increasing the player pool - the Super6 and in particular the expansion of the academy are clearly all about that.
Also, the reputation we’re building for looking after players and the record we have of taking overseas players, in particular from Fiji and South Africa, lends itself to being able to bring in a few overseas pros in the first few seasons to help build the team.
I think it will happen, it’s just going to be five or ten years away.
And are there two g’s in Bugger Off?
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Some of those numbers (£7m) are a bit high - the current budget of both Edinburgh and Glasgow are less than that, I have previously seen around £5.5m mentioned. Leinster and Munster have budgets around the £7m mark as do the top English teams, but you could run a development team for around £3.5m (allegedly Dragon's budget).
I think this is probably one of the reasons there has been so little interest in private ownership of Glasgow and Edinburgh. The SRU are probably looking for a minimum 10 year commitment; given neither team washes its own face, the total commitment for private ownership over that sort of period must be well north of £20-30m. There aren't many people, even billionaires, prepared to give away that kind of money.
Here is a source of sorts, although it is a little old: https://www.independent.ie/sport/rugby/ ... 41445.html
Edit to add, those are player budgets. Perhaps you meant operational budget?
I think this is probably one of the reasons there has been so little interest in private ownership of Glasgow and Edinburgh. The SRU are probably looking for a minimum 10 year commitment; given neither team washes its own face, the total commitment for private ownership over that sort of period must be well north of £20-30m. There aren't many people, even billionaires, prepared to give away that kind of money.
Here is a source of sorts, although it is a little old: https://www.independent.ie/sport/rugby/ ... 41445.html
Edit to add, those are player budgets. Perhaps you meant operational budget?
- Northern Lights
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I think that is a pretty fair summary, the initial move on the academy's and now the Super 6 have definitely been to try and grow the player base, we will get to the time where we need an additional team to accomodate these players, I'm hoping it is far closer to the 5 year mark than 10 but we will see.Biffer wrote: Fri Sep 04, 2020 7:28 am For what it’s worth, i think the SRU genuinely wants to do this, but isn’t going to talk about it publicly because They’ll end up being tied to artificial deadlines and have the rugby press all over them screaming about it for years before and after.
The key things we need are more money and more players. If you look at the last few years, they’ve been quite clear that those are their key aims; Dodson has banged on endlessly about increasing revenue and to be fair has been reasonably successful in that area. Similarly, there have been many statements about increasing the player pool - the Super6 and in particular the expansion of the academy are clearly all about that.
Also, the reputation we’re building for looking after players and the record we have of taking overseas players, in particular from Fiji and South Africa, lends itself to being able to bring in a few overseas pros in the first few seasons to help build the team.
I think it will happen, it’s just going to be five or ten years away.
On the finance side they have done a very good job of increasing our revenue from selling the naming rights to Murrayfield to the other commercial deals they have unlocked, I am pretty sure better on field performances have helped the commercial product too, sponsors like winners, fighting out for who is marginally less shite us or Italy isnt as appealing as when we have taken scalps the last few years from pretty much everyone bar NZ.
A few years back the SRU were looking for a £35m commitment from Martin Gilbert when he was trying to do something on a 3rd team, not all in one go but it was something like £5m for 7 years or £7m for 5 years i cant remember exactly but it was certainly enough for him to walk away which is understandable. It must also be rememberd that any 6N money or Pro league money will need to be split 3 ways not 2 as it currently is so would see funding leave the existing two teams to help with a 3rd, so the drive to get embra and the weegies both fighting out at the top is the right move before we start looking to take some cash from them.
We live and dream.
KingBlairhorn wrote: Fri Sep 04, 2020 9:35 am
Edit to add, those are player budgets. Perhaps you meant operational budget?
Yeah, I was talking about the whole shebang, everything from the "marquee" player to the person who paints the lines on the pitch, including the pitch itself of course, and the stadium that houses it.
Yeah, I was talking the full cost of running a team, ground hire, travel, operations, the whole shebang. No point in having budget for players if there’s nowhere for them to play!KingBlairhorn wrote: Fri Sep 04, 2020 9:35 am Some of those numbers (£7m) are a bit high - the current budget of both Edinburgh and Glasgow are less than that, I have previously seen around £5.5m mentioned. Leinster and Munster have budgets around the £7m mark as do the top English teams, but you could run a development team for around £3.5m (allegedly Dragon's budget).
I think this is probably one of the reasons there has been so little interest in private ownership of Glasgow and Edinburgh. The SRU are probably looking for a minimum 10 year commitment; given neither team washes its own face, the total commitment for private ownership over that sort of period must be well north of £20-30m. There aren't many people, even billionaires, prepared to give away that kind of money.
Here is a source of sorts, although it is a little old: https://www.independent.ie/sport/rugby/ ... 41445.html
Edit to add, those are player budgets. Perhaps you meant operational budget?
And are there two g’s in Bugger Off?
Edinburgh Rugby team to face Ulster in the Guinness PRO14 Semi-Final
BT Murrayfield, Saturday 5 September (kick-off 7.35pm) – live on Premier Sports
15. Blair Kinghorn (89)
14. Darcy Graham (31)
13. Mark Bennett (37)
12. Chris Dean (90)
11. Duhan van der Merwe (59)
10. Jaco van der Walt (56)
9. Nic Groom (12)
1. Rory Sutherland (83)
2. Stuart McInally (144) CAPTAIN
3. WP Nel (141)
4. Ben Toolis (119)
5. Grant Gilchrist (149)
6. Magnus Bradbury (76)
7. Hamish Watson (109)
8. Viliame Mata (73)
Replacements: 16. Mike Willemse (20) 17. Pierre Schoeman (42) 18. Simon Berghan (80) 19. Andrew Davidson (1) 20. Jamie Ritchie (68) 21. Charlie Shiel (18) 22. Nathan Chamberlain (2) 23. George Taylor (21)
BT Murrayfield, Saturday 5 September (kick-off 7.35pm) – live on Premier Sports
15. Blair Kinghorn (89)
14. Darcy Graham (31)
13. Mark Bennett (37)
12. Chris Dean (90)
11. Duhan van der Merwe (59)
10. Jaco van der Walt (56)
9. Nic Groom (12)
1. Rory Sutherland (83)
2. Stuart McInally (144) CAPTAIN
3. WP Nel (141)
4. Ben Toolis (119)
5. Grant Gilchrist (149)
6. Magnus Bradbury (76)
7. Hamish Watson (109)
8. Viliame Mata (73)
Replacements: 16. Mike Willemse (20) 17. Pierre Schoeman (42) 18. Simon Berghan (80) 19. Andrew Davidson (1) 20. Jamie Ritchie (68) 21. Charlie Shiel (18) 22. Nathan Chamberlain (2) 23. George Taylor (21)
We're close to full strength there, Ritchie would probably start if he had minutes on the park before now. Likewise Pyrgos would have been in the side, but I like Charlie Shiel off the bench, he adds so much pace coming in against a tiring defence.
Mon Embra
Mon Embra
I like Jaco at 10 although I have a concern about his tactical kicking.Slick wrote: Fri Sep 04, 2020 12:18 pm That's a very nice team.
I know i bang on about it, but 10 is the weak link for me.
I'm wondering which Groom we will see. I think he's quite good at the higher tempo game, but instead we mostly see him getting bogged down in laborious 20 second box kicking exits.
robmatic wrote: Fri Sep 04, 2020 12:28 pmI like Jaco at 10 although I have a concern about his tactical kicking.Slick wrote: Fri Sep 04, 2020 12:18 pm That's a very nice team.
I know i bang on about it, but 10 is the weak link for me.
I'm wondering which Groom we will see. I think he's quite good at the higher tempo game, but instead we mostly see him getting bogged down in laborious 20 second box kicking exits.
That is a weakness in Groom's game, for sure, he seems to get charged down more than most scrum halves, or maybe that's just my impression
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That forwards bench could be the winner for me. Bringing on Schoeman, Berghan and Richie with 20 minutes to go will scare the bejesus out of Ulster. Having said that, totally agree with Slick that 10 is a very big weakness. Hopefully game one 1862 Cup Jaco turns up.
It definitely is. VDW is a decent player but he's not first choice imo. Embra are in the same position as they've been on numerous times before, young 10 with loads of potential and nobody to learn from.Slick wrote: Fri Sep 04, 2020 12:18 pm That's a very nice team.
I know i bang on about it, but 10 is the weak link for me.
I can see that front row coming on at half timeKingBlairhorn wrote: Fri Sep 04, 2020 1:04 pm That forwards bench could be the winner for me. Bringing on Schoeman, Berghan and Richie with 20 minutes to go will scare the bejesus out of Ulster. Having said that, totally agree with Slick that 10 is a very big weakness. Hopefully game one 1862 Cup Jaco turns up.
Club rugby starts end of October, hopefully
The return to rugby competition structures in Scotland for season 2020/21 are now confirmed following a series of consultations undertaken by the Scottish Rugby Council, with clubs and schools across the country.
The Scottish Rugby Council, supported by the Championship Committee and the Rugby Development department, reached out to clubs over the summer to gather feedback, suggestions and share views on the challenges faced in returning to rugby.
The Scottish Rugby Return to Rugby Roadmap issued in June outlined the process and steps required for how rugby could return in Scotland for the 2020/21 season.
Scottish Rugby’s six stage roadmap for clubs and schools has been aligned to the Scottish Government’s own phased exit from lockdown and in line with recommendations from World Rugby. Stage 6 of Scottish Rugby's roadmap outlines when competitive rugby may return safely.
The Scottish Rugby Council has now made a series of recommendations to the Scottish Rugby Board. Following those recommendations, and recognising the exceptional circumstances and challenges that the Coronavirus pandemic has created for the game, the Board has suspended the National and Regional Competitions for one season, and has authorised a separate series of competitions designed to support teams returning to the field to play against neighbours, local rivals or smaller clusters of teams.
The competitions vary slightly from one another and take account of the feedback received from the clubs, teams and players involved, as well as the Scottish Rugby Council’s recommendations.
The Tennent’s Premiership with National League Division 1, and National League Division 2 with National League Division 3 teams, will be split across 2 competitions culminating in three finals at BT Murrayfield.
The Women’s Tennent’s Premiership and Women’s National League Division 1 teams will participate in a single competition, which will also culminate in two finals at BT Murrayfield.
Men’s and Women’s Regional Division teams will participate in a series of regional or local competitions. Scottish Rugby’s Official Beer Partner, Tennent’s, will continue their support of club rugby through their involvement in these competitions.
For Season 2020/21 boys’ and girls’ schools and youth rugby will also be different as we support young players’ return to the game, and this will continue to be supported by Mitsubishi Motors.
Following confirmation of the competition formats, work is now underway to finalise the fixture schedule and underlying competition rules.
Any club wishing to discuss the season structure further should make initial contact with their respective Council representative.
Fixtures will be released following the next Scottish Government update on 10 September.
Scottish Rugby anticipates returning to competitive rugby on Saturday 31 October 2020 - however this is still only an indicative date and is subject to change as public health information continues to be issued from the Scottish Government. Subject to the announcement next Thursday we will finalise all plans and share fixtures with clubs and schools no later than 16 September.
Scottish Rugby President, Ian Barr said: “On behalf of the Council I’d like to thank everyone from across the game who shared their views and insight to enable us to have a clear competition structure at every level, reaching the whole country, for rugby to resume when safe to do so.
"I know there has been a lot of hard work undertaken to reach this positive outcome against the backdrop of Covid-19 and while we can’t please everybody, as a Council we have listened and applied the principles of fairness and consistency throughout to develop a blended model of competition which we believe provides the right solution to the challenges we face.
“It is our best chance to kick-start Scottish rugby clubs back into action this season and I wish everyone well in the months ahead as we look forward to rugby being played again.”
Scottish Rugby’s Director of Rugby Development, Sheila Begbie said: “We are extremely grateful to everyone that has participated in this process as it has been fundamental in shaping the competitions for both the men’s and women’s game as well as the boy’s and girl’s schools and youth game.
“Through this unprecedented period of uncertainty we have had excellent support and collaboration across the game in Scotland and can now share with all clubs how we can return to competitive rugby, in a sensible, safe and appropriate way in the months ahead.”
Further information on the Return to Rugby road map may be found here.
A webinar will take place on Thursday 10 September at 4pm to communicate the latest Return to Rugby guidance for clubs and schools. To register for this webinar please click HERE.
The return to rugby competition structures in Scotland for season 2020/21 are now confirmed following a series of consultations undertaken by the Scottish Rugby Council, with clubs and schools across the country.
The Scottish Rugby Council, supported by the Championship Committee and the Rugby Development department, reached out to clubs over the summer to gather feedback, suggestions and share views on the challenges faced in returning to rugby.
The Scottish Rugby Return to Rugby Roadmap issued in June outlined the process and steps required for how rugby could return in Scotland for the 2020/21 season.
Scottish Rugby’s six stage roadmap for clubs and schools has been aligned to the Scottish Government’s own phased exit from lockdown and in line with recommendations from World Rugby. Stage 6 of Scottish Rugby's roadmap outlines when competitive rugby may return safely.
The Scottish Rugby Council has now made a series of recommendations to the Scottish Rugby Board. Following those recommendations, and recognising the exceptional circumstances and challenges that the Coronavirus pandemic has created for the game, the Board has suspended the National and Regional Competitions for one season, and has authorised a separate series of competitions designed to support teams returning to the field to play against neighbours, local rivals or smaller clusters of teams.
The competitions vary slightly from one another and take account of the feedback received from the clubs, teams and players involved, as well as the Scottish Rugby Council’s recommendations.
The Tennent’s Premiership with National League Division 1, and National League Division 2 with National League Division 3 teams, will be split across 2 competitions culminating in three finals at BT Murrayfield.
The Women’s Tennent’s Premiership and Women’s National League Division 1 teams will participate in a single competition, which will also culminate in two finals at BT Murrayfield.
Men’s and Women’s Regional Division teams will participate in a series of regional or local competitions. Scottish Rugby’s Official Beer Partner, Tennent’s, will continue their support of club rugby through their involvement in these competitions.
For Season 2020/21 boys’ and girls’ schools and youth rugby will also be different as we support young players’ return to the game, and this will continue to be supported by Mitsubishi Motors.
Following confirmation of the competition formats, work is now underway to finalise the fixture schedule and underlying competition rules.
Any club wishing to discuss the season structure further should make initial contact with their respective Council representative.
Fixtures will be released following the next Scottish Government update on 10 September.
Scottish Rugby anticipates returning to competitive rugby on Saturday 31 October 2020 - however this is still only an indicative date and is subject to change as public health information continues to be issued from the Scottish Government. Subject to the announcement next Thursday we will finalise all plans and share fixtures with clubs and schools no later than 16 September.
Scottish Rugby President, Ian Barr said: “On behalf of the Council I’d like to thank everyone from across the game who shared their views and insight to enable us to have a clear competition structure at every level, reaching the whole country, for rugby to resume when safe to do so.
"I know there has been a lot of hard work undertaken to reach this positive outcome against the backdrop of Covid-19 and while we can’t please everybody, as a Council we have listened and applied the principles of fairness and consistency throughout to develop a blended model of competition which we believe provides the right solution to the challenges we face.
“It is our best chance to kick-start Scottish rugby clubs back into action this season and I wish everyone well in the months ahead as we look forward to rugby being played again.”
Scottish Rugby’s Director of Rugby Development, Sheila Begbie said: “We are extremely grateful to everyone that has participated in this process as it has been fundamental in shaping the competitions for both the men’s and women’s game as well as the boy’s and girl’s schools and youth game.
“Through this unprecedented period of uncertainty we have had excellent support and collaboration across the game in Scotland and can now share with all clubs how we can return to competitive rugby, in a sensible, safe and appropriate way in the months ahead.”
Further information on the Return to Rugby road map may be found here.
A webinar will take place on Thursday 10 September at 4pm to communicate the latest Return to Rugby guidance for clubs and schools. To register for this webinar please click HERE.
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- Posts: 1267
- Joined: Sat Aug 22, 2020 4:35 pm
If McInally did hook that ball in scrum that collapsed, it was a shit hook.
Odd to attack that blindside with Coetzee so close.
Odd to attack that blindside with Coetzee so close.