Things that don't deserve their own thread

[Sandstorm]

Tipi or not tipi?

It's teepee. Fucking online media wankers can't spell! Not the first time I've seen it recently.

[Blackmac]

The missing Titanic sub. Whilst I can understand it malfunctioning, what I struggle to understand, with all the modern technology, is how the fudge do they lose it.

[tabascoboy]

The missing Titanic sub. Whilst I can understand it malfunctioning, what I struggle to understand, with all the modern technology, is how the fudge do they lose it.

Sounds ropey

The BBC’s US partner CBS sent one of its reporters on a voyage with the same company last year to see the wreck of the Titanic.

In his report, David Pogue reads from what appears to be a waiver which describes the submersible as an “experimental” vessel, "that has not been approved or certified by any regulatory body, and could result in physical injury, disability, emotional trauma or death".

Pogue questioned CEO Stockton Rush about the ‘jerry-rigged nature’ of some of the components. In response, Rush said that the company worked with Nasa and Boeing to ensure the safety of the pressure vessel.

[fishfoodie]

The missing Titanic sub. Whilst I can understand it malfunctioning, what I struggle to understand, with all the modern technology, is how the fudge do they lose it.

Yeah. I get regulation in deep sea adventures would be scant but I would have thought having a beacon or some shit would be necessary. To be fair I read an Irish lad today say there is one so the obvious scenario is it crumpled in on itself and then the little bits are strewn about the place. I still wonder if it is bobbing around the place

This guy does a fairly comprehensive list of some of the most egregious issues with this death trap



Bottom line, it was done on the cheap, never tested fully, & the overwhelming arrogance of the CEO has now doomed he, & four others to a hopefully, swift & painless death. If they were able to descend to the wreck, they'd have been going to ~95% of their untested theoretical crush depth !!!

If they ever got a chance to test out the 96hrs survival systems I imagine he'd have had a rethink on numerous issues like:

- Why the fuck did I ignore a century of data on steel hulls ? ( & maybe building a "stealthy" hull wasn't a good idea if something went pear shaped)
- I really wish I hadn't decided that making egress impossible without an external entity was a good idea
- I really wish I wasn't a arrogant fucker who removed voice comms, because it was occasionally irritating
- Building a Non-monolithic hull, which totally precluded options like a detachable locator buoy, extra air, a separate shitter might be a good idea for Rev 2

If this guy hasn't kids he's a solid lock for this years Darwin awards !

[GogLais]

The missing Titanic sub. Whilst I can understand it malfunctioning, what I struggle to understand, with all the modern technology, is how the fudge do they lose it.

Yeah. I get regulation in deep sea adventures would be scant but I would have thought having a beacon or some shit would be necessary. To be fair I read an Irish lad today say there is one so the obvious scenario is it crumpled in on itself and then the little bits are strewn about the place. I still wonder if it is bobbing around the place

Radio doesn’t work very well under the sea hence communication with subs at a few hundred feet requires specialist tech. Probably a non-starter at Titanic depths.

[petej]

The missing Titanic sub. Whilst I can understand it malfunctioning, what I struggle to understand, with all the modern technology, is how the fudge do they lose it.

Yeah. I get regulation in deep sea adventures would be scant but I would have thought having a beacon or some shit would be necessary. To be fair I read an Irish lad today say there is one so the obvious scenario is it crumpled in on itself and then the little bits are strewn about the place. I still wonder if it is bobbing around the place

Radio doesn’t work very well under the sea hence communication with subs at a few hundred feet requires specialist tech. Probably a non-starter at Titanic depths.

just stupidity/arrogance not to have some sort of beacon. Basically totally fucked at that depth I doubt the nation's that operate subs have anything that could rescue them. Fishfoodie has covered it well. I will reserve my empathy for those who deserve it not those who have too much money and are bored.

[GogLais]

Yeah. I get regulation in deep sea adventures would be scant but I would have thought having a beacon or some shit would be necessary. To be fair I read an Irish lad today say there is one so the obvious scenario is it crumpled in on itself and then the little bits are strewn about the place. I still wonder if it is bobbing around the place

Radio doesn’t work very well under the sea hence communication with subs at a few hundred feet requires specialist tech. Probably a non-starter at Titanic depths.

just stupidity/arrogance not to have some sort of beacon. Basically totally fucked at that depth I doubt the nation's that operate subs have anything that could rescue them. Fishfoodie has covered it well. I will reserve my empathy for those who deserve it not those who have too much money and are bored.

Well yes but I don’t know what sort of signal from a beacon could be received from that depth. As I say afaik radio wouldn’t work.

[Flockwitt]

Radio doesn’t work very well under the sea hence communication with subs at a few hundred feet requires specialist tech. Probably a non-starter at Titanic depths.

just stupidity/arrogance not to have some sort of beacon. Basically totally fucked at that depth I doubt the nation's that operate subs have anything that could rescue them. Fishfoodie has covered it well. I will reserve my empathy for those who deserve it not those who have too much money and are bored.

Well yes but I don’t know what sort of signal from a beacon could be received from that depth. As I say afaik radio wouldn’t work.

An underwater beacon is probably not practical at all. Radio won't work, sound gets mucked up with thermoclines in the sea. They're supposed to be able rise at any time and if they can't they're screwed anyway. Nobody can rescue them in time even if they've not imploded. More of a question would be if they didn't have a radio beacon or similar to be located if they had to surface in an emergency.

[weegie01]

just stupidity/arrogance not to have some sort of beacon. Basically totally fucked at that depth I doubt the nation's that operate subs have anything that could rescue them.

The deepest rescue ever was at 450 metres (Pisces III). Whilst that was 50 years ago, The Titanic is at 3,800 metres, if they are down there, there is no hope.

[fishfoodie]

just stupidity/arrogance not to have some sort of beacon. Basically totally fucked at that depth I doubt the nation's that operate subs have anything that could rescue them. Fishfoodie has covered it well. I will reserve my empathy for those who deserve it not those who have too much money and are bored.

Well yes but I don’t know what sort of signal from a beacon could be received from that depth. As I say afaik radio wouldn’t work.

An underwater beacon is probably not practical at all. Radio won't work, sound gets mucked up with thermoclines in the sea. They're supposed to be able rise at any time and if they can't they're screwed anyway. Nobody can rescue them in time even if they've not imploded. More of a question would be if they didn't have a radio beacon or similar to be located if they had to surface in an emergency.

Subs have a buoy that can be either manually deployed, or which automatically detaches if an emergency condition is detected. The buoy rises up to the surface, & starts broadcasting an SOS, so any rescuers have a start position (Rather infamously, Russian Captains used to weld the beacon in place, as it would come lose & rattle, & sometimes randomly detach & give away the subs position.)

Plane black boxes even have beacon to help them be found after crashes, & that pings for a few days. There's no good reason why submersible doesn't have beacon continually operating for the 10 hours it's in the water.

They should also have had some kind of deadmans switch to release the ballast & automatically surface after an hour, if a button wasn't pressed or something, similar to the devices trains have to stop runaway trains.

None of it is incredibly complicated, but this guys ego made this thing a deathtrap

[Grandpa]

I miss prime time shows like Tomorrows World. It's definitely at least partially responsible for me ending up in Engineering; even as a sprog I can remember looking at the innovations being presented & thinking to myself, "I can do better than that pile of shite !"'

The problems haven't really changed, but the Politicians are even more gutless & electorate more gullible, & it's always hard to get money for projects.

I fondly remember these... thank you!

[GogLais]

Parked next to a smart although ten year old BMW today. It had an iPod plugged in. Just needed a Krooklok for the vintage look.

[fishfoodie]

just stupidity/arrogance not to have some sort of beacon. Basically totally fucked at that depth I doubt the nation's that operate subs have anything that could rescue them.

The deepest rescue ever was at 450 metres (Pisces III). Whilst that was 50 years ago, The Titanic is at 3,800 metres, if they are down there, there is no hope.

480m

https://www.rte.ie/news/2023/0621/13904 ... itan-crew/

[Niegs]

How fun would this be!?

[mat the expat]

Shrekles would be into that

[shaggy]

Well yes but I don’t know what sort of signal from a beacon could be received from that depth. As I say afaik radio wouldn’t work.

An underwater beacon is probably not practical at all. Radio won't work, sound gets mucked up with thermoclines in the sea. They're supposed to be able rise at any time and if they can't they're screwed anyway. Nobody can rescue them in time even if they've not imploded. More of a question would be if they didn't have a radio beacon or similar to be located if they had to surface in an emergency.

Subs have a buoy that can be either manually deployed, or which automatically detaches if an emergency condition is detected. The buoy rises up to the surface, & starts broadcasting an SOS, so any rescuers have a start position (Rather infamously, Russian Captains used to weld the beacon in place, as it would come lose & rattle, & sometimes randomly detach & give away the subs position.)

Plane black boxes even have beacon to help them be found after crashes, & that pings for a few days. There's no good reason why submersible doesn't have beacon continually operating for the 10 hours it's in the water.

They should also have had some kind of deadmans switch to release the ballast & automatically surface after an hour, if a button wasn't pressed or something, similar to the devices trains have to stop runaway trains.

None of it is incredibly complicated, but this guys ego made this thing a deathtrap

In the oil & gas industry all of our submersibles/ROVs have transponders fitted which the vessel deploying them can monitor position through hydroacoustic monitoring systems.

We know the position of our deployed craft at all times, however they are usually tethered by a comms and power umbilical, which is not the case here.

As we are moving to autonomous underwater craft there is no tether but we still deploy transponders and monitor location from the support vessel.

Not sure on the depth range of hydro acoustics systems but I have personally used them in 2500m water depth.

[inactionman]

An underwater beacon is probably not practical at all. Radio won't work, sound gets mucked up with thermoclines in the sea. They're supposed to be able rise at any time and if they can't they're screwed anyway. Nobody can rescue them in time even if they've not imploded. More of a question would be if they didn't have a radio beacon or similar to be located if they had to surface in an emergency.

Subs have a buoy that can be either manually deployed, or which automatically detaches if an emergency condition is detected. The buoy rises up to the surface, & starts broadcasting an SOS, so any rescuers have a start position (Rather infamously, Russian Captains used to weld the beacon in place, as it would come lose & rattle, & sometimes randomly detach & give away the subs position.)

Plane black boxes even have beacon to help them be found after crashes, & that pings for a few days. There's no good reason why submersible doesn't have beacon continually operating for the 10 hours it's in the water.

They should also have had some kind of deadmans switch to release the ballast & automatically surface after an hour, if a button wasn't pressed or something, similar to the devices trains have to stop runaway trains.

None of it is incredibly complicated, but this guys ego made this thing a deathtrap

In the oil & gas industry all of our submersibles/ROVs have transponders fitted which the vessel deploying them can monitor position through hydroacoustic monitoring systems.

We know the position of our deployed craft at all times, however they are usually tethered by a comms and power umbilical, which is not the case here.

As we are moving to autonomous underwater craft there is no tether but we still deploy transponders and monitor location from the support vessel.

Not sure on the depth range of hydro acoustics systems but I have personally used them in 2500m water depth.

Your job sounds awesome.

I spend all day writing snarky emails trying to get our developers to actually develop something.

[sockwithaticket]

Spoiler

Show

Quality article in the Torygraph

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/travel/fest ... festivals/

How the middle class ruined music festivals

With tickets costing as much as £340 and attendees rising early to do yoga, music festivals have gone from mosh pit to posh pit

The festival season is upon us. Or, at least, upon those of us with deep pockets. The cost of Glastonbury tickets has, this year, risen from £270 to £340. Who can afford that, you might ask? In brief, the middle aged and middle classed. Or as one Reddit thread put it more poetically: “It’s so middle class these days the welfare tent is run by BUPA!” (Fact check: it’s not, not yet at least...)

So if you (like me), fall into this demographic, you can either give yourself a pat on the back for keeping festivals afloat, or, you could take a good hard look at yourself and tell us if (a one academic paper put it) you too are contributing to music festivals turning “from mosh pit to posh pit”.

Early morning ashtanga
Rising early to do yoga, ideally on a stand-up-paddle-board, balanced on the still waters of a lake, preferably in the grounds of a stately home? Strike one.

Latitude founder Melvin Benn saw us coming as early as 2014, when he said (perhaps slightly too frankly): “Yoga absolutely reinforces our middle-class credentials, and I’ve no qualms about that at all.” The practice, of course, spread faster than you can say “lululemons”.

See ‘Overhead at Wilderness’, a briefly viral hashtag celebrating (or was it reviling?) snippets of conversation from the most middle-class of festivals (think ‘Overheard at Waitrose’ but even more chi-chi). A Huffington Post reporter won with this harvested gem: “Father in a sparkly headband to toddler: “have you done your yoga yet, sweetie?”

Which leads us on to the next test...

Do you drag the kids along?

Diggory and Araminta have been going to festivals since they were in utero. You used to put them in a vintage trailer (expensive ear-defenders optional, fairy lights a must). But then they started expressing opinions on your music choices, which was a bit of a downer. So thank God for the babysitting service in the kids’ field where (for £40) you can park them every evening and – if there’s a must-see talk on microdosing or a gong bath session or some costly cosmic recalibration to do – much of the day too.

Do you know your rights?

Jemima and Henry have absolutely aced the dress code. They could not look more free-spirited and easy-going if they tried (and dear God, have they tried). But they’re not bloody fools. Henry is a man of means and doesn’t have to put up with incompetence. Thus, the teenage minimum-wage workers at the vintage food truck, and the nice eco-entrepreneurs running the floral crown workshops, live in fear of running out of sriracha sauce or peonies.

Jemima and Henry know their rights and (in the absence of the toddlers who disappeared into the creche two days ago and have not been seen since) are more than ready to throw their own toys and privilege out of the pram. Rightly so. As the Mirror recounted when Borough Market’s cheese festival became overcrowded: “Andy Green travelled all the way from Kent to eat cheese and was very upset by the meltdown.”

Enter the echo chamber
Because you’re not only a free-spirit (trapped in Fulham for 360 days a year) but you’re also ‘an enquiring mind’ (temporarily ensnared by the City) you’ve made sure to book into all the most zeitgeisty talks. You are expanding your worldview. It is, I suppose, slightly odd then that everyone in the audience and on stage looks rather like you. In fact, looking around, you feel like you recognise a fair few from the school run/ski trips/the kids’ tennis classes.

Welcome to what the actor Keith Allen has termed: the Whitehallisation of festivals. He was talking specifically about the Edinburgh Fringe, and Whitehalls of the Jack, not governmental variety, though the same probably applies. Either way, posh white men have taken over, he claimed, with the result that: “The festival now has as much creative energy as a chartered surveyors’ away day.”

Wildly overblown use of the world ‘wild’

There will be wild swimming (strictly from 10-10.45 am, only under the supervision of the lifeguard), wild flower crowns (£35 a workshop), wild mushrooms in the organic £15 breakfast rolls, wild cooking by Michelin-starred chefs (£80 a head for some foraged sorrel off a trestle table), wild nights out dancing to DJs in their 50s and ending at just past 10pm. “How was it?” your friends back in High Wycombe will ask. “Oh, it was absolutely wild,” you absolutely must reply.

Tipi or not tipi?

First they came for our perfectly serviceable Mountain Warehouse tents, and we did not speak out because bell tents do have a certain nostalgic charm, especially when sprinkled artfully with bunting. Then came pre-erected glamping tipis. And we still stayed silent because putting up the bell tent was a bit of a bore after a long week at the coal face and while we are still very much (can’t stress this enough) young and free at heart, the double bed and White Company sheets are rather easier on the old back and knees.

But now, suddenly, The Pop-Up Hotel’s “luxe Glastonbury glamping experience” is charging £11,999 for five nights in a “Safari Suite” with a king size bed, sofa, and en-suite bathroom with (crucially) your own private flushing toilet, hot water, shower and basin. There’s a private bar on site too, which is nice as you don’t have to jostle with the grockles, and a pool, restaurant and spa.

So really, you find yourself wondering, do we really need to traipse the ten-minute ‘flat walk’ to the festival itself. We can hear it all at a rather more civilised volume from here, and catch the highlights on the iPad (plentiful charging points). We’ll just dip in at the end to collect the kids from the babysitting service...

[/quote]

Definitely the case for a lot of the major fests. Duoubt you'd see much of that at Arctangent or Outbreak.

[shaggy]

Subs have a buoy that can be either manually deployed, or which automatically detaches if an emergency condition is detected. The buoy rises up to the surface, & starts broadcasting an SOS, so any rescuers have a start position (Rather infamously, Russian Captains used to weld the beacon in place, as it would come lose & rattle, & sometimes randomly detach & give away the subs position.)

Plane black boxes even have beacon to help them be found after crashes, & that pings for a few days. There's no good reason why submersible doesn't have beacon continually operating for the 10 hours it's in the water.

They should also have had some kind of deadmans switch to release the ballast & automatically surface after an hour, if a button wasn't pressed or something, similar to the devices trains have to stop runaway trains.

None of it is incredibly complicated, but this guys ego made this thing a deathtrap

In the oil & gas industry all of our submersibles/ROVs have transponders fitted which the vessel deploying them can monitor position through hydroacoustic monitoring systems.

We know the position of our deployed craft at all times, however they are usually tethered by a comms and power umbilical, which is not the case here.

As we are moving to autonomous underwater craft there is no tether but we still deploy transponders and monitor location from the support vessel.

Not sure on the depth range of hydro acoustics systems but I have personally used them in 2500m water depth.

Your job sounds awesome.

I spend all day writing snarky emails trying to get our developers to actually develop something.

I drive a desk now but have been fortunate to travel the world and do some pretty industry leading work in marine. Some of the achievements are truly astonishing when you look back, but the deep water scopes always hit the headlines as what was seen as impossible one year always gets done eventually.

[average joe]

So, my understanding is that they've been missing since Monday? What's the chances they're still alive?

[dpedin]

So, my understanding is that they've been missing since Monday? What's the chances they're still alive?

Zero

[average joe]

I'm asking because the headlines this morning said they're doubling search efforts in fear that they might be running out of oxygen. My thinking was that surly they would have run out a while ago.

So, the search now is to retrieve bodies and some expensive equipment.

[fishfoodie]

I'm asking because the headlines this morning said they're doubling search efforts in fear that they might be running out of oxygen. My thinking was that surly they would have run out a while ago.

So, the search now is to retrieve bodies and some expensive equipment.

I have this funny feeling that the Governments aren't doing much, because the US established, very quickly, that it imploded, but doesn't want to show how good SOSUS is. Hence the US just had a quiet word with Canada, & they both are just going thru the motions.

If there was an explosive decompression there won't even be any bodies to recover, & any recovery is going to be very slow, because the only vessels that can go that deep are limited, & I think this is another reason why experts thought they were dead whatever, because 96 hours just isn't enough time to find the thing, get everything in place, get down to it, hook it up, & bring it safely to the surface.

[Slick]

Aussie types, is there still a lot of fall out going on from the PWC being cunts thing?

My BiL is a partner there and is seriously worried about the whole operation getting closed down.

FYI - https://www.afr.com/companies/professio ... 622-p5dip8

[shaggy]

I'm asking because the headlines this morning said they're doubling search efforts in fear that they might be running out of oxygen. My thinking was that surly they would have run out a while ago.

So, the search now is to retrieve bodies and some expensive equipment.

I have this funny feeling that the Governments aren't doing much, because the US established, very quickly, that it imploded, but doesn't want to show how good SOSUS is. Hence the US just had a quiet word with Canada, & they both are just going thru the motions.

If there was an explosive decompression there won't even be any bodies to recover, & any recovery is going to be very slow, because the only vessels that can go that deep are limited, & I think this is another reason why experts thought they were dead whatever, because 96 hours just isn't enough time to find the thing, get everything in place, get down to it, hook it up, & bring it safely to the surface.

Had a very peripheral role in the Kursk recovery, which redefined what was possible in the submersible recovery space, but the signs are as bad here. Don’t think the governments are acting in bad faith at all, they are following the military Incident Command framework and always have a desired outcome of success

[fishfoodie]

I'm asking because the headlines this morning said they're doubling search efforts in fear that they might be running out of oxygen. My thinking was that surly they would have run out a while ago.

So, the search now is to retrieve bodies and some expensive equipment.

I have this funny feeling that the Governments aren't doing much, because the US established, very quickly, that it imploded, but doesn't want to show how good SOSUS is. Hence the US just had a quiet word with Canada, & they both are just going thru the motions.

If there was an explosive decompression there won't even be any bodies to recover, & any recovery is going to be very slow, because the only vessels that can go that deep are limited, & I think this is another reason why experts thought they were dead whatever, because 96 hours just isn't enough time to find the thing, get everything in place, get down to it, hook it up, & bring it safely to the surface.

Had a very peripheral role in the Kursk recovery, which redefined what was possible in the submersible recovery space, but the signs are as bad here. Don’t think the governments are acting in bad faith at all, they are following the military Incident Command framework and always have a desired outcome of success

I don't think its really bad faith, but I think they have the experience & information to take a pragmatic line on the feasibility of any rescue.

The more I hear about this submersible, the more I'm amazed that anyone who did due diligence would get inside it !

This was only it's 3rd/4th trip down to the Titanic !!!

[Blackmac]

I have this funny feeling that the Governments aren't doing much, because the US established, very quickly, that it imploded, but doesn't want to show how good SOSUS is. Hence the US just had a quiet word with Canada, & they both are just going thru the motions.

If there was an explosive decompression there won't even be any bodies to recover, & any recovery is going to be very slow, because the only vessels that can go that deep are limited, & I think this is another reason why experts thought they were dead whatever, because 96 hours just isn't enough time to find the thing, get everything in place, get down to it, hook it up, & bring it safely to the surface.

Had a very peripheral role in the Kursk recovery, which redefined what was possible in the submersible recovery space, but the signs are as bad here. Don’t think the governments are acting in bad faith at all, they are following the military Incident Command framework and always have a desired outcome of success

I don't think its really bad faith, but I think they have the experience & information to take a pragmatic line on the feasibility of any rescue.

The more I hear about this submersible, the more I'm amazed that anyone who did due diligence would get inside it !

This was only it's 3rd/4th trip down to the Titanic !!!

I see they have found a debris field, so presumably a catastrophic implosion. The more you hear the back story of that death trap it has all the hallmarks of 5 ridiculously expensive Darwin Awards.

[tabascoboy]

Had a very peripheral role in the Kursk recovery, which redefined what was possible in the submersible recovery space, but the signs are as bad here. Don’t think the governments are acting in bad faith at all, they are following the military Incident Command framework and always have a desired outcome of success

I don't think its really bad faith, but I think they have the experience & information to take a pragmatic line on the feasibility of any rescue.

The more I hear about this submersible, the more I'm amazed that anyone who did due diligence would get inside it !

This was only it's 3rd/4th trip down to the Titanic !!!

I see they have found a debris field, so presumably a catastrophic implosion. The more you hear the back story of that death trap it has all the hallmarks of 5 ridiculously expensive Darwin Awards.

Unfortunately yes, it does appear that the tourists, presumably intelligent people, should have been very well aware of the risks involved but possibly swayed by false claims of safety and emergency action and recovery in the quest for adventure. From what I read, not a great deal is known about deep ocean currents so that if it becomes powerless in the depths it could drift almost anywhere, hence the near impossibility of locating it (especially when the comms seem to have been another part of the cowboy job).

It's going to get ugly for this company as I'm sure families of the victims won't just let this pass, and then you have the cost of the attempted search and recovery).

I know we supposed to be enthusiastic about "enterprise" but more and more it seems like this was a total disaster in waiting.

[Guy Smiley]

Aussie types, is there still a lot of fall out going on from the PWC being cunts thing?

My BiL is a partner there and is seriously worried about the whole operation getting closed down.

FYI - https://www.afr.com/companies/professio ... 622-p5dip8

I moved back to NZ a few years back but I still follow Aus politics... this is massive. Going by the reporting I've read it's got the potential to threaten the widespread use of consultants generally and something of a return to a larger public service with in house capacity for the work.

The current Labor government campaigned strongly on setting up a Federal Independent Commission Against Corruption. State based ICAC's have proven highly successful in rooting out political corruption and there's a strong appetite for the same at Federal level... the PwC scandal ties into that appetite and comes hot on the heels of widespread resentment at inequality post Covid which has seen the sadly usual rise of corporate profits while living standards and cost of living are hurting badly... PwC will be seen (quite rightly) as the representation of that corporate greed that has become so rudely obvious to anyone with half an eye on the world.

Australians like the idea of everyone paying their share of taxes, even if they hate paying them personally. To see PwC so actively involved in undermining the tax system from within....? holy fuck, pitchfork sales will be through the roof.

[fishfoodie]

I don't think its really bad faith, but I think they have the experience & information to take a pragmatic line on the feasibility of any rescue.

The more I hear about this submersible, the more I'm amazed that anyone who did due diligence would get inside it !

This was only it's 3rd/4th trip down to the Titanic !!!

I see they have found a debris field, so presumably a catastrophic implosion. The more you hear the back story of that death trap it has all the hallmarks of 5 ridiculously expensive Darwin Awards.

Unfortunately yes, it does appear that the tourists, presumably intelligent people, should have been very well aware of the risks involved but possibly swayed by false claims of safety and emergency action and recovery in the quest for adventure. From what I read, not a great deal is known about deep ocean currents so that if it becomes powerless in the depths it could drift almost anywhere, hence the near impossibility of locating it (especially when the comms seem to have been another part of the cowboy job).

It's going to get ugly for this company as I'm sure families of the victims won't just let this pass, and then you have the cost of the attempted search and recovery).

I know we supposed to be enthusiastic about "enterprise" but more and more it seems like this was a total disaster in waiting.

Unfortunately a lot of chancers, con men & outright thieves hide behind the entrepreneur label, & pretend that anyone who demands rigor is just an old fogey.

At the minimum, before I set foot inside this thing I would want to know what the actual crush depth was, because they'd sent one down 100, or 200x times & on the 223rd time it had failed, i.e. they tested the design to destruction the way real Engineers do.

[Slick]

Aussie types, is there still a lot of fall out going on from the PWC being cunts thing?

My BiL is a partner there and is seriously worried about the whole operation getting closed down.

FYI - https://www.afr.com/companies/professio ... 622-p5dip8

I moved back to NZ a few years back but I still follow Aus politics... this is massive. Going by the reporting I've read it's got the potential to threaten the widespread use of consultants generally and something of a return to a larger public service with in house capacity for the work.

The current Labor government campaigned strongly on setting up a Federal Independent Commission Against Corruption. State based ICAC's have proven highly successful in rooting out political corruption and there's a strong appetite for the same at Federal level... the PwC scandal ties into that appetite and comes hot on the heels of widespread resentment at inequality post Covid which has seen the sadly usual rise of corporate profits while living standards and cost of living are hurting badly... PwC will be seen (quite rightly) as the representation of that corporate greed that has become so rudely obvious to anyone with half an eye on the world.

Australians like the idea of everyone paying their share of taxes, even if they hate paying them personally. To see PwC so actively involved in undermining the tax system from within....? holy fuck, pitchfork sales will be through the roof.

Thanks mate.

I’m kind of conflicted on this as all these consultancies, particularly the Big 4 are a bunch of cunts who need destroying. On the other hand by BiL is a good man who has worked extremely hard and just wouldn’t be part of stuff like this - it’s absolutely torn him apart that the company he has worked for, for 20+ years has done this. He’s now waiting to see if he has a job or not

It’s such a momentous piece of news that I’m surprised we haven’t seen more of it over here.

[Guy Smiley]

It’s such a momentous piece of news that I’m surprised we haven’t seen more of it over here.

I feel for the BiL, it wouldn't be a nice place to be right now. I had a mate years back who worked for MacQuarie... he put in huge hours, spent weeks away from the family working on 'projects' that can't have sat well with our free radical beers and sport social habits. It ended up costing him the marriage. Soul destroying corporations are a real thing.

It is a huge story and I wonder just how far it will run. Political will to effect change is lacking in Australia... I don't think it'll blow over but it might not end up a nuclear catastrophe.

[tabascoboy]

'Landing frame and a rear cover from the submersible' among the debris

We have just had an update from dive expert David Mearns, who says the debris includes "a landing frame and a rear cover from the submersible".

Mearns is a friend of passengers aboard the Titan.

[fishfoodie]

Which will happen first; the Memorial service for the deceased, or OceanGate filing for Chapter 11 ?

One things for sure, the cost of insurance for this kind of jaunt has just got a lot more expensive, & probably prohibitive for everything but the touristy gigs showing passengers the likes of offshore reefs, that never go below 10m

[Hal Jordan]

It's the kid I feel sorry for. The others were mature enough to know what they were getting into, I'm having a hard time believing a 19 year old had any concept that something could go wrong. At that age you usually think you're invincible and I certainly don't have any recollection of contemplating my own death at that age.

[Sandstorm]

Which will happen first; the Memorial service for the deceased, or OceanGate filing for Chapter 11 ?

One things for sure, the cost of insurance for this kind of jaunt has just got a lot more expensive, & probably prohibitive for everything but the touristy gigs showing passengers the likes of offshore reefs, that never go below 10m

Virgin starts flying tourists into space next year.

[GogLais]

Which will happen first; the Memorial service for the deceased, or OceanGate filing for Chapter 11 ?

One things for sure, the cost of insurance for this kind of jaunt has just got a lot more expensive, & probably prohibitive for everything but the touristy gigs showing passengers the likes of offshore reefs, that never go below 10m

Had a trip in a tourist submarine to see the fish off Gran Canaria. We ended up resting on the seabed while the crew consulted manuals. Hearing them hitting things at the back end was a bit worrying. Never again.

[fishfoodie]

Which will happen first; the Memorial service for the deceased, or OceanGate filing for Chapter 11 ?

One things for sure, the cost of insurance for this kind of jaunt has just got a lot more expensive, & probably prohibitive for everything but the touristy gigs showing passengers the likes of offshore reefs, that never go below 10m

Virgin starts flying tourists into space next year.

They're already off to a good start, having killed a couple of test pilots, to prove that their simulator was unfit for purpose, & flight sequence was almost impossible for a normal human pilot.

[tabascoboy]

Some small consolation if better knowledge than mine is accurate is that the fatal implosion would have been near instantaneous and so those on board avoided the terror of slowly running out of oxygen.

[fishfoodie]

Some small consolation if better knowledge than mine is accurate is that the fatal implosion would have been near instantaneous and so those on board avoided the terror of slowly running out of oxygen.

The maths says that they were dead before the signal could get from their nerves to their brain to let them know they were dead.