Stop voting for fucking Tories

[SaintK]

Home Office not fit for purpose Part 345

[dpedin]

Well the NHS Workforce Plan has been published and on face of it it is going in right direction. However dig deeper and there are big holes in it that require to be addressed. I apologise if I have missed things or misinterpreted issues from my quick read in advance,

1. According to previous research for 100 new nurses taken into training only 55 wte will actually appear on the NHS books. This level of attrition doesnt seem to feature in their projections?
2. Many Universities are actually struggling to recruit into nursing degrees and attrition is increasing. Similarly whilst most medical undergraduate courses are over subscribed a large % of them are overseas students who pay a fortune on fees and on whom the Unis are dependant on for additional income. Universities will be very very reluctant to reduce overseas student numbers in order to increase capacity for UK students - expect a battle!
3. Similar ratio applies for GPs - for 100 taken into undergraduate programme only 50 wte appear on the NHS books. Many GPs do not want to work full time nor take on load of becoming a partner in a practice. On average a new GP will work part time about 0.7 - 0.8 wte.
4. There is nothing about increasing NHS budgets to employ and train the junior docs after they graduate and fill Core training or Specialty training roles.
5. There is nothing about increasing NHS budgets to employ all these additional staff. It costs about £1m to direct employ 7-8 new consultants pa - double that for additional clinics, theatre time, beds and all the staffing required - do the maths. You dont employ more surgeons without increasing theatre capacity for them to work in!
6. There is nothing about pay which is a key determinant for staff retention particularly doctors.
7. Almost all of the expenditure for the plan will fall outside this current Gov term so in effect all the Head Boy has done has 'spent' future Gov money in order to gain a few brownie points in the polls. Tory Gov should have done this 10 years ago but obviously didnt want to commit to spending, now they are heading out of office they are delighted to create a hostage to fortune for Labour.
8. None of the 'new' roles etc are new ie Physician Associates are already established but poorly regulated at the moment.
9. The modelling work in the appendices is very, very optimistic and is heroic in its assumptions in order to make the numbers balance, Even then they struggle to break even.
10. The plan doesnt really address the problems with training pipelines ie midwifes and junior docs need to do a number of births in a year in order to achieve training requirements. ditto existing staff need to do the same in order to retain their CPD requirements. It looks like we will need to boost the number of births in order for everyone to achieve their training targets! The same applies for many of the medical specialties where there will be insufficient capacity within the current consultant workforce to train and supervise all the additional trainees, it is a rate limiting factor. Also remember that it is too late to increase intakes this year so at best numbers will increase from 2024 onwards - again after the tories have hopefully lost the the next GE.
10. Most importantly there is nothing or very little in the plan that will address the immediate gaps in the workforce, at best it will take 3 years to train a PA, 4 years to get a nurse/AHP up to speed and 10 years to generate more GPs, about 15 years for a cancer specialist. Indeed when you look at the modelling you immediately see just how bad the workforce issues have become under the Tory Gov of the last 13 years.

So it looks like a decent plan but it is one Sunak knows he will not have to deliver not fund. It also doesn't address the immediate NHS issues, it is about 10 years too late and will merely patch up the last 13 years of Tory neglect. It does nothing about pay, in fact it ignores it completely which is astonshing given it is a key determinant of medical workforce supply in an international market and which is the key issue for current retention issues. It makes heroic assumptions in order to make the modelling balance. It ignores the reality of training and the current capacity of the NHS to train and absorb new staff whilst struggling to address waiting times and surging demand. In conclusion it is pretty much a window dressing exercise.

https://www.england.nhs.uk/wp-content/u ... e-plan.pdf

[Insane_Homer]

It's about as meaty as 40 new Hospitals, anyone falling for their bullshit needs to be deported to Rwanda.

[Hal Jordan]

Poor, poor, Nigel. Yeeted by the wokerati at that bastion of lefties, Coutts.

[fishfoodie]

Poor, poor, Nigel. Yeeted by the wokerati at that bastion of lefties, Coutts.

The speculated reasons for them declining his business are, interesting

[Hal Jordan]

Poor, poor, Nigel. Yeeted by the wokerati at that bastion of lefties, Coutts.

The speculated reasons for them declining his business are, interesting

You might very well think that; but I couldn't possibly comment.

Apparently Barclays also declined banking facilities for that nice Mr Banks. I have no idea why that might be, sadly.

[Insane_Homer]

Poor, poor, Nigel. Yeeted by the wokerati at that bastion of lefties, Coutts.

The speculated reasons for them declining his business are, interesting

Might I guess that it has more to do with Rubels, paypal and rhymes with bunny maundering; and less to do with their 'free speech' views.

[tabascoboy]

Poor, poor, Nigel. Yeeted by the wokerati at that bastion of lefties, Coutts.

He can STFU and FTFO

[Hal Jordan]

Don't let the door hit you on the way out, Nigel. I hear the Principality of Sealand is nice.

[tabascoboy]

Don't let the door hit you on the way out, Nigel. I hear the Principality of Sealand is nice.

I heard Rwanda comes with the highest recommendations

[petej]

Don't let the door hit you on the way out, Nigel. I hear the Principality of Sealand is nice.

I heard Rwanda comes with the highest recommendations

Moscow is nice. Must be some sort of order of propaganda that nige is due.

[tabascoboy]

Don't let the door hit you on the way out, Nigel. I hear the Principality of Sealand is nice.

I heard Rwanda comes with the highest recommendations

Moscow is nice. Must be some sort of order of propaganda that nige is due.

Bring your own washing machine

[yermum]

Poor, poor, Nigel. Yeeted by the wokerati at that bastion of lefties, Coutts.

Coutts make a big play of their social values. It’s is super woke washed.

Terrible bank though. I have the misfortune of being a customer due to my wife’s job.

[dpedin]

Might have something to do with the new money laundering regulations that came into force in April 2013? See - Money Laundering and Terrorist Financing (Amendment) (No. 2) Regulations 2022. I suspect many banks dont want to be exposed to future penalties re Russian money coming being laundered via his bank accounts? As usual the frog faced twat is trying to warp the public discussion around him being punished rather than any in depth analysis of where and who funds him and his mates. I believe his bum chum Banks is having similar problems? They can just feck off, and once the feck off they can feck off again ...

[I like neeps]

Poor, poor, Nigel. Yeeted by the wokerati at that bastion of lefties, Coutts.

Coutts make a big play of their social values. It’s is super woke washed.

Terrible bank though. I have the misfortune of being a customer due to my wife’s job.

Quite the humble brag, because of my wife's job we need to bank with the bank for millionaires. What's the minimum elibigility for an account? 3m in savings?

[Biffer]

Poor, poor, Nigel. Yeeted by the wokerati at that bastion of lefties, Coutts.

Coutts make a big play of their social values. It’s is super woke washed.

Terrible bank though. I have the misfortune of being a customer due to my wife’s job.

Quite the humble brag, because of my wife's job we need to bank with the bank for millionaires. What's the minimum elibigility for an account? 3m in savings?

That requirement is waived for employees. Used to be something similar for Bank of England employees as well, they ran current accounts for employees only.

[C69]

Poor, poor, Nigel. Yeeted by the wokerati at that bastion of lefties, Coutts.

Coutts make a big play of their social values. It’s is super woke washed.

Terrible bank though. I have the misfortune of being a customer due to my wife’s job.

Quite the humble brag, because of my wife's job we need to bank with the bank for millionaires. What's the minimum elibigility for an account? 3m in savings?

Does Daddy live in Oundle ?

[yermum]

Poor, poor, Nigel. Yeeted by the wokerati at that bastion of lefties, Coutts.

Coutts make a big play of their social values. It’s is super woke washed.

Terrible bank though. I have the misfortune of being a customer due to my wife’s job.

Quite the humble brag, because of my wife's job we need to bank with the bank for millionaires. What's the minimum elibigility for an account? 3m in savings?

I wish we had that much money but the missus works for an audit firm that has strict conflict of interest stuff (which also applies to spouses and dependants) it rules out lots of high street banks and makes simple things like opening an ISA a pain in the arse as it all has to be approved.

Coutts offer a Chinese wall service for her company where they handle both day to day banking and investments etc. Trust me I would not pay the fees they charge for the shit service they give.

[yermum]

Coutts make a big play of their social values. It’s is super woke washed.

Terrible bank though. I have the misfortune of being a customer due to my wife’s job.

Quite the humble brag, because of my wife's job we need to bank with the bank for millionaires. What's the minimum elibigility for an account? 3m in savings?

Does Daddy live in Oundle ?

I would be banking with Hoare and Co if that were the case...

Coutts is a flash Natwest for the newly minted that feel the need to waste money on bank fees to impress people

I hasten to add we only use them due to circumstance and come nowhere near the eligibility criteria for regular punters.

[Dinsdale Piranha]

Quite the humble brag, because of my wife's job we need to bank with the bank for millionaires. What's the minimum elibigility for an account? 3m in savings?

Does Daddy live in Oundle ?

I would be banking with Hoare and Co if that were the case...

Coutts is a flash Natwest for the newly minted that feel the need to waste money on bank fees to impress people

I hasten to add we only use them due to circumstance and come nowhere near the eligibility criteria for regular punters.

A few friends used to have accounts with Coutts. Some time back they started charging about £3K annually for a current account which caused everybody I knew to leave - none of my friends were millionaires. Usually had accounts because their parents were customers.

[Sandstorm]

Lotto directs their new winners to Coutts.

[yermum]

Lotto directs their new winners to Coutts.

Exactly . Very much the arriviste bank of choice.

Proper private banks are invite only.

[_Os_]

Still no evidence anything Farage is crying about is actually true. It may well be, far right political activists have been denied banking services in the past in the UK. But where is the evidence.

At the moment it seems the whole media is taking it on faith that Farage is an honest dealer. The same man known for taking one position and then taking up an opposite and opposing position (he has at different times supported every type of Brexit: Norway/Switerland/SM/CU/hard Brexit/no deal). The same man who now says Brexit has failed. The same man that just a few months ago after census information was released, conflated "white" and "British" (they are not the same thing) and claimed London was "minority white", when in fact London had/has a small white majority. The same man who has said Putin is the leader he most "admires" and says everyone should agree they're on the same side as Putin's Russia, and who later blamed NATO for the Ukraine war. The same man who has spoken at an AfD rally in Germany. The same man that supports Le Pen and the National Front in France. The same man who has peddled Soros conspiracy theories saying that he's "the most dangerous man in the world" and the same person who has stated Jewish lobbies in America are very powerful. The same man who calls opponents "globalists" without ever explaining what he means by that. The same man who has opposed sanctions on Iran. The same man who said he didn't want Romanians living next door to him. The same man who has called Muslims a "fifth column" and makes constant claims about an immigrant takeover and admires Enoch Powell. The same man who said Sadiq Khan has no understanding of London's history.

Seems totally sane and normal to let this guy run his mouth for days in the media, other journalists and media outlets following his lead, including newspaper frontpages devoted to the subject of if he's allowed a bank account. All without anyone asking him to provide any evidence.

The real questions are: Why hasn't this guy disappeared into total obscurity yet? Why did he appear so often on Question Time? Why does he get all this media coverage whilst only being a far right activist journalist?

[dpedin]

Still no evidence anything Farage is crying about is actually true. It may well be, far right political activists have been denied banking services in the past in the UK. But where is the evidence.

At the moment it seems the whole media is taking it on faith that Farage is an honest dealer. The same man known for taking one position and then taking up an opposite and opposing position (he has at different times supported every type of Brexit: Norway/Switerland/SM/CU/hard Brexit/no deal). The same man who now says Brexit has failed. The same man that just a few months ago after census information was released, conflated "white" and "British" (they are not the same thing) and claimed London was "minority white", when in fact London had/has a small white majority. The same man who has said Putin is the leader he most "admires" and says everyone should agree they're on the same side as Putin's Russia, and who later blamed NATO for the Ukraine war. The same man who has spoken at an AfD rally in Germany. The same man that supports Le Pen and the National Front in France. The same man who has peddled Soros conspiracy theories saying that he's "the most dangerous man in the world" and the same person who has stated Jewish lobbies in America are very powerful. The same man who calls opponents "globalists" without ever explaining what he means by that. The same man who has opposed sanctions on Iran. The same man who said he didn't want Romanians living next door to him. The same man who has called Muslims a "fifth column" and makes constant claims about an immigrant takeover and admires Enoch Powell. The same man who said Sadiq Khan has no understanding of London's history.

Seems totally sane and normal to let this guy run his mouth for days in the media, other journalists and media outlets following his lead, including newspaper frontpages devoted to the subject of if he's allowed a bank account. All without anyone asking him to provide any evidence.

The real questions are: Why hasn't this guy disappeared into total obscurity yet? Why did he appear so often on Question Time? Why does he get all this media coverage whilst only being a far right activist journalist?

Remember the bank cannot comment on anything about his personal banking arrangements - he knows this and uses this so he can make a whole range of unsubstantiated claims about his politics leading to him being cancelled. This is all a deflection strategy as it is likely he has been denied banking facilities by Coutts and a range of other banks because of the tightening up of the anti fraud and money laundering regulations introduced in April and that banks will become liable if they dont ensure all banking transactions are legal and not involving suspected money laundering. It is highly likely that the banks are very suspicious of the flows into and out of his accounts and possible links with dark money from Russia and the likes and have therefore denied him banking facilities as is their right and legal requirement.

For others like the Tory MPs and client journalists to come in behind him and support his unsubstantiated claims of being cancelled is very dangerous and obviously coordinated. Many are also neck deep in dodgy money and links to Russia and the likes and want to make this a culture war issue rather than to probe the real issues behind this likely money laundering and Russian collusion problems. I'm getting increasingly pissed off with all this Farage shite to be honest.

[JM2K6]

Is he not risking a defamation suit?

[fishfoodie]

I'd fucking love to see him getting added to the Magnitsky list of persons.

[_Os_]

I'd fucking love to see him getting added to the Magnitsky list of persons.

It's been said before that if you make a diagram of Trump, Trump's associates, Wikileaks, Snowdon/Assange, the National Front in France, the AfD in Germany. All entities that have been claimed (strong emphasis on claimed, for any lawyers reading) to be either clients of Putin's network or directly part of it. Then you find Farage is a key node.

[Sandstorm]

Is he not risking a defamation suit?

Farage doesn't seem to have to provide any proof, so why should the bank.

Coutts: "We denied Nige a bank account because we heard he took money from Putin"

Fuck the twat.

[_Os_]

Even if Farage's claims are taken at face value (they shouldn't be), what is the actual claim? He was punished for his use of free speech? But there is no absolute right to free speech in the UK. Absolute free speech only exists in limited situations in the UK, parliamentary privilege and speaker's corner, but even in these instances there are rules. There is no American style free speech in the UK, if the authorities decide what you said is bad then you're in trouble.

Nor is there any absolute obligation for businesses to serve customers, trying to make a business serve a customer they do not wish to usually involves a court case and/or one side going out of business (the smaller and weaker side). One recent example on this thread was the "golliwog pub", they refused to serve customers who were uncomfortable around their doll collection (and had a sign stating this). Carlsberg in turn decided they were uncomfortable supplying them, and the pub went under.

So beyond Farage lacking any evidence what he says is true, we have these options:
1. The Tory MPs backing him can propose American style free speech legislation. Which would essentially give everyone in the UK parliamentary privilege without any of the rules/conventions.
2. The same Tory MPs could legislate to force businesses to serve customers they do not wish to serve. Which I'm sure will produce no frivolous court cases in an already overloaded court system, and no instances where businesses are forced to facilitate literal criminals implicating the business in crimes.

Why hasn't Farage just gone to court if he has been wronged? (rhetorical question, as dpedin posts we know why).

[yermum]

https://www.bbc.com/news/business-66097039

He was offered a NatWest account as he doesn’t have the reddies anymore apparently

[petej]

Mr Farage also said that his business account was closed despite the fact that last year he had what he described as "large significant positive cash balances" going through his business account.

Like ffs lads

I said it early doors on PR that the average Brit was caught between a rock, Tories, and hard place, Labour. The lack of a meaningful opposition to Brexit post vote has been fucked in the head. The fact people in the UK, and the US, talk around massive Russian influence on their elections is just weird. As noted it's because so many are wrapped up in funny money but you would have thought they would have found a way to frame it differently for average Joe Red Wall by now

Our libel laws make it hard to speak out in public. Prigozin for example had a libel case against a UK journalist last summer saying he wasn't in charge of Wagner. Labour having corbyn as a leader was a disaster for the Remain campaign.

Part of the problem for the UK is the air brushing job of making us look very homogeneous as a population in opposition to fascists in the lead upto and during WW2 which just isn't true, a lot brits supported Hitler.

I found it very interesting that the rise of populists like Johnson and Farage occurred after the death of most of the greatest generation and the greatest generation that remained opposed brexit more than any other age group except the 18-24 year olds.

[GogLais]

Not necessarily a party political matter, I wouldn’t claim that Labour could handle it better, but the non-refurbishment of Parliament is a dreadful example of how hard it is to get anything done. There’s crumbling stonework, leaks, antiquated M&E services and it’s only allowed to stay open because there are fire wardens always on duty. It was decided in the 2010s that “something must be done” but I don’t think anything substantial has happened other than the refurbishment of Big Ben and the Elizabeth Tower.
I don’t think they’ve yet agreed on whether or not they will evacuate the building when not doing so will add huge amounts of time and money.

[GogLais]

Mr Farage also said that his business account was closed despite the fact that last year he had what he described as "large significant positive cash balances" going through his business account.

Like ffs lads

I said it early doors on PR that the average Brit was caught between a rock, Tories, and hard place, Labour. The lack of a meaningful opposition to Brexit post vote has been fucked in the head. The fact people in the UK, and the US, talk around massive Russian influence on their elections is just weird. As noted it's because so many are wrapped up in funny money but you would have thought they would have found a way to frame it differently for average Joe Red Wall by now

Our libel laws make it hard to speak out in public. Prigozin for example had a libel case against a UK journalist last summer saying he wasn't in charge of Wagner. Labour having corbyn as a leader was a disaster for the Remain campaign.

Part of the problem for the UK is the air brushing job of making us look very homogeneous as a population in opposition to fascists in the lead upto and during WW2 which just isn't true, a lot brits supported Hitler.

I found it very interesting that the rise of populists like Johnson and Farage occurred after the death of most of the greatest generation and the greatest generation that remained opposed brexit more than any other age group except the 18-24 year olds.

I know it’s a side issue but I query this greatest generation stuff. We’re all products of our genetics and environment, no generation is somehow born better than another.

[Hal Jordan]

Mr Farage also said that his business account was closed despite the fact that last year he had what he described as "large significant positive cash balances" going through his business account.

Like ffs lads

I said it early doors on PR that the average Brit was caught between a rock, Tories, and hard place, Labour. The lack of a meaningful opposition to Brexit post vote has been fucked in the head. The fact people in the UK, and the US, talk around massive Russian influence on their elections is just weird. As noted it's because so many are wrapped up in funny money but you would have thought they would have found a way to frame it differently for average Joe Red Wall by now

Our libel laws make it hard to speak out in public. Prigozin for example had a libel case against a UK journalist last summer saying he wasn't in charge of Wagner. Labour having corbyn as a leader was a disaster for the Remain campaign.

Part of the problem for the UK is the air brushing job of making us look very homogeneous as a population in opposition to fascists in the lead upto and during WW2 which just isn't true, a lot brits supported Hitler.

I found it very interesting that the rise of populists like Johnson and Farage occurred after the death of most of the greatest generation and the greatest generation that remained opposed brexit more than any other age group except the 18-24 year olds.

A lot of it can be blamed on the death of Empire and the reduction in power, when people looked to the good old days when Britain was top dog, we Stood Alone and the bullshit war comics and movies that fed the narrative of the noble Tommy defeating hordes of near faceless Krauts as they died screaming "Achtung! AIEEEE!" as the bayonets went in. The people who actually lived through the war tended to say nothing about it due to how fucking awful it was, and had a determinationnot.to let it happen again if possible. The only reason I know anything about my paternal grandfather's contribution to the war beyond what regiment he was in (Royal Artillery) and where he was stationed (attached to the Merchant Navy as a gunner on anti-aircraft guns on the Atlantic Convoys) is because of a few paragraphs in a book about it, The Atlantic Star, when he was interviewed by the author, and there's also a photo in the book of him on one of the guns. My maternal grandfather was in Burma and never spoke about it ever.

Farage and his ilk offer the populist trope that all your problems aren't anything you have done, isn't due to some societal imbalances, but it's their fault. The Others. And if you just do this one thing it will all go back to the good old days. Simple, easy, and absolute bullshit.

[_Os_]

Imagine a country where someone can make false claims about their access to banking services for days and days in the media, without any evidence anything they're saying is true. This supposed victim is also a far right wing cunt. This all receives uncritical and supportive media coverage, including front page coverage in newspapers with a national distribution, and national broadcaster coverage, it is even raised in parliament. Then it turns out, as you suspected from the start that there's more to it than the supposed "victim" was owning up to (and you suspect there's yet more to it, but "he's too poor now" although unlikely is maybe better for everyone involved). You then look around for anyone pointing this out in the media, and there's about two guys saying "this has been a bit strange hasn't it?".

[GogLais]

Like ffs lads

I said it early doors on PR that the average Brit was caught between a rock, Tories, and hard place, Labour. The lack of a meaningful opposition to Brexit post vote has been fucked in the head. The fact people in the UK, and the US, talk around massive Russian influence on their elections is just weird. As noted it's because so many are wrapped up in funny money but you would have thought they would have found a way to frame it differently for average Joe Red Wall by now

Our libel laws make it hard to speak out in public. Prigozin for example had a libel case against a UK journalist last summer saying he wasn't in charge of Wagner. Labour having corbyn as a leader was a disaster for the Remain campaign.

Part of the problem for the UK is the air brushing job of making us look very homogeneous as a population in opposition to fascists in the lead upto and during WW2 which just isn't true, a lot brits supported Hitler.

I found it very interesting that the rise of populists like Johnson and Farage occurred after the death of most of the greatest generation and the greatest generation that remained opposed brexit more than any other age group except the 18-24 year olds.

A lot of it can be blamed on the death of Empire and the reduction in power, when people looked to the good old days when Britain was top dog, we Stood Alone and the bullshit war comics and movies that fed the narrative of the noble Tommy defeating hordes of near faceless Krauts as they died screaming "Achtung! AIEEEE!" as the bayonets went in. The people who actually lived through the war tended to say nothing about it due to how fucking awful it was, and had a determinationnot.to let it happen again if possible. The only reason I know anything about my paternal grandfather's contribution to the war beyond what regiment he was in (Royal Artillery) and where he was stationed (attached to the Merchant Navy as a gunner on anti-aircraft guns on the Atlantic Convoys) is because of a few paragraphs in a book about it, The Atlantic Star, when he was interviewed by the author, and there's also a photo in the book of him on one of the guns. My maternal grandfather was in Burma and never spoke about it ever.

Farage and his ilk offer the populist trope that all your problems aren't anything you have done, isn't due to some societal imbalances, but it's their fault. The Others. And if you just do this one thing it will all go back to the good old days. Simple, easy, and absolute bullshit.

Well said. Not that I wanted to be rid of her but I wondered whether the death of HMTQ might result at least in some sort of break with that stuff, a reappraisal of our place in the world. Only time will tell.

[GogLais]

Is there no argument that she was a shit queen that oversaw a decaying Britain and did nothing arrest that. She also oversaw absolutely shambolic behaviour from her kids and despite the evidence did fuck all to stop it. History shouldn't be too kind to her really

That’s another argument really. My point is that maybe she was seen as a symbol of a Britain that no longer existed.

[SaintK]

He really doesn't like being questioned too closely

Rishi Sunak was accused of caring more about the laws of cricket than respecting parliament in tetchy exchanges with a senior MP.
Standards committee chairman Chris Bryant clashed with the prime minister over his attendance in the Commons chamber.
Bryant challenged Sunak over his failure to deliver a major NHS statement in parliament and missing the next two sessions of PMQs.
He also questioned him on his absence from votes on the conduct of Owen Paterson and Boris Johnson.
“We are talking about your respect for parliament,” Bryant said.

[SaintK]

Definitely doesn't like answering questions.
Only 6 months in and already has the worst attendance record at PMQ's in modern times!!

[Insane_Homer]

Thick Lizzy with 100% attendance