The Rugby Championship - W1 - 8 July : SA v Aus / Arg v NZ

[Flockwitt]

NZ plays Argentina away, SA at Mt Smart which is not our favoured ground, Australia in Melbourne at the MCG which as a cricket / AFL oval means the touchline is a looooooong way from the crowd, it's a huge amphitheatre.

Those are our RC games this year. One at home in NZ at League HQ.

It's not hard to see us come away from that lot with one win if we're lucky. A return Bledisloe game later on sees us play Australia under the roof in Dunedin.

The Fozziolis Effect will be particularly strong. In the absence of Will Jordan, for example, I can see him selecting either BB or DMac at 15 in order to leave one of them on the bench to switch out with Mo'unga at the prescribed 60 minute mark regardless of performance...and leaving Shaun Stevenson on the bench until the last 5 minutes before giving him a sympathy cap when the game is lost.

fuck

You're nothing but a pessimist,








and probably right.

[Sandstorm]

The Fozziolis Effect will be particularly strong. In the absence of Will Jordan, for example, I can see him selecting either BB or DMac at 15 in order to leave one of them on the bench to switch out with Mo'unga at the prescribed 60 minute mark regardless of performance...and leaving Shaun Stevenson on the bench until the last 5 minutes before giving him a sympathy cap when the game is lost.

fuck

That’s a plan we can all get behind.

[OomStruisbaai]

No it's a Nienaber thing. Rassie use to hold it back to the last minute. Nienaber believe it's better for the players.

It’s also better for the likes of Schmidt to formulate a plan.

Why can’t they just hear it in private?

Anyway, it’s good in that it gives us something earlier on our thread …

I quite like it, tbh. Gets the opposition thinking about how to counter your game plan much earlier in the week than they might have otherwise. Has it backfired on them yet?

Difficult to measure.

[OomStruisbaai]

Springboks – 15 Willie le Roux, 14 Kurt-Lee Arendse, 13 Lukhanyo Am, 12 Andre Esterhuizen, 11 Canan Moodie, 10 Manie Libbok, 9 Cobus Reinach, 8 Duane Vermeulen (c), 7 Pieter-Steph du Toit, 6 Marco van Staden, 5 Marvin Orie, 4 Jean Kleyn, 3 Frans Malherbe, 2 Bongi Mbonambi, 1 Ox Nche.
Subs: 16 Joseph Dweba, 17 Thomas du Toit, 18 Vincent Koch, 19 RG Snyman, 20 Evan Roos, 21 Deon Fourie, 22 Grant Williams, 23 Damian Willemse.

[Chilli]

That is a pretty good team.

[OomStruisbaai]

That is a pretty good team.

Yep I hope Libbok get a good game. Big test for him. I like the bench. Decent bom squad that. So Kolbey, Mapimpi, Ellende, Faf, Wiese, Kwagga,, Sous, Lood, Etsebeth, Trevor, Marx, Kitshoff will start against the All Blacks

[average joe]

No it's a Nienaber thing. Rassie use to hold it back to the last minute. Nienaber believe it's better for the players.

It’s also better for the likes of Schmidt to formulate a plan.

Why can’t they just hear it in private?

Anyway, it’s good in that it gives us something earlier on our thread …

I quite like it, tbh. Gets the opposition thinking about how to counter your game plan much earlier in the week than they might have otherwise. Has it backfired on them yet?

If you don't know how we play by now and planned for it, then you're either blind or stupid or both.

[OomStruisbaai]

It’s also better for the likes of Schmidt to formulate a plan.

Why can’t they just hear it in private?

Anyway, it’s good in that it gives us something earlier on our thread …

I quite like it, tbh. Gets the opposition thinking about how to counter your game plan much earlier in the week than they might have otherwise. Has it backfired on them yet?

If you don't know how we play by now and planned for it, then you're either blind or stupid or both.

Well I hope they dont force Libbok in that gameplan.

[average joe]

I quite like it, tbh. Gets the opposition thinking about how to counter your game plan much earlier in the week than they might have otherwise. Has it backfired on them yet?

If you don't know how we play by now and planned for it, then you're either blind or stupid or both.

Well I hope they dont force Libbok in that gameplan.

If you want to be a Springbok you have to be able to play any "gameplan"

[assfly]

That is a pretty good team.

There are some good players, but I'm not sure about whether that's a good team.

[average joe]

Springboks – 15 Willie le Roux, 14 Kurt-Lee Arendse, 13 Lukhanyo Am, 12 Andre Esterhuizen, 11 Canan Moodie, 10 Manie Libbok, 9 Cobus Reinach, 8 Duane Vermeulen (c), 7 Pieter-Steph du Toit, 6 Marco van Staden, 5 Marvin Orie, 4 Jean Kleyn, 3 Frans Malherbe, 2 Bongi Mbonambi, 1 Ox Nche.
Subs: 16 Joseph Dweba, 17 Thomas du Toit, 18 Vincent Koch, 19 RG Snyman, 20 Evan Roos, 21 Deon Fourie, 22 Grant Williams, 23 Damian Willemse.

Question is who of this lot will get to fly to NZ to join the other lot?

[Sandstorm]

That is a pretty good team.

There are some good players, but I'm not sure about whether that's a good team.

The only genuine fetcher in 2023 is on the bench. Vermeulen, Van Staden and Bongi haven't made 5 turnovers between them this season.

[Sandstorm]

Springboks – 15 Willie le Roux, 14 Kurt-Lee Arendse, 13 Lukhanyo Am, 12 Andre Esterhuizen, 11 Canan Moodie, 10 Manie Libbok, 9 Cobus Reinach, 8 Duane Vermeulen (c), 7 Pieter-Steph du Toit, 6 Marco van Staden, 5 Marvin Orie, 4 Jean Kleyn, 3 Frans Malherbe, 2 Bongi Mbonambi, 1 Ox Nche.
Subs: 16 Joseph Dweba, 17 Thomas du Toit, 18 Vincent Koch, 19 RG Snyman, 20 Evan Roos, 21 Deon Fourie, 22 Grant Williams, 23 Damian Willemse.

Question is who of this lot will get to fly to NZ to join the other lot?

Malherbe
PSDT
Libbok
Am
Willie
Willemse

[OomStruisbaai]

That is a pretty good team.

There are some good players, but I'm not sure about whether that's a good team.

The only genuine fetcher in 2023 is on the bench. Vermeulen, Van Staden and Bongi haven't made 5 turnovers between them this season.

You havent watch the Bulls play this year?

[LoveOfTheGame]

That is a pretty good team.

There are some good players, but I'm not sure about whether that's a good team.

The only genuine fetcher in 2023 is on the bench. Vermeulen, Van Staden and Bongi haven't made 5 turnovers between them this season.

Van Staden...

[Sandstorm]

There are some good players, but I'm not sure about whether that's a good team.

The only genuine fetcher in 2023 is on the bench. Vermeulen, Van Staden and Bongi haven't made 5 turnovers between them this season.

You havent watch the Bulls play this year?

Good God no!

[OomStruisbaai]

Springboks – 15 Willie le Roux, 14 Kurt-Lee Arendse, 13 Lukhanyo Am, 12 Andre Esterhuizen, 11 Canan Moodie, 10 Manie Libbok, 9 Cobus Reinach, 8 Duane Vermeulen (c), 7 Pieter-Steph du Toit, 6 Marco van Staden, 5 Marvin Orie, 4 Jean Kleyn, 3 Frans Malherbe, 2 Bongi Mbonambi, 1 Ox Nche.
Subs: 16 Joseph Dweba, 17 Thomas du Toit, 18 Vincent Koch, 19 RG Snyman, 20 Evan Roos, 21 Deon Fourie, 22 Grant Williams, 23 Damian Willemse.

Question is who of this lot will get to fly to NZ to join the other lot?

Malherbe
PSDT
Libbok
Am
Willie
Willemse

RG Snyman
Bongi

[Sandstorm]

Question is who of this lot will get to fly to NZ to join the other lot?

Malherbe
PSDT
Libbok
Am
Willie
Willemse

RG Snyman
Bongi

If they both stay fit....

[bok_viking]

That backline can cause serious damage if they get enough ball. Unfortunately I have this feeling that Libbok will be another Jantjies, look fantastic for his club most of the time, until he gets to games where there is a lot of pressure on him and his forward pack does not give him lots of front foot ball. I also worry about his accuracy off the tee in close games. I really hope Pollard is ready for the WC because he seems to be the only FH we have right now that can perform decently in pressure situations or on the back foot.

But if our forwards do have the front foot against Australia and Libbok have the space that back 3 could be very exciting to watch

[OomStruisbaai]

Ox out.

SPRINGBOK TEAM TO FACE AUSTRALIA IN PRETORIA:

15 – Willie le Roux (Toyota Verblitz) – 83 caps, 65 pts (13t)

14 – Canan Moodie (Vodacom Bulls) – 4 caps, 5 pts (1t)

13 – Lukhanyo Am (Cell C Sharks) – 31 caps, 30 pts (6t)

12 – Andre Esterhuizen (Harlequins) – 11 caps, 0 pts

11 – Kurt-Lee Arendse (Vodacom Bulls) – 7 caps, 35 pts (7t)

10 – Manie Libbok (DHL Stormers) – 3 caps, 10 pts (5c)

9 – Cobus Reinach (Montpellier) – 24 caps, 45 pts (9t)

8 – Duane Vermeulen (captain, Ulster) – 65 caps, 15 pts (3t)

7 – Pieter-Steph du Toit (Toyota Verblitz) – 66 caps, 25 pts (5t)

6 – Marco van Staden (Vodacom Bulls) – 10 caps, 0 pts

5 – Marvin Orie (DHL Stormers) – 11 caps, 0 pts

4 – Jean Kleyn (Munster) – uncapped for SA (Ireland 5 caps)

3 – Frans Malherbe (DHL Stormers) – 58 caps, 5 pts (1t)

2 – Bongi Mbonambi (Cell C Sharks) – 56 caps, 60 pts (12t)

1 – Steven Kitshoff (DHL Stormers) – 71 caps, 5pts (1t)

REPLACEMENTS:

16 – Joseph Dweba (DHL Stormers) – 4 caps, 0 pts

17 – Thomas du Toit (Cell C Sharks) – 15 caps, 0 pts

18 – Vincent Koch (Stade Francais) – 41 caps, 0 pts

19 – RG Snyman (Munster) – 23 caps, 5 pts (1t)

20 – Evan Roos (DHL Stormers) – 3 caps, 0 pts

21 – Deon Fourie (DHL Stormers) – 5 caps, 0 pts

22 – Grant Williams (Cell C Sharks) – 1 cap, 0 pts

23 – Damian Willemse (DHL Stormers) – 27 caps, 36 pts (2t, 4c, 4p, 2d)

[bok_viking]

And I can have a preview of the Bulls back 3 for next season with willie at the Bulls next season. Will be at the game on Saturday. Looking forward to it

[Sandstorm]

And I can have a preview of the Bulls back 3 for next season with willie at the Bulls next season. Will be at the game on Saturday. Looking forward to it

[Sandstorm]

Weather in Pretoria for Saturday - 21C and sunny

[average joe]

The way I see it they'll pivot of 9 with Willie injecting himself into the 10 position regularly.

[LoveOfTheGame]

Willie, willie vir die Stormers speel nie.

[average joe]

He's not a pap snoek en uitval dop kinda guy.

[average joe]

Weather in Pretoria for Saturday - 21C and sunny

If eishkom does not switch it off.

[Sandstorm]

He's not a pap snoek en uitval dop kinda guy.

Vrystaater. Hy dans met sy suster.

[Kiwias]

This does not correctly belong in this thread but there is not a dedicated thread for the match so here goes. The AB XV squad for the match v Japan this Saturday has been named. Kick-off is 5.00PM JST (8.00PM NZST).

[Gumboot]

This does not correctly belong in this thread but there is not a dedicated thread for the match so here goes. The AB XV squad for the match v Japan this Saturday has been named. Kick-off is 5.00PM JST (8.00PM NZST).

Looking forward to this game. Apart from the fact that it's not the actual All Blacks, or an actual XV, that's a pretty good side.

[average joe]

He's not a pap snoek en uitval dop kinda guy.

Vrystaater. Hy dans met sy suster.

A noble thing when to poor thing can't find a date.

[dabooldawg]

People's thoughts on kleyn straight into the starting 15?

[assfly]

People's thoughts on kleyn straight into the starting 15?

I'm not mad about the idea, but the same can be said about Orie. I don't think it's a strong second row, but I guess the coaches want to give them time to play and have surrounded them with senior players.

I'd prefer to see him come off the bench.

[Sandstorm]

People's thoughts on kleyn straight into the starting 15?

Meh. He’s average and I’m not a fan of switching allegiance.

Of course if he has a blinder I’ll say it was a brilliant plan all along.

[LoveOfTheGame]

People's thoughts on kleyn straight into the starting 15?

I'm not mad about the idea, but the same can be said about Orie. I don't think it's a strong second row, but I guess the coaches want to give them time to play and have surrounded them with senior players.

I'd prefer to see him come off the bench.

More worried about RG not getting injured once he comes on. I reckon Kleyn will be fine, obviously a big game for him. But I do agree with you, not our best lock combo at all.

[Chilli]

Australia

15 Tom Wright; 14 Suliasi Vunivalu, 13 Len Ikitau, 12 Reece Hodge, 11 Marika Koroibete; 10 Quade Cooper, 9 Nic White; 8 Rob Valetini, 7 Michael Hooper (co-captain), 6 Tom Hooper; 5 Will Skelton, 4 Nick Frost; 3 Allan Alaalatoa, 2 David Porecki, 1 James Slipper (co-captain)

Substitutes: 16 Jordan Uelese, 17 Matt Gibbon, 18 Zane Nonggorr, 19 Richie Arnold, 20 Pete Samu, 21 Tate McDermott, 22 Samu Kerevi, 23 Carter Gordon

[OomStruisbaai]

People's thoughts on kleyn straight into the starting 15?

Kleyn obvious started his career with WP/Stormers and moving to Munster under Rassie/Nienaber as coaches.

I thought van Heerden had a good chance but Kleyn / outplayed him in the URC final with Munster.

He look more like an aerial type like Orie , so not a good combination. Not sure how good the Wallabies lineout is, so maybe the reason for the selection. RG should have started but suppose he is a very good option for the bom squad. Our bench look very good and can be the difference at altitute.

[Sards]

People's thoughts on kleyn straight into the starting 15?

Kleyn obvious started his career with WP/Stormers and moving to Munster under Rassie/Nienaber as coaches.

I thought van Heerden had a good chance but Kleyn / outplayed him in the URC final with Munster.

He look more like an aerial type like Orie , so not a good combination. Not sure how good the Wallabies lineout is, so maybe the reason for the selection. RG should have started but suppose he is a very good option for the bom squad. Our bench look very good and can be the difference at altitute.

Marvin is soft as shit
Fresh shit

[JM2K6]

Is Vermeulen still up to the task of being a starting 8 for the Boks? Not really seen much of him.

[Blake]

Is Vermeulen still up to the task of being a starting 8 for the Boks? Not really seen much of him.

A bit long in the tooth now. Hugely influential as a leader and defensive coordinator on the field, but a bit of a liability in open play nowadays. Doesn't get around the park like he used to and tries to make up for it by picking a couple of key moments on the match to make an impact. Still a strong ball carrier, but also not the freight train he was 5-6 years ago.

Makes sense to take him to France as a squad player, but it's a little hard to justify his inclusion in the match day 23 for the playoff matches IMO. Running 2 squads, I guess it makes sense for him to lead the for the Aussie encounter with Roos (the heir apparent according to some) on the bench.