So, coronavirus...

Sun Oct 11, 2020 3:25 pm

JM2K6 wrote: Sun Oct 11, 2020 3:15 pm

Where are you getting your info from? "There's no reason to believe immunity exists" "the flu is a similar virus"?

Coronavirus doesn't mutate anywhere near as fast as flu does, and the mutation is of the sort that would require a different vaccine each time. And yes, you are immune to COVID for a while after catching it. It just doesn't last a particularly long time.

Lack of data is my point.

It's a new virus.

We have no idea what the reinfection rates are over 12 months because we haven't even got there yet.

Sun Oct 11, 2020 3:27 pm

Bimbowomxn wrote: Sun Oct 11, 2020 3:18 pm It might not last....

We have absolutely no idea how long it lasts ffs.

No, that's not true. We're not certain yet, but there's a lot of research being done that suggests you're immune for at least 3 months (e.g. https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101 ... 20171843v2 or https://www.npr.org/sections/health-sho ... virus-last or https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101 ... 20174490v1 ). What we don't know is the full picture, or have a good idea of what the upper boundary is yet.

"Absolutely no idea" is false. Saying "there's no reason to believe immunity exists" is false.

Sun Oct 11, 2020 3:31 pm

JM2K6 wrote: Sun Oct 11, 2020 3:27 pm
Bimbowomxn wrote: Sun Oct 11, 2020 3:18 pm It might not last....

We have absolutely no idea how long it lasts ffs.
No, that's not true. We're not certain yet, but there's a lot of research being done that suggests you're immune for at least 3 months (e.g. https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101 ... 20171843v2 or https://www.npr.org/sections/health-sho ... virus-last or https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101 ... 20174490v1 ). What we don't know is the full picture, or have a good idea of what the upper boundary is yet.

"Absolutely no idea" is false. Saying "there's no reason to believe immunity exists" is false.

We don’t know how long immunity exists ...... fact.

The big caveat is of course that this is just one snapshot for a relatively short period of time," says Dr. Otto Yang at UCLA, "so we don't know that it will continue that same rate of drop over time."

From one of your links.

Jesus.

Sun Oct 11, 2020 3:44 pm

Ah yes that's "absolutely no idea". I mean they're talking specifically about whether the observed rate of drop will hold true, but that's basically the same as "no clue whatsover, just guessing completely here with no data"

ffs

Sun Oct 11, 2020 4:00 pm

JM2K6 wrote: Sun Oct 11, 2020 3:44 pm Ah yes that's "absolutely no idea". I mean they're talking specifically about whether the observed rate of drop will hold true, but that's basically the same as "no clue whatsover, just guessing completely here with no data"

ffs

We also have no idea about the long term immunity. With this being months old.

If you’re saying there’s enough clues that they’ll be no immunity long term then we really have to rethink all covid policy.

Sun Oct 11, 2020 4:16 pm

JM2K6 wrote: Sun Oct 11, 2020 3:44 pm Ah yes that's "absolutely no idea". I mean they're talking specifically about whether the observed rate of drop will hold true, but that's basically the same as "no clue whatsover, just guessing completely here with no data"

ffs

Why bother arguing with 'flat earthers' like Bimbot.

Sun Oct 11, 2020 5:02 pm

Survival rates of SARS-CoV-2 were determined at different temperatures and D-values, Z-values and half-life were calculated. We obtained half lives of between 1.7 and 2.7 days at 20 °C, reducing to a few hours when temperature was elevated to 40 °C. With initial viral loads broadly equivalent to the highest titres excreted by infectious patients, viable virus was isolated for up to 28 days at 20 °C from common surfaces such as glass, stainless steel and both paper and polymer banknotes. Conversely, infectious virus survived less than 24 h at 40 °C on some surfaces.

Conclusion
These findings demonstrate SARS-CoV-2 can remain infectious for significantly longer time periods than generally considered possible. These results could be used to inform improved risk mitigation procedures to prevent the fomite spread of COVID-19.

https://virologyj.biomedcentral.com/art ... 20-01418-7

Sun Oct 11, 2020 5:13 pm

Bimbowomxn wrote: Sun Oct 11, 2020 4:00 pm
JM2K6 wrote: Sun Oct 11, 2020 3:44 pm Ah yes that's "absolutely no idea". I mean they're talking specifically about whether the observed rate of drop will hold true, but that's basically the same as "no clue whatsover, just guessing completely here with no data"

ffs

We also have no idea about the long term immunity. With this being months old.

If you’re saying there’s enough clues that they’ll be no immunity long term then we really have to rethink all covid policy.

You really need to stop saying things like "no idea". It's patently untrue. We have some idea.

No covid policy is operating under the assumption that long term immunity of guaranteed.

Sun Oct 11, 2020 5:20 pm

JM2K6 wrote: Sun Oct 11, 2020 5:13 pm
Bimbowomxn wrote: Sun Oct 11, 2020 4:00 pm
JM2K6 wrote: Sun Oct 11, 2020 3:44 pm Ah yes that's "absolutely no idea". I mean they're talking specifically about whether the observed rate of drop will hold true, but that's basically the same as "no clue whatsover, just guessing completely here with no data"

ffs

We also have no idea about the long term immunity. With this being months old.

If you’re saying there’s enough clues that they’ll be no immunity long term then we really have to rethink all covid policy.
You really need to stop saying things like "no idea". It's patently untrue. We have some idea.

No covid policy is operating under the assumption that long term immunity of guaranteed.

The one where we “wait” for a successful vaccine does.

And yes you’re correct , we have lots of ideas about the virus. Nothing that has been proven. And anyone saying they know what will happen over 2 years needs locking up,

Sun Oct 11, 2020 5:55 pm

Bimbowomxn wrote: Sun Oct 11, 2020 5:20 pm
JM2K6 wrote: Sun Oct 11, 2020 5:13 pm
Bimbowomxn wrote: Sun Oct 11, 2020 4:00 pm

We also have no idea about the long term immunity. With this being months old.

If you’re saying there’s enough clues that they’ll be no immunity long term then we really have to rethink all covid policy.
You really need to stop saying things like "no idea". It's patently untrue. We have some idea.

No covid policy is operating under the assumption that long term immunity of guaranteed.

The one where we “wait” for a successful vaccine does.

Jesus Christ we literally explained this to you recently. The natural immunity fading is not a deal breaker when it comes to vaccines.

And yes you’re correct , we have lots of ideas about the virus. Nothing that has been proven. And anyone saying they know what will happen over 2 years needs locking up,

And the goalposts shift again...

Sun Oct 11, 2020 6:05 pm

JM2K6 wrote: Sun Oct 11, 2020 5:55 pm
Bimbowomxn wrote: Sun Oct 11, 2020 5:20 pm
JM2K6 wrote: Sun Oct 11, 2020 5:13 pm
You really need to stop saying things like "no idea". It's patently untrue. We have some idea.

No covid policy is operating under the assumption that long term immunity of guaranteed.

The one where we “wait” for a successful vaccine does.
Jesus Christ we literally explained this to you recently. The natural immunity fading is not a deal breaker when it comes to vaccines.

And yes you’re correct , we have lots of ideas about the virus. Nothing that has been proven. And anyone saying they know what will happen over 2 years needs locking up,
And the goalposts shift again...

No goal post shift just an observation regarding your certainty about current science and it’s quite obvious issue.

And yes you gave a theory about vaccination and fading immunity. There’s as many regarding T cell immunity and lasting memory from that. (Especially with corona virus’s).

The point is for all your apparent confidence you and no one else knows yet. What is becoming apparent though is the virus isn’t dangerous to vast swathes of the population who at some point will rightly ignore the stupidity of the current regulations.

I’ll have a wager regarding he vaccine though if you want. Plus or minus April next year.

Sun Oct 11, 2020 6:08 pm

Oh and while you’re there , you told me this couldn’t happen either.

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/cont ... -s0d85mkrr

Sun Oct 11, 2020 6:35 pm

Scousers.

Sun Oct 11, 2020 7:05 pm

Bimbowomxn wrote: Wed Oct 07, 2020 8:44 am
1. There's no proof herd immunity is achievable,as immune repo se seems to decrease quickly. So you're experimenting on the general population at the expense of thousands of deaths and many more long covid cases
Well that’s the idea of vaccination out the window.

WOW?

No Vaccination will actually protect everyone who ahs the vaccine. The Herd immunity is due to the transismission not being able to transfer person to person if enough immune people are in the population to block the spread. The vaccination priority will be vaccine all vulnerable and elderly people and that will stop the more negative outcomes of COVID-19 occurring like higher death rates.

Sun Oct 11, 2020 7:19 pm

eldanielfire wrote: Sun Oct 11, 2020 7:05 pm
Bimbowomxn wrote: Wed Oct 07, 2020 8:44 am
1. There's no proof herd immunity is achievable,as immune repo se seems to decrease quickly. So you're experimenting on the general population at the expense of thousands of deaths and many more long covid cases
Well that’s the idea of vaccination out the window.
WOW?

No Vaccination will actually protect everyone who ahs the vaccine. The Herd immunity is due to the transismission not being able to transfer person to person if enough immune people are in the population to block the spread. The vaccination priority will be vaccine all vulnerable and elderly people and that will stop the more negative outcomes of COVID-19 occurring like higher death rates.

I made no “everyone” point or claims.

If there’s no immunity from being infected how will a vaccine protect the vulnerable and elderly?

Sun Oct 11, 2020 7:43 pm

Regeneron sounds promising.

Abortions saving lives!

...and being commercialised a little bit.

Sun Oct 11, 2020 9:41 pm

Bimbowomxn wrote: Sun Oct 11, 2020 6:05 pmNo goal post shift just an observation regarding your certainty about current science and it’s quite obvious issue.

It's incredibly dishonest of you to talk about certainty about current science. The only person stating anything with 100% certainty is you - when you claimed we have "absolutely no idea how long it lasts". I point to the science saying we have some idea with some uncertainty on some details. You are incapable of arguing in good faith.

And yes you gave a theory about vaccination and fading immunity. There’s as many regarding T cell immunity and lasting memory from that. (Especially with corona virus’s).

This is gibberish. Vaccines have been around for a very long time. Boosters have also been around for a very long time. I didn't give you theory - I gave you the truth.

The point is for all your apparent confidence you and no one else knows yet. What is becoming apparent though is the virus isn’t dangerous to vast swathes of the population who at some point will rightly ignore the stupidity of the current regulations.

I’ll have a wager regarding he vaccine though if you want. Plus or minus April next year.

At no point have I made any statements or even talked about when a vaccine will be available, so why the fuck would I bet on it?

I swear you read only what you want to.

Bimbowomxn wrote: Sun Oct 11, 2020 6:08 pm Oh and while you’re there , you told me this couldn’t happen either.

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/cont ... -s0d85mkrr

Jesus Christ the self-owns keep coming. No, Bimbo, I didn't tell you that it couldn't happen. I did actually agree that where possible any company or government would try and harvest data. What I did say was that the new open source Track & Trace app couldn't be used for that - guess what, that article isn't about that app, and is instead about apps being used by pubs and restaurants to harvest contact details at the government's request.

fucking hell, why are you such hard work. It is literally impossible to have a disagreement with you that stays on topic, that involves you following and understanding a logical thread, and that doesn't see wild shifting of the goalposts because you're desperate to score some sort of point. I give up. Honestly, I don't understand how you don't look at every single interaction you have online and wonder where you're going wrong all the time.

Sun Oct 11, 2020 11:09 pm

why, oh why do posters engage with the bimbot cunt, & expect him to be anything other than which he has always been ?

just ignore the shitstain, & save the rest of us his offal !

Mon Oct 12, 2020 4:44 am

fishfoodie wrote: Sun Oct 11, 2020 11:09 pm why, oh why do posters engage with the bimbot cunt, & expect him to be anything other than which he has always been ?

just ignore the shitstain, & save the rest of us his offal !

It appears that quite a few posters genuinely enjoy engaging with bimboman.

Mon Oct 12, 2020 5:03 am

https://www.gov.uk/government/publicati ... al-summary

Published 29 April 2020
Last updated 7 October 2020 — see all updates
From:
Public Health England

They've just stopped trying again. Any time the figures start looking bad the reporting goes AWOL.

Mon Oct 12, 2020 7:28 am

It's incredibly dishonest of you to talk about certainty about current science. The only person stating anything with 100% certainty is you - when you claimed we have "absolutely no idea how long it lasts". I point to the science saying we have some idea with some uncertainty on some details. You are incapable of arguing in good faith.

You call me dishonest regarding certainty’s, when that certainty I keep displaying is “we don’t know “ yet.

That with covid is the truth . It’s a new virus. Going on about the two year and all that is clearly nonsense.

I’m stating that in good faith. And have done from the start.

At no point have I made any statements or even talked about when a vaccine will be available, so why the fuck would I bet on it? I swear you read only what you want to.

If there’s no immunity from infection then a vaccine is almost impossible.

I at no point said you made a statement about vaccine ....

I just related it to the direct point about there being no immunity from infection. We’ve now had posters leaps around “boosters” etc without accepting it makes the production and even more importantly the testing of a vaccine much much more difficult and a much longer process.

Jesus Christ the self-owns keep coming. No, Bimbo, I didn't tell you that it couldn't happen. I did actually agree that where possible any company or government would try and harvest data. What I did say was that the new open source Track & Trace app couldn't be used for that - guess what, that article isn't about that app, and is instead about apps being used by pubs and restaurants to harvest contact details at the government's request.

The scanning is from the venue to the test and trace app. That’s the point of the article.

Honestly, I don't understand how you don't look at every single interaction you have online and wonder where you're going wrong all the time.

Because I’m quite comfortable that I posted nothing controversial in any way.

If there’s no long term immunity from an actual infection then it’s much more unlikely that any vaccine will offer any protection. Argue all you like against that but it’s just a fact.

Mon Oct 12, 2020 7:43 am

This is gibberish. Vaccines have been around for a very long time. Boosters have also been around for a very long time. I didn't give you theory - I gave you the truth.

What vaccine do we have with a 3 month booster for life?

What vaccine has been around a long time for a corona virus.?

My post wasn’t gibberish it was either deliberate or other wise misinterpreted.

“I gave you truth “ —— not in relation to 2 years immunity you didn’t.

Mon Oct 12, 2020 7:47 am

fishfoodie wrote: Sun Oct 11, 2020 11:09 pm why, oh why do posters engage with the bimbot cunt, & expect him to be anything other than which he has always been ?

just ignore the shitstain, & save the rest of us his offal !

The ignore function when used appropriately definitely improves the ratio of worthwhile content on this board.

Mon Oct 12, 2020 9:40 am

robmatic wrote: Mon Oct 12, 2020 7:47 am
fishfoodie wrote: Sun Oct 11, 2020 11:09 pm why, oh why do posters engage with the bimbot cunt, & expect him to be anything other than which he has always been ?

just ignore the shitstain, & save the rest of us his offal !
The ignore function when used appropriately definitely improves the ratio of worthwhile content on this board.

Yeah, it stops you getting drawn into his deliberate and dishonest ignorance.

Mon Oct 12, 2020 9:45 am

Biffer wrote: Sat Oct 10, 2020 9:20 pm
Slick wrote: Sat Oct 10, 2020 8:32 pm
Bimbowomxn wrote: Sat Oct 10, 2020 5:55 pm

I’m fairly certain there’s not a human alive who knows what happens to immunity in TWO years.

Except Biffer here.
Did you miss the “if”?
He thinks he's being smart because I don't see his answers.

Precisely.

If everyone has him on ignore, then he's free to talk bullshit without contradiction.

And if nobody expresses disagreement, it signifies endorsement and agreement with what he says.

Mon Oct 12, 2020 10:34 am

Christ the last lockdown took a terrible toll on my parents, I mean I am a seriously funny guy and great company an all, genuinely awesome, but my mum hasn't seen her friends or her other sons in 8 or 9 months.
Just my dad and me visiting.
Even I would kill myself.

What an absolute shitshow of a government.
Where are all the mass resignations for their abject failures?

I resigned once because I was four days late on a database.

Mon Oct 12, 2020 10:42 am

Line6 HXFX wrote: Mon Oct 12, 2020 10:34 am Christ the last lockdown took a terrible toll on my parents, I mean I am a seriously funny guy and great company an all, genuinely awesome, but my mum hasn't seen her friends or her other sons in 8 or 9 months.
Just my dad and me visiting.
Even I would kill myself.

What an absolute shitshow of a government.
Where are all the mass resignations for their abject failures?

I resigned once because I was four days late on a database.

Your mother has followed the GLOBAL guidelines of all CIVILISED nations and stayed away from her family & friends unless absolutely necessary. Which is Wales sounds like she's a bloody hero.

Mon Oct 12, 2020 10:47 am

Bimbowomxn wrote: Sun Oct 11, 2020 7:19 pm
eldanielfire wrote: Sun Oct 11, 2020 7:05 pm
Bimbowomxn wrote: Wed Oct 07, 2020 8:44 am

Well that’s the idea of vaccination out the window.
WOW?

No Vaccination will actually protect everyone who ahs the vaccine. The Herd immunity is due to the transismission not being able to transfer person to person if enough immune people are in the population to block the spread. The vaccination priority will be vaccine all vulnerable and elderly people and that will stop the more negative outcomes of COVID-19 occurring like higher death rates.
I made no “everyone” point or claims.

If there’s no immunity from being infected how will a vaccine protect the vulnerable and elderly?

By the vulnerable and elderly being vaccinated and therefore being immune for COVID-19. You surely aren't this dumb?

Mon Oct 12, 2020 10:50 am

By the vulnerable and elderly being vaccinated and therefore being immune for COVID-19. You surely aren't this dumb?

I’ll try again, if there’s no immunity gained from being infected , why will a vaccine become more efficient than the virus at immunity ?

Mon Oct 12, 2020 12:19 pm

eldanielfire wrote: Mon Oct 12, 2020 10:47 am
Bimbowomxn wrote: Sun Oct 11, 2020 7:19 pm
eldanielfire wrote: Sun Oct 11, 2020 7:05 pm

WOW?

No Vaccination will actually protect everyone who ahs the vaccine. The Herd immunity is due to the transismission not being able to transfer person to person if enough immune people are in the population to block the spread. The vaccination priority will be vaccine all vulnerable and elderly people and that will stop the more negative outcomes of COVID-19 occurring like higher death rates.
I made no “everyone” point or claims.

If there’s no immunity from being infected how will a vaccine protect the vulnerable and elderly?
By the vulnerable and elderly being vaccinated and therefore being immune for COVID-19. You surely aren't this dumb?

https://www.scientificamerican.com/arti ... -vaccines/

There's no simple answer - but vaccines can be designed to be more effective than immunity from infection.

Mon Oct 12, 2020 12:45 pm

There's no simple answer - but vaccines can be designed to be more effective than immunity from infection.

Quickly ? And for a new virus?

I’ve only had time to skim read it, there’s lots of “possibilities “ it seems. Does it give any clear examples of a vaccine that works on this type of virus that is more effective than actual infection ?

Mon Oct 12, 2020 1:40 pm

Bimbowomxn wrote: Mon Oct 12, 2020 12:45 pm
I’ve only had time to skim read it