President Trump and US politics catchall

[Yeeb]

The Whitehouse stating, "Trust in President Trump."

That was the tagline from 1980’s spoof US cop show “Sledgehammer”

“Trust me, I know what I’m doing”
BOOOM everyone dies

[Guy Smiley]

Media scaremongering as usual, ‘ftse plunges as Starmer says tariffs will hurt Britain ‘ cries the telegraph

FTSE now down 1.35%, at the lower end of a normal days negative movement . Five percent drop would be a plunge , most stuff has already long been priced in as usual.

Dax down 1.7, cac 2.1, fx rate movements seem under 2 % as well, ho hum

uh huh

[laurent]

They put a tariff on the British Indian Ocean Territory.

The only thing there is a US / UK military base.

They put some on French Guyana and Reunion ...

Oh and they have added tariff to Heard and McDonald islands which are empty (except if you count penguins and elephant seals).
The representative for la Réunion simply stated Trump was an ignorant...

https://www.lematin.ch/story/guerre-com ... -103317113

[Yeeb]

Media scaremongering as usual, ‘ftse plunges as Starmer says tariffs will hurt Britain ‘ cries the telegraph

FTSE now down 1.35%, at the lower end of a normal days negative movement . Five percent drop would be a plunge , most stuff has already long been priced in as usual.

Dax down 1.7, cac 2.1, fx rate movements seem under 2 % as well, ho hum

uh huh

Closed 1.55 down

[Guy Smiley]

Media scaremongering as usual, ‘ftse plunges as Starmer says tariffs will hurt Britain ‘ cries the telegraph

FTSE now down 1.35%, at the lower end of a normal days negative movement . Five percent drop would be a plunge , most stuff has already long been priced in as usual.

Dax down 1.7, cac 2.1, fx rate movements seem under 2 % as well, ho hum

uh huh

Closed 1.55 down

It's not opening well.

https://www.cnbc.com/2025/04/02/stock-m ... riffs.html

[dpedin]

The only thing certain about yesterday's announcements is that Trump and his bunch of brownshirts will change all these tariffs in the short - medium term. These are just the starting point for Trump to try and bully and leverage 'deals' with the rest of the world. They know this will screw their economy if anything other than a short term tactic and are counting on the fact that most of the world will fold pretty quickly and come to them with their tails between their legs offering presents. However if the likes of Canada, the EU and China decide to play hardball then the US is screwed and Trump will have to look for a way out asap.

The problem Trump is facing is like the Brexit consequences. The frog eyed dimwit Brexiteers said Brexit would hit the German car makers and the French cheese makers just as hard as it hit us but they forgot that the UK would be hit by the full force of Brexit and its relationship with every EU member whereas the EU share of Brexit impact was only damaging a small % of their business ie the trade with the UK. Most EU member states and businesses managed the impact well whereas the UK has had a 4% hit to its GDP. Trumps tariffs are the same: imports into US from every country will be hit and increase in cost to consumers whereas for the rest of the world the US tariff impact, whilst damaging, will only hit a % of their exports. The UKs exports to the US are about 17% of all our exports, only c30% of what we export to the EU for example and whilst it will hit some specific industries hard like car manufacturing, whisky, etc the impact for many others is minimal. If Canada, EU, China etc retaliate and play hard ball then the US will be hit the hardest and Trump will either fold or else commit political suicide!

The longer term issue for the US ie the next 3-4 years is who the hell will develop and invest in a business model reliant on the US market? Confidence in the US was built over decades and has been lost in 100 days. They are now the pariah of world trade and are in danger of becoming isolated completely as countries and businesses invest in models less reliant on the US. I fear for the US even more than before ... the US is lost!

Bit disingenuous linking US tariffs on everyone , with Brexit to fit your agenda. The Brexit related tariffs / end of exemptions , could have been not applied had EU wanted to not retaliate (and in any case mostly the status quo has remained thus far) and uk retaliate to the retaliation… tit for tat rarely works.

However I agree with you 100% that this is merely a start for Trump and it’s his way of bullying deal making. Be interesting to see how this pans out & for us, what Starmer does (probs best if he continues to do fuck all really and let other countries fight the US)

I don't think it is disingenuous at all to use the Brexit example! I was using the Brexit issue as an example of the idiocy of the argument from Trump et al that tariffs impact everyone equally. All goods going into the US from every country in the world, apart from Russia it seems, will have tariffs applied on them and the totality of this will impact hugely on the US economy. It. will drive up prices for consumers. The impact on every other country will be proportional to the amount of trade they have with the US and probably only in specific sectors/industries. Exactly the same issue applied to Brexit - all our goods coming from every EU country were impacted by Brexit whereas for EU countries it was only whatever proportion of exports they sent to the UK, which for some wasn't very much. Both are excellent examples of economic self harm being sold by dodgy politicians to the economic illiterate!

[laurent]

https://mastodon.top/@nbs@noauthority.s ... 7952774281

[Yeeb]

The only thing certain about yesterday's announcements is that Trump and his bunch of brownshirts will change all these tariffs in the short - medium term. These are just the starting point for Trump to try and bully and leverage 'deals' with the rest of the world. They know this will screw their economy if anything other than a short term tactic and are counting on the fact that most of the world will fold pretty quickly and come to them with their tails between their legs offering presents. However if the likes of Canada, the EU and China decide to play hardball then the US is screwed and Trump will have to look for a way out asap.

The problem Trump is facing is like the Brexit consequences. The frog eyed dimwit Brexiteers said Brexit would hit the German car makers and the French cheese makers just as hard as it hit us but they forgot that the UK would be hit by the full force of Brexit and its relationship with every EU member whereas the EU share of Brexit impact was only damaging a small % of their business ie the trade with the UK. Most EU member states and businesses managed the impact well whereas the UK has had a 4% hit to its GDP. Trumps tariffs are the same: imports into US from every country will be hit and increase in cost to consumers whereas for the rest of the world the US tariff impact, whilst damaging, will only hit a % of their exports. The UKs exports to the US are about 17% of all our exports, only c30% of what we export to the EU for example and whilst it will hit some specific industries hard like car manufacturing, whisky, etc the impact for many others is minimal. If Canada, EU, China etc retaliate and play hard ball then the US will be hit the hardest and Trump will either fold or else commit political suicide!

The longer term issue for the US ie the next 3-4 years is who the hell will develop and invest in a business model reliant on the US market? Confidence in the US was built over decades and has been lost in 100 days. They are now the pariah of world trade and are in danger of becoming isolated completely as countries and businesses invest in models less reliant on the US. I fear for the US even more than before ... the US is lost!

Bit disingenuous linking US tariffs on everyone , with Brexit to fit your agenda. The Brexit related tariffs / end of exemptions , could have been not applied had EU wanted to not retaliate (and in any case mostly the status quo has remained thus far) and uk retaliate to the retaliation… tit for tat rarely works.

However I agree with you 100% that this is merely a start for Trump and it’s his way of bullying deal making. Be interesting to see how this pans out & for us, what Starmer does (probs best if he continues to do fuck all really and let other countries fight the US)

I don't think it is disingenuous at all to use the Brexit example! I was using the Brexit issue as an example of the idiocy of the argument from Trump et al that tariffs impact everyone equally. All goods going into the US from every country in the world, apart from Russia it seems, will have tariffs applied on them and the totality of this will impact hugely on the US economy. It. will drive up prices for consumers. The impact on every other country will be proportional to the amount of trade they have with the US and probably only in specific sectors/industries. Exactly the same issue applied to Brexit - all our goods coming from every EU country were impacted by Brexit whereas for EU countries it was only whatever proportion of exports they sent to the UK, which for some wasn't very much. Both are excellent examples of economic self harm being sold by dodgy politicians to the economic illiterate!

I can see you don’t think it’s dis ingenious :

Us acts versus almost the entire planet, Uk acts versus the Eu (I’m not saying it wasn’t major, but it wasn’t the picking fight with entire planet Trump has)

Us is the instigator of tariffs , Brexit was the scorned party invoking tariffs which it could had it wished not wish to re-employ. But it was feeling some retaliation was needed, Trump has seen this and used a similar thought process only turned the dial up to 11

Uk could have moved some of its economic ties and trade elsewhere , as has happened to an extent with several agreements that certain people swore were going to be impossible to get agreed. US taking on the whole world, doesn’t really leave anywhere else for demand and supply to move elsewhere.

So fairly different really.

The economic self harm mis-sold now that I can agree with, however for the larger section of referendum voters (myself included) it was a price deemed worth paying for political and immagratory reasons (not the sides of buses or bendy bananas).
It should also be noted there were also economic lies told by team remain as well.

[Yeeb]

uh huh

Closed 1.55 down

It's not opening well.

https://www.cnbc.com/2025/04/02/stock-m ... riffs.html

Next big fall will be reaction to the reaction, so need to see if any tit for tat happens. Being lower hit than say our nearest neighbours , and being more service based that has escaped more (for now), uk could gain a bit of comparative advantage here purely by fluke.

[Hal Jordan]

Good Lord, just had it pointed out to me that Myanmar has been hit with 44% tariffs. Cruelty is the point.

[fishfoodie]

Good Lord, just had it pointed out to me that Myanmar has been hit with 44% tariffs. Cruelty is the point.

Sri Lankan is still in the middle of a financial crisis, & they're being hit with massive, unsustainable tariffs too.

There's no sense to most of it; it's just performative cruelty.

Does he expect the poorest 80% of the planet to suddenly start earning enough to buy Tesla's & Bourbon, when they can't even afford food ?

[lemonhead]

Good Lord, just had it pointed out to me that Myanmar has been hit with 44% tariffs. Cruelty is the point.

Sri Lankan is still in the middle of a financial crisis, & they're being hit with massive, unsustainable tariffs too.

There's no sense to most of it; it's just performative cruelty.

Does he expect the poorest 80% of the planet to suddenly start earning enough to buy Tesla's & Bourbon, when they can't even afford food ?

Maybe he just likes all the nonstop attention.

Glad Vexler finally explained a bit of the Cluster B shithousery going on. Everyone else seems to think there's some masterplan at play, if only we could decode the damn thing.

[fishfoodie]

Well clothes are going to get a lot more expensive in the US; Bangladesh, Vietnam, Sri Lanka & Cambodia all hit with massive tariffs

Real proof that the trump admin recognises but doesn't understand the problem. US has trade deficits because they don't make things anymore. The solution isn't getting low paid sweatshop jobs back. It's moving up the value chain to make stuff that other people want and it's valuable but that would require foresight, vision, commitment and planning.

That would also require American companies to start paying American workers what their worth, & that isn't something any of them want to do !

Just witness the herd of tech bros led by Space Karen who ran to the Oval Office to plead to no changes to H1B indentured slavery scheme that has propped up the tech sector for decades now.

The decline of US Manufacturing all started with Reagan breaking the ATC Union, & from that thru NAFTA the Unions became utterly useless, & ever more corrupt; just look at the cocksuckers in charge of the AWU & the Teamsters supporting the guy who preferred to bribe the Union Leaders & his tech bro allies who fight tooth & nail against Unions in their businesses !

[Hal Jordan]

People have to stop trying to engage with this nonsense as though it's supposed to make rational sense. It's just an obsession for a mentally unravelling old man, who has spent his entire business life being the dumbest man in the room, but scraping by by being the one who is the most malevolent, unscrupulous and unbound by external reality, or even his own medium to long term interests.

it's just that any policy goal you might try and impose on this chaos then immediately leads you to think of the five different things they could have done to achieve that end that might have worked, and wouldn't burn the world down.

And I don't think that Trump came up with this. Some freakish crank in his circle has had this pet theory and he's just run with it. It's the economic version of drinking cattle dewormer.

[Sandstorm]

People have to stop trying to engage with this nonsense as though it's supposed to make rational sense. It's just an obsession for a mentally unravelling old man, who has spent his entire business life being the dumbest man in the room, but scraping by by being the one who is the most malevolent, unscrupulous and unbound by external reality, or even his own medium to long term interests.

it's just that any policy goal you might try and impose on this chaos then immediately leads you to think of the five different things they could have done to achieve that end that might have worked, and wouldn't burn the world down.

And I don't think that Trump came up with this. Some freakish crank in his circle has had this pet theory and he's just run with it. It's the economic version of drinking cattle dewormer.

I know it’s career suicide to be the journalist in the White House Pressroom who asks this question, but someone has to do it:

“Mr President, you’re clearly too stupid to come up with these tariffs on your own. Which one of your psychotic minions in the back office gave you today’s announcement that will make the world a little more awful?”

[Enzedder]

I would just ask "Is this the economic equivalent of injecting bleach?"

[Slick]

People have to stop trying to engage with this nonsense as though it's supposed to make rational sense. It's just an obsession for a mentally unravelling old man, who has spent his entire business life being the dumbest man in the room, but scraping by by being the one who is the most malevolent, unscrupulous and unbound by external reality, or even his own medium to long term interests.

it's just that any policy goal you might try and impose on this chaos then immediately leads you to think of the five different things they could have done to achieve that end that might have worked, and wouldn't burn the world down.

And I don't think that Trump came up with this. Some freakish crank in his circle has had this pet theory and he's just run with it. It's the economic version of drinking cattle dewormer.

There is quite a bit of reporting today saying it is something he has been espousing for decades

[TB63]

https://www.instagram.com/stories/theda ... k2cmszYjB0

[Flockwitt]

Well clothes are going to get a lot more expensive in the US; Bangladesh, Vietnam, Sri Lanka & Cambodia all hit with massive tariffs

Real proof that the trump admin recognises but doesn't understand the problem. US has trade deficits because they don't make things anymore. The solution isn't getting low paid sweatshop jobs back. It's moving up the value chain to make stuff that other people want and it's valuable but that would require foresight, vision, commitment and planning.

That would also require American companies to start paying American workers what their worth, & that isn't something any of them want to do !

Just witness the herd of tech bros led by Space Karen who ran to the Oval Office to plead to no changes to H1B indentured slavery scheme that has propped up the tech sector for decades now.

The decline of US Manufacturing all started with Reagan breaking the ATC Union, & from that thru NAFTA the Unions became utterly useless, & ever more corrupt; just look at the cocksuckers in charge of the AWU & the Teamsters supporting the guy who preferred to bribe the Union Leaders & his tech bro allies who fight tooth & nail against Unions in their businesses !

It's a bit more complex and longer running even than that, but the bottom line is, you know, 6 months ago the US had full employment, and more new factories going in than anytime in 50 years. The US doesn't have the workforce or the supply chain to bring the offshore manufacturing back. And why should you? Globalisation actually works. Actually I take that back, the US might have had the workforce but those pesky illegal aliens are all sent back to where they belong. So there!

[Niegs]

Or would Americans pay what it costs American companies to make stuff they'd get cheaper from Asia? This is where I think most people don't give a fudge... happy to buy cheap tat and have it delivered to them by people struggling to get by.

The Climate Town podcast did a look at the environmental costs of fast fashion and free returns to Amazon. Looked into doing merch that was plastic free (I thought completely American, but I see it's only part - produced in Canada, using bamboo I assume comes from Asia, hemp presumably from NA, and embroidered in Oregon)... resulting in a baseball cap that costs $48 USD. https://merch.climatetownproductions.co ... -hat-black

[Guy Smiley]

[Niegs]

Hope The Bern outlives Trump by a lot...

[lemonhead]

In some cases involving Norfolk Island, which is 1,600km north-east of Sydney and has a population of 2,188, the confusion appears to have resulted from the fact that the company’s address or port of departure is Norfolk, UK, or the destination is Norfolk, Virginia in the US, or a company’s registered address in New Hampshire (NH) has been listed instead as Norfolk Island (NI).

Norfolk Island was this week hit with a 29% tariff on its goods – 19 percentage points higher than the rest of Australia – despite claiming to have no export relationship with the US.

The decision has perplexed the Australian government, with Australia’s prime minister saying it was evidence “nowhere was safe” from Trump’s tariffs. The country’s trade minister, Don Farrell, said it was “clearly a mistake”.

George Plant, the administrator of Norfolk Island, told the Guardian on Thursday: “There are no known exports from Norfolk Island to the United States.”

But according to US government data, presented by the Observatory of Economic Complexity, Norfolk Island exported US$655,000 (A$1.04m) worth of goods to the US in 2023, with its main export being US$413,000 (A$658,000) worth of leather footwear.

There is one large shoe shop on Norfolk Island, Franks Shoes. Its manager said in an email to the Guardian: “We are a shoe shop selling shoes to the tourists that visit the island and do not export shoes to the US or have any business with the US.”

The Guardian has identified two bills of lading – records of cargo shipments – for shipments each containing 3,714 black Timberland men’s ankle boots that set sail from South Riding port in the Bahamas for Miami, Florida, in December 2023. The shipments were worth a combined total of US$315,000 (A$498,000).

The bills of lading list “Norfolk Island” as the country of origin and the address of the shipper as Timberland, 200 Domain Drive, Stratham 03885-2575, Norfolk Island.

Timberland’s corporate office address is listed as 200 Domain Drive, Stratham, New Hampshire on its LinkedIn page

Finding it hard to even laugh at this shit anymore.

What damage will this bunch of tossers wreak, and for nothing.

[Enzedder]

Yeah, its a mistake which will cost Norfolk Island ... nothing

[Kiwias]

Finding it hard to even laugh at this shit anymore.

What damage will this bunch of tossers wreak, and for nothing.

Many of those who voted for him still cling to the idiotic notion that Kamala as president would have been a disaster for the country.

[lemonhead]

Yeah, its a mistake which will cost Norfolk Island ... nothing

Oh, for sure they're able to stick it in the daily schmaz section of the Norfolk Happenings, alongside record Araucaria growth stats.

I mean, this fkin shower in charge of far bigger shit. With real world consequences for so many of us.

[Yeeb]

Real proof that the trump admin recognises but doesn't understand the problem. US has trade deficits because they don't make things anymore. The solution isn't getting low paid sweatshop jobs back. It's moving up the value chain to make stuff that other people want and it's valuable but that would require foresight, vision, commitment and planning.

That would also require American companies to start paying American workers what their worth, & that isn't something any of them want to do !

Just witness the herd of tech bros led by Space Karen who ran to the Oval Office to plead to no changes to H1B indentured slavery scheme that has propped up the tech sector for decades now.

The decline of US Manufacturing all started with Reagan breaking the ATC Union, & from that thru NAFTA the Unions became utterly useless, & ever more corrupt; just look at the cocksuckers in charge of the AWU & the Teamsters supporting the guy who preferred to bribe the Union Leaders & his tech bro allies who fight tooth & nail against Unions in their businesses !

It's a bit more complex and longer running even than that, but the bottom line is, you know, 6 months ago the US had full employment, and more new factories going in than anytime in 50 years. The US doesn't have the workforce or the supply chain to bring the offshore manufacturing back. And why should you? Globalisation actually works. Actually I take that back, the US might have had the workforce but those pesky illegal aliens are all sent back to where they belong. So there!

Globalisation works you say ? Didn’t seem that way when Covid happened and Germany blocked any other European country getting masks, including about 7m units of our own lovely PPE from our factory in E Europe someplace to our EMEA hub in venlo, Netherlands.

Or during Ukraine war when everyone realises their own munitions comes from the US and taps have now been turned off & question marks raised about quality of future arms from there

Or when that ship blocked suez and container charges soared worldwide


Very valid economic argument that countries of a certain size and wealth, could and should have certain domestic capabilities and key industries and not have to rely on cheap inports. This especially includes food and power. The bamboo baseball cap example from the previous post, probably wouldn’t be included.

[Sandstorm]

Globalisation works you say ? Didn’t seem that way when Covid happened and Germany blocked any other European country getting masks, including about 7m units of our own lovely PPE from our factory in E Europe someplace to our EMEA hub in venlo, Netherlands.

Or during Ukraine war when everyone realises their own munitions comes from the US and taps have now been turned off & question marks raised about quality of future arms from there

Or when that ship blocked suez and container charges soared worldwide

So 3 examples in about 75 years during conflict/pandemic when it doesn't work? Putz.

[Yeeb]

Globalisation works you say ? Didn’t seem that way when Covid happened and Germany blocked any other European country getting masks, including about 7m units of our own lovely PPE from our factory in E Europe someplace to our EMEA hub in venlo, Netherlands.

Or during Ukraine war when everyone realises their own munitions comes from the US and taps have now been turned off & question marks raised about quality of future arms from there

Or when that ship blocked suez and container charges soared worldwide

So 3 examples in about 75 years during conflict/pandemic when it doesn't work? Putz.

Don’t be a dick, plenty of more examples if you want:
Mining communities destroyed because it’s cheaper to buy from abroad
That co2 shortage a few years back that disrupted food and drinks and pubs across the world
Us rust belt
Aral Sea & how global cotton market somewhat altered it
Kobe earthquake & bearings bank
Credit crunch, CDO’s etc

[Rhubarb & Custard]

whether one likes globalisation or not it's a reality, if you want to step back from it there are some things you'd need to do away with, modern shipping, flying, the internet. if you're not willing to give up those things then why take on the Sisyphean task of raging against globalisation rather than trying to swim with the tide and even harness some of its offerings? even if Trump's plan works, and it's a big if, all he'll achieve is a less productive and over time less relevant USA. unless he seeks another means of maintaining primacy which would be destroying economies elsewhere faster than he can hurt his own

[Yeeb]

whether one likes globalisation or not it's a reality, if you want to step back from it there are some things you'd need to do away with, modern shipping, flying, the internet. if you're not willing to give up those things then why take on the Sisyphean task of raging against globalisation rather than trying to swim with the tide and even harness some of its offerings? even if Trump's plan works, and it's a big if, all he'll achieve is a less productive and over time less relevant USA. unless he seeks another means of maintaining primacy which would be destroying economies elsewhere faster than he can hurt his own

Oh I’m a huge fan of globalisation and have personally benefitted from it immensely , I just don’t think it can be blanket said to work and that larger wealthier countries should deffo have more key stuff like food, medicine, power , steel , defence etc domestic capacity. And that would require lots of carrots, rather than Trump sticks.

[Sandstorm]

Early reports from US car makers is that Trump's tariffs will add around $6500 to the price of an average family saloon, even if it's "made" in America. So many parts for each car assembled there come from overseas.

[dpedin]

Bit disingenuous linking US tariffs on everyone , with Brexit to fit your agenda. The Brexit related tariffs / end of exemptions , could have been not applied had EU wanted to not retaliate (and in any case mostly the status quo has remained thus far) and uk retaliate to the retaliation… tit for tat rarely works.

However I agree with you 100% that this is merely a start for Trump and it’s his way of bullying deal making. Be interesting to see how this pans out & for us, what Starmer does (probs best if he continues to do fuck all really and let other countries fight the US)

I don't think it is disingenuous at all to use the Brexit example! I was using the Brexit issue as an example of the idiocy of the argument from Trump et al that tariffs impact everyone equally. All goods going into the US from every country in the world, apart from Russia it seems, will have tariffs applied on them and the totality of this will impact hugely on the US economy. It. will drive up prices for consumers. The impact on every other country will be proportional to the amount of trade they have with the US and probably only in specific sectors/industries. Exactly the same issue applied to Brexit - all our goods coming from every EU country were impacted by Brexit whereas for EU countries it was only whatever proportion of exports they sent to the UK, which for some wasn't very much. Both are excellent examples of economic self harm being sold by dodgy politicians to the economic illiterate!

I can see you don’t think it’s dis ingenious :

Us acts versus almost the entire planet, Uk acts versus the Eu (I’m not saying it wasn’t major, but it wasn’t the picking fight with entire planet Trump has)

Us is the instigator of tariffs , Brexit was the scorned party invoking tariffs which it could had it wished not wish to re-employ. But it was feeling some retaliation was needed, Trump has seen this and used a similar thought process only turned the dial up to 11

Uk could have moved some of its economic ties and trade elsewhere , as has happened to an extent with several agreements that certain people swore were going to be impossible to get agreed. US taking on the whole world, doesn’t really leave anywhere else for demand and supply to move elsewhere.

So fairly different really.

The economic self harm mis-sold now that I can agree with, however for the larger section of referendum voters (myself included) it was a price deemed worth paying for political and immagratory reasons (not the sides of buses or bendy bananas).
It should also be noted there were also economic lies told by team remain as well.

Woah dont get your nickers into a twist! I wasn't comparing the whole of Brexit v US imposing tariffs debacles but merely comparing the impact of one country imposing economically damaging barriers to trade and thinking the impact is the same for both sides! In Brexit we came out of the EU and as a consequence lost our favourable trading arrangements with out biggest export market, whereas the EU countries lost one, and in most cases not by any means their biggest, market. The UK economy is now widely agreed to take a 4% hit on GDP. The US have done the same in implementing these tariffs and increased the cost of every single import into their market stoking inflation, disrupting supply chains and their own manufacturing, slowing down the economy, etc. Yes other countries will take a hit but for many ie the UK, the US isnt their biggest market - as I said earlier it is 17% of UK exports and mostly on a small range of specialist goods, luxury cars, whisky, etc. The parallels between the economic bullshit claims spouted about Brexit and Trumps tariffs are very strong and both ignore the basic maths that they take a 100% hit for their actions whereas all the other countries ie the EU or the World, take a proportionally smaller hit to their economy!

The US have gambled that the rest of the world will fold, in much the same way Brexiteers said the EU couldn't do without the UK and we could/would continue to have unfettered access to the EU, goods would flow West-East to Northern Ireland without any barriers, etc. That went really well and our imports and exports with the EU are down post Brexit and as the OBR points put there is little evidence that trade from elsewhere has managed to plug the gap! If China, Canada, EU, etc dont fold to Trumps demands then the economic damage to the US of the tariff barriers will be huge and be felt very quick! At least with Brexit we had a transition period and planned, albeit very very badly for the transition. It could be a significant hit, comparable to the Brexit impact on UK GDP but within the year. It will be interesting to see who folds first but my money is on Trump having to fold but trying to cloak it up as some form of crappy success!

[Rhubarb & Custard]

whether one likes globalisation or not it's a reality, if you want to step back from it there are some things you'd need to do away with, modern shipping, flying, the internet. if you're not willing to give up those things then why take on the Sisyphean task of raging against globalisation rather than trying to swim with the tide and even harness some of its offerings? even if Trump's plan works, and it's a big if, all he'll achieve is a less productive and over time less relevant USA. unless he seeks another means of maintaining primacy which would be destroying economies elsewhere faster than he can hurt his own

Oh I’m a huge fan of globalisation and have personally benefitted from it immensely , I just don’t think it can be blanket said to work and that larger wealthier countries should deffo have more key stuff like food, medicine, power , steel , defence etc domestic capacity. And that would require lots of carrots, rather than Trump sticks.

There is a trade off with comes with such protectionism, even if in isolation it's a good idea.

[lemonhead]

Early reports from US car makers is that Trump's tariffs will add around $6500 to the price of an average family saloon, even if it's "made" in America. So many parts for each car assembled there come from overseas.

For the good of America I hope even the likes of Myanmar give this kvnt the middle finger.

He can even keep his infantile obsession with 'making a deal'. Get the kid a comfortable room and Leavitt can play wet nurse with a bag of Hersheys.

[bok_viking]

whether one likes globalisation or not it's a reality, if you want to step back from it there are some things you'd need to do away with, modern shipping, flying, the internet. if you're not willing to give up those things then why take on the Sisyphean task of raging against globalisation rather than trying to swim with the tide and even harness some of its offerings? even if Trump's plan works, and it's a big if, all he'll achieve is a less productive and over time less relevant USA. unless he seeks another means of maintaining primacy which would be destroying economies elsewhere faster than he can hurt his own

Oh I’m a huge fan of globalisation and have personally benefitted from it immensely , I just don’t think it can be blanket said to work and that larger wealthier countries should deffo have more key stuff like food, medicine, power , steel , defence etc domestic capacity. And that would require lots of carrots, rather than Trump sticks.

There is a trade off with comes with such protectionism, even if in isolation it's a good idea.

the problem with protectionism is that with our modern societies and modern tech and requirements, you just cannot avoid trading with other countries, Globalization has made many countries a lot richer than they would have been without it, it allows countries to grow their economies beyond what is possible with only domestic demand. Take a country like Denmark, they have barely any manufacturing left, little to no raw materials, etc, yet are one of the richest countries per capita, and a lot richer than they were before globalization became a thing, and that is most likely the truth for 90%+ of nations around the world. Globalization was great for the USA until they were not the top dog in exports anymore, then it suddenly became a bad thing.
I believe the USA is longing for the cold war period when they were the ruler of the world and everyone bowed down to them because they "protected" them from the bad commies which basically allowed them to do as they please. Since the fall of the soviet union they have slowly lost that power and control to dictate the policies of other countries and they want it back. That is a big reason in my opinion why they spend $2Billion a year on anti China propaganda, they desperately need a new bad guy to "protect" the world from.
Unfortunately for them I think Trump is undoing a lot of what that anti-China propaganda achieved over the last decade because he is pushing countries back to China and making China look like the more credible economical partner to have. Just look what is happening between Japan, South Korea and China now, suddenly they announced that they will work more closely together and build strong economic ties to counter the USA.
I think these 4 years of the Trump presidency is going to have a lot of negative long term effects for the USA, countries are not just going to forget when he is gone. Countries will start diversifying away from the USA, even if he drops tariffs, etc. I think countries will continue to slowly move away in the background. With a little work, any country can find alternative trade, there are 8 billion people outside of the USA to work with. So yes it will be a shock to the economies of many countries to deal with the effect of tariffs, but any government/business that is willing to put in a little effort should be able to find alternative routes in short order. A friend of mine who's business will be directly affected by the tariffs as he exported 90% of his products to the USA, started looking for alternatives 2 months ago, and he has almost completely covered the demand and as a result will completely scale down his exports to the USA, he was also approached by some US customers who told him that he should absorb any tariffs that come about into the cost of his goods, and he told them that he does not need their business anymore if that is what they expect.

[Yeeb]

The whole ‘asking them to absorb tariffs’ thing where us companies are going to their suppliers , is all a bit weird.

“Errr, no thanks , that’s why your price has gone up by 10/20/37%”

[Yeeb]

I don't think it is disingenuous at all to use the Brexit example! I was using the Brexit issue as an example of the idiocy of the argument from Trump et al that tariffs impact everyone equally. All goods going into the US from every country in the world, apart from Russia it seems, will have tariffs applied on them and the totality of this will impact hugely on the US economy. It. will drive up prices for consumers. The impact on every other country will be proportional to the amount of trade they have with the US and probably only in specific sectors/industries. Exactly the same issue applied to Brexit - all our goods coming from every EU country were impacted by Brexit whereas for EU countries it was only whatever proportion of exports they sent to the UK, which for some wasn't very much. Both are excellent examples of economic self harm being sold by dodgy politicians to the economic illiterate!

I can see you don’t think it’s dis ingenious :

Us acts versus almost the entire planet, Uk acts versus the Eu (I’m not saying it wasn’t major, but it wasn’t the picking fight with entire planet Trump has)

Us is the instigator of tariffs , Brexit was the scorned party invoking tariffs which it could had it wished not wish to re-employ. But it was feeling some retaliation was needed, Trump has seen this and used a similar thought process only turned the dial up to 11

Uk could have moved some of its economic ties and trade elsewhere , as has happened to an extent with several agreements that certain people swore were going to be impossible to get agreed. US taking on the whole world, doesn’t really leave anywhere else for demand and supply to move elsewhere.

So fairly different really.

The economic self harm mis-sold now that I can agree with, however for the larger section of referendum voters (myself included) it was a price deemed worth paying for political and immagratory reasons (not the sides of buses or bendy bananas).
It should also be noted there were also economic lies told by team remain as well.

Woah dont get your nickers into a twist! I wasn't comparing the whole of Brexit v US imposing tariffs debacles but merely comparing the impact of one country imposing economically damaging barriers to trade and thinking the impact is the same for both sides! In Brexit we came out of the EU and as a consequence lost our favourable trading arrangements with out biggest export market, whereas the EU countries lost one, and in most cases not by any means their biggest, market. The UK economy is now widely agreed to take a 4% hit on GDP. The US have done the same in implementing these tariffs and increased the cost of every single import into their market stoking inflation, disrupting supply chains and their own manufacturing, slowing down the economy, etc. Yes other countries will take a hit but for many ie the UK, the US isnt their biggest market - as I said earlier it is 17% of UK exports and mostly on a small range of specialist goods, luxury cars, whisky, etc. The parallels between the economic bullshit claims spouted about Brexit and Trumps tariffs are very strong and both ignore the basic maths that they take a 100% hit for their actions whereas all the other countries ie the EU or the World, take a proportionally smaller hit to their economy!

The US have gambled that the rest of the world will fold, in much the same way Brexiteers said the EU couldn't do without the UK and we could/would continue to have unfettered access to the EU, goods would flow West-East to Northern Ireland without any barriers, etc. That went really well and our imports and exports with the EU are down post Brexit and as the OBR points put there is little evidence that trade from elsewhere has managed to plug the gap! If China, Canada, EU, etc dont fold to Trumps demands then the economic damage to the US of the tariff barriers will be huge and be felt very quick! At least with Brexit we had a transition period and planned, albeit very very badly for the transition. It could be a significant hit, comparable to the Brexit impact on UK GDP but within the year. It will be interesting to see who folds first but my money is on Trump having to fold but trying to cloak it up as some form of crappy success!

Uk didn’t impose extra tariffs though , the remaining EU did, as at the time didn’t need any UK money, military capacity or world influence.

Remains to be seen how Trump lunacy pans out for world trade , right now uk has gained a bit comparatively

[Hal Jordan]

Finding it hard to even laugh at this shit anymore.

What damage will this bunch of tossers wreak, and for nothing.

Many of those who voted for him still cling to the idiotic notion that Kamala as president would have been a disaster for the country.

A black woman who didn't have simultaneous unequivocal support for both Israel and Gaza? The mind boggles at the damage she would have wrought!

I mean, what if, in a moment of feminine weakness, she became infatuated with a brutal dictator and skewed US policy to curry favour? Whatever would we have done?

[Deepsouth]

5 eyes -1