Ok ,I been watching a few AB test on tv over the last few weeks with piss all else on, and interested to hear what we think which players/selections we would all bag if we were on rugby boreds as much say 20-24 years ago. I only kind of thinking of since professional era really.
For intance watch the so called test of the century from Sydney in 2000, and you will see both Umaga and Lomu scoring tries by placing it down one handed, much like Ioane when he lost it and was then called a show pony etc etc. Lomu's in particular was to score the winning try, I don't recall either players getting bagged a lot.
Players playing out of position Jerry Collins a number 8 getting moved to 6 , Read going the opposite, I know they worked out well, but they were players put into places to fill holes as did the likes of Kahui playing on wing waiting to get 13 jersey etc. Christ we even had Leon MacDonald playing test rugby at 10 and 13 without a lot of comment. Even Umaga the same, and I heard Umage talking in Brisbane when he was AB captain saying he thought most centres could play wing and most wingers were more than competent 15s (ie Goldie ,Smith etc) at test level. We has Muliana swapping between 15 and 13.
What is so different in todays game that we think players can't swap positions
Just thought it was worth having a little discussion on while there not a lot of SH rugby on.
It actually happens everywhere I know, but have just really seen a few AB games over last few days ,so they what came to mind.
What differnet skills are rquired then a few years ago?
Lomu’s grounding was a one-handed but was nothing like Ioane’s showboating diving one-handed grounding.
As for switching positions, there was a lot of talk about MacDonald’s switch. The concern today is that players are being shoehorned and aren’t up to where they are being put/it isn’t best for the team. That type of discussion has happened in the past as well - think Cullen at centre for example.
A big difference skill wise between now and 20-30 years ago handling in the tight forwards. Watching the old games there is a lot of dropped ball and it’s pretty one dimensional. Now those guys are linking up and in some cases almost acting as playmakers.
To answer the question about what is needed today vs. 20 years ago, the main difference is needing the surname “Barrett”
As for switching positions, there was a lot of talk about MacDonald’s switch. The concern today is that players are being shoehorned and aren’t up to where they are being put/it isn’t best for the team. That type of discussion has happened in the past as well - think Cullen at centre for example.
A big difference skill wise between now and 20-30 years ago handling in the tight forwards. Watching the old games there is a lot of dropped ball and it’s pretty one dimensional. Now those guys are linking up and in some cases almost acting as playmakers.
To answer the question about what is needed today vs. 20 years ago, the main difference is needing the surname “Barrett”
With a wink though and I’m shocked that you would think provincial bias would come into this. Scott Barrett is a very good player as was Jordie in 2016.
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mat the expat
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Insane_Homer
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differnet rquired then?
“Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true.”
Another major concern is that the first responders found it perfectly legible.....
“It was a pet, not an animal. It had a name, you don't eat things with names, this is horrific!”
My in-laws are from Wigan and can be a bit broad. That was a piece of cake to understand.
Strange you’d point out Leon MacDonald.Christ we even had Leon MacDonald playing test rugby at 10 and 13 without a lot of comment.
Leon MacDonald at 13 was the single worst positional switch made by the ABs. It was when it rocked home you don’t switch players about else they’ll get embarrassed. It was why we went home from the World Cup in 2003. He was battered by Mortlock. He was his private dancer.
Kaino at lock being another catastrophic failure.
I’d argue Ben Smith at 13 actually ruined him as a player. We never quite saw the same Ben Smith again after the EOYT. He was only “excellent” after that point, rather than the crazy ridiculous brilliance he possessed before that.
Though to top the list across the world, it has to be bergamaso
But I still love this one too.
You’ve not been on the NZ rugby threads then with our great man and top bloke Dan. You go through phases. Ear bleeding phase, followed by permanent brain scarring, finally acceptance and a new found ability to decode Dan speak.
Lineout jumping/throwing nous. Wouldn't surprise me if half or more tries at the pro level come from catch and drives.
Was it here that someone posted a highest paid players by position chart, with locks being in the top or top five of all the NH leagues?
Jackals weren't so common back in the day - the odd player who put his body on the line, esp from getting a major shoeing. Though there a) weren't nearly as many rucks back then and b) players piled in such that there'd be few opportunities. Forwards followed the play and committed a few bodies to the breakdown (quite often blown up for a scrum) rather than standing out waiting for their prescribed phase. Now, with all the pods, there's a chance for a steal because there's usually just one or two blokes there to support and if the timing is off / one falls, there ball's there for the poach.
Was it here that someone posted a highest paid players by position chart, with locks being in the top or top five of all the NH leagues?
Jackals weren't so common back in the day - the odd player who put his body on the line, esp from getting a major shoeing. Though there a) weren't nearly as many rucks back then and b) players piled in such that there'd be few opportunities. Forwards followed the play and committed a few bodies to the breakdown (quite often blown up for a scrum) rather than standing out waiting for their prescribed phase. Now, with all the pods, there's a chance for a steal because there's usually just one or two blokes there to support and if the timing is off / one falls, there ball's there for the poach.
Yep Niegs I remember we went through stage where Props were top earners too. Game seems to find different areas that are more important every few years. Case of trying to unlock latest defence system usually, can't score out wide try to play for penalties so can go to corner for lineout drive. Really think maybe because of defence patterns used now the gamebreaker type player in backline is starting to become very rare or redundant.Niegs wrote: Sun Jan 10, 2021 3:51 pm Lineout jumping/throwing nous. Wouldn't surprise me if half or more tries at the pro level come from catch and drives.
Was it here that someone posted a highest paid players by position chart, with locks being in the top or top five of all the NH leagues?
Jackals weren't so common back in the day - the odd player who put his body on the line, esp from getting a major shoeing. Though there a) weren't nearly as many rucks back then and b) players piled in such that there'd be few opportunities. Forwards followed the play and committed a few bodies to the breakdown (quite often blown up for a scrum) rather than standing out waiting for their prescribed phase. Now, with all the pods, there's a chance for a steal because there's usually just one or two blokes there to support and if the timing is off / one falls, there ball's there for the poach.
I guess you trying to upset me, but even if I could understand what you saying I still would just shrug my shoulders and not care mate.Ymx wrote: Sun Jan 10, 2021 2:28 pmYou’ve not been on the NZ rugby threads then with our great man and top bloke Dan. You go through phases. Ear bleeding phase, followed by permanent brain scarring, finally acceptance and a new found ability to decode Dan speak.
I never understood why MacDonald was played at 13, but then he get's a test at 10 that was a little out there too.Ymx wrote: Sun Jan 10, 2021 2:23 pmStrange you’d point out Leon MacDonald.Christ we even had Leon MacDonald playing test rugby at 10 and 13 without a lot of comment.
Leon MacDonald at 13 was the single worst positional switch made by the ABs. It was when it rocked home you don’t switch players about else they’ll get embarrassed. It was why we went home from the World Cup in 2003. He was battered by Mortlock. He was his private dancer.
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Guy Smiley
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I would go along with that too , tighties are expected to have a lot better skill set now. I think it shows in a lot of NZ teams at least as how many players we will use in the 5 metre channel when attacking, a few years back there would be on now you will get 3-4 players there using short passes.Jb1981 wrote: Sun Jan 10, 2021 6:33 am
A big difference skill wise between now and 20-30 years ago handling in the tight forwards. Watching the old games there is a lot of dropped ball and it’s pretty one dimensional. Now those guys are linking up and in some cases almost acting as playmakers.