Panic buying morons

[yermum]

Where do I panic buy gas from?

Rumour has it one of the big six is about to go under leaving the Government holding the steaming turd of their own making.

[Kawazaki]

Where do I panic buy gas from?

Rumour has it one of the big six is about to go under leaving the Government holding the steaming turd of their own making.

Big six what?

[Ymx]

Igloo gone. Not a big 6, but it was my gas company

[Kawazaki]

When will the wholesale prices come down, who is not producing the raw materials, the Russians?

[sorCrer]

Really weird thing to try and turn into a generational issue indeed. Digging a hole in the ground and shitting in it is not some sort of achievement.

Changing your fortunes/situation/country even, to put it into a situation where people no longer need to dig holes to shit in, is an acheivement.

Wow. You clearly have absolutely no idea.

[sorCrer]

Really weird thing to try and turn into a generational issue indeed. Digging a hole in the ground and shitting in it is not some sort of achievement.

You've clearly not met many South African farming types have you?

Thicker than a castle wall.

Another ignorant cunt. Probably lived in fatburg London your whole life with people chucking filth from tampons to chip oil into sewers.

[FalseBayFC]

Really weird thing to try and turn into a generational issue indeed. Digging a hole in the ground and shitting in it is not some sort of achievement.

You've clearly not met many South African farming types have you?

Thicker than a castle wall.

Another ignorant cunt. Probably lived in fatburg London your whole life with people chucking filth from tampons to chip oil into sewers.

He wouldn't recognize a South African farming type if he stood in front of him. Is he talking about a white farmer, an African black farmer, an Indian South African farmer, a mixed race (coloured ) South African farmer. They are not at all thick. It pisses me off when they equate South Africans with white Afrikaners. White Afrikaners make up less than 10% of the population but this is generally what they think about when they refer to South Africans. Its like non-white South Africans don't exist to some people.

[FalseBayFC]

Really weird thing to try and turn into a generational issue indeed. Digging a hole in the ground and shitting in it is not some sort of achievement.

Changing your fortunes/situation/country even, to put it into a situation where people no longer need to dig holes to shit in, is an acheivement.

Have spent my life working to build and improve South Africa. As do all my family. And yes digging a long drop in shit hard soil full of rocks is no easy task. Do it in 40 degree heat and because you live 50km away from the nearest sewer line or can't afford a septic tank and I would consider that an achievement. It's something that most first worlders would not be able to do.

[Kawazaki]

You've clearly not met many South African farming types have you?

Thicker than a castle wall.

Another ignorant cunt. Probably lived in fatburg London your whole life with people chucking filth from tampons to chip oil into sewers.

He wouldn't recognize a South African farming type if he stood in front of him. Is he talking about a white farmer, an African black farmer, an Indian South African farmer, a mixed race (coloured ) South African farmer. They are not at all thick. It pisses me off when they equate South Africans with white Afrikaners. White Afrikaners make up less than 10% of the population but this is generally what they think about when they refer to South Africans. Its like non-white South Africans don't exist to some people.

Played in rugby teams full of Saffas. City Saffas and the country boys really don't get on too well.

Just look at the dumb cunts you let manage your national team FFS.

[Kawazaki]

Really weird thing to try and turn into a generational issue indeed. Digging a hole in the ground and shitting in it is not some sort of achievement.

Changing your fortunes/situation/country even, to put it into a situation where people no longer need to dig holes to shit in, is an acheivement.

Have spent my life working to build and improve South Africa. As do all my family. And yes digging a long drop in shit hard soil full of rocks is no easy task. Do it in 40 degree heat and because you live 50km away from the nearest sewer line or can't afford a septic tank and I would consider that an achievement. It's something that most first worlders would not be able to do.

What sort of dumb cunt would put broadband as a higher priority than a decent shitter?

[Raggs]

Really weird thing to try and turn into a generational issue indeed. Digging a hole in the ground and shitting in it is not some sort of achievement.

Changing your fortunes/situation/country even, to put it into a situation where people no longer need to dig holes to shit in, is an acheivement.

Wow. You clearly have absolutely no idea.

Educate me then?

Really weird thing to try and turn into a generational issue indeed. Digging a hole in the ground and shitting in it is not some sort of achievement.

Changing your fortunes/situation/country even, to put it into a situation where people no longer need to dig holes to shit in, is an acheivement.

Have spent my life working to build and improve South Africa. As do all my family. And yes digging a long drop in shit hard soil full of rocks is no easy task. Do it in 40 degree heat and because you live 50km away from the nearest sewer line or can't afford a septic tank and I would consider that an achievement. It's something that most first worlders would not be able to do.

It's definitely not easy to do. I've had the pleasure in helping dig one. It's certainly satisfying when it's done. But again. To suggest that a whole generation is incapable of using a pick and shovel etc, and pretending that it's some special achievement, is obvious bollocks. And yes, most 1st worlders could do it. They might need some basic instructions on how to, perhaps not own the tools themselves, but none of that makes it some mystic wizardry doable only by the most capable of souls.

[Sandstorm]

This thread is an embarrassment to all of you.

[FalseBayFC]

Really weird thing to try and turn into a generational issue indeed. Digging a hole in the ground and shitting in it is not some sort of achievement.

Changing your fortunes/situation/country even, to put it into a situation where people no longer need to dig holes to shit in, is an acheivement.

Wow. You clearly have absolutely no idea.

Educate me then?

Really weird thing to try and turn into a generational issue indeed. Digging a hole in the ground and shitting in it is not some sort of achievement.

Changing your fortunes/situation/country even, to put it into a situation where people no longer need to dig holes to shit in, is an acheivement.

Have spent my life working to build and improve South Africa. As do all my family. And yes digging a long drop in shit hard soil full of rocks is no easy task. Do it in 40 degree heat and because you live 50km away from the nearest sewer line or can't afford a septic tank and I would consider that an achievement. It's something that most first worlders would not be able to do.

It's definitely not easy to do. I've had the pleasure in helping dig one. It's certainly satisfying when it's done. But again. To suggest that a whole generation is incapable of using a pick and shovel etc, and pretending that it's some special achievement, is obvious bollocks. And yes, most 1st worlders could do it. They might need some basic instructions on how to, perhaps not own the tools themselves, but none of that makes it some mystic wizardry doable only by the most capable of souls.

Then why does New Zealand need to import nurses from India and the Phillipines? The NZ Health department says that New Zealanders are not interested in the messy long hours involved in that kind of labour. British farmers have no one to pick their fruit. Americans have to import third worlders to work in their abbatoirs. Apparently UK citizens are not attracted to the long and arduous task of driving around an HGV truck. Why do these countries need thirdworlders to the shit physical jobs? I think its more than just the shit wages. My visits to the USA, UK and Australia and from what I've read suggest that the urban inhabitants of these countries are becoming less and less physically capable of an job that involves manual work.

[OomStruisbaai]

Really weird thing to try and turn into a generational issue indeed. Digging a hole in the ground and shitting in it is not some sort of achievement.

Changing your fortunes/situation/country even, to put it into a situation where people no longer need to dig holes to shit in, is an acheivement.

Have spent my life working to build and improve South Africa. As do all my family. And yes digging a long drop in shit hard soil full of rocks is no easy task. Do it in 40 degree heat and because you live 50km away from the nearest sewer line or can't afford a septic tank and I would consider that an achievement. It's something that most first worlders would not be able to do.

We dug piss lelies for fun at Lohatlha, a place the devil donated to the army. Just finished it , then we need to move base and start all over again in that red ground.

[sockwithaticket]

Wow. You clearly have absolutely no idea.

Educate me then?

Have spent my life working to build and improve South Africa. As do all my family. And yes digging a long drop in shit hard soil full of rocks is no easy task. Do it in 40 degree heat and because you live 50km away from the nearest sewer line or can't afford a septic tank and I would consider that an achievement. It's something that most first worlders would not be able to do.

It's definitely not easy to do. I've had the pleasure in helping dig one. It's certainly satisfying when it's done. But again. To suggest that a whole generation is incapable of using a pick and shovel etc, and pretending that it's some special achievement, is obvious bollocks. And yes, most 1st worlders could do it. They might need some basic instructions on how to, perhaps not own the tools themselves, but none of that makes it some mystic wizardry doable only by the most capable of souls.

Then why does New Zealand need to import nurses from India and the Phillipines? The NZ Health department says that New Zealanders are not interested in the messy long hours involved in that kind of labour. British farmers have no one to pick their fruit. Americans have to import third worlders to work in their abbatoirs. Apparently UK citizens are not attracted to the long and arduous task of driving around an HGV truck. Why do these countries need thirdworlders to the shit physical jobs? I think its more than just the shit wages. My visits to the USA, UK and Australia and from what I've read suggest that the urban inhabitants of these countries are becoming less and less physically capable of an job that involves manual work.

They're often not raised in environments where it's the norm or something taught to them, but that has nothing to do with their actual physical capability.

You are slightly right, it's not just shit wages that discourages people from doing the jobs you've mentioned. It's shit wages, shit conditions and easier jobs that pay at the least a similar amount if not more. If you can't get someone to do the work, then you're not paying enough to coax them away from other prospects.

[FalseBayFC]

Educate me then?



It's definitely not easy to do. I've had the pleasure in helping dig one. It's certainly satisfying when it's done. But again. To suggest that a whole generation is incapable of using a pick and shovel etc, and pretending that it's some special achievement, is obvious bollocks. And yes, most 1st worlders could do it. They might need some basic instructions on how to, perhaps not own the tools themselves, but none of that makes it some mystic wizardry doable only by the most capable of souls.

Then why does New Zealand need to import nurses from India and the Phillipines? The NZ Health department says that New Zealanders are not interested in the messy long hours involved in that kind of labour. British farmers have no one to pick their fruit. Americans have to import third worlders to work in their abbatoirs. Apparently UK citizens are not attracted to the long and arduous task of driving around an HGV truck. Why do these countries need thirdworlders to the shit physical jobs? I think its more than just the shit wages. My visits to the USA, UK and Australia and from what I've read suggest that the urban inhabitants of these countries are becoming less and less physically capable of an job that involves manual work.

They're often not raised in environments where it's the norm or something taught to them, but that has nothing to do with their actual physical capability.

You are slightly right, it's not just shit wages that discourages people from doing the jobs you've mentioned. It's shit wages, shit conditions and easier jobs that pay at the least a similar amount if not more. If you can't get someone to do the work, then you're not paying enough to coax them away from other prospects.

I guess it has a lot to do with urbanisation. Countries like Poland still have lots of people living and working in the countryside.I lived there for 4 years and it's striking once you cross the border into Germany where mechanized agribusiness is the norm. Not much going on in little villages there.

Poland at that stage was importing welders from the Ukraine because it had lost so many to Germany and the UK.

What pisses me off about the essential skill immigration programs in rich countries is that absolutely zero consideration given for the damage it causes the other country.

[FalseBayFC]

I think the Saudi, Gulf states model where millions of third worlders are imported to do manual labour and live in iniquitous conditions is appalling. Many UK farmers are calling to be allowed to import virtual slaves, house them in shit conditions and then send them home when the seasons over. Of course the slaves will come but it doesn't make it right.

[yermum]

its nothing new just the folk doing the shit work have changed.

[Paddington Bear]

Mentioned it before but anyone who has been to Eastern Europe, particularly somewhere like Poland, in the last few years will not be surprised that there are labour shortages in Western Europe. GDP and living standards have risen exponentially, at least in the cities, and so there's less need to come and be treated like shit over here.
Moreover one of the largest and most interesting minorities to watch in years to come is Anglo-Poles. Those that have stayed have often married a local and settled more into standard British life, which of course doesn't include picking fruit 15 hours a day.

[Calculon]

Would most Poles who stayed anyway not be the better qualified, rather than the fruit picker types. I went to a "polish day" festival type of thing in London, ironically around the time of the brexit vote, and the number of polish owned businesses represented there were massive.

[Tichtheid]

I did an engineering degree in the late 80s (well started it anyway). We were shown a report commissioned by one of the chartered engineering institutes which stated that the lack of investment in apprenticeships in the UK would lead to a need to import skilled labour as the current crop of trades got older and retired.

We got a bit better for a while, but it's still a lottery for members of the public trying to hire reliable trades for works at home, the quality and prices vary tremendously.

[FalseBayFC]

Mentioned it before but anyone who has been to Eastern Europe, particularly somewhere like Poland, in the last few years will not be surprised that there are labour shortages in Western Europe. GDP and living standards have risen exponentially, at least in the cities, and so there's less need to come and be treated like shit over here.
Moreover one of the largest and most interesting minorities to watch in years to come is Anglo-Poles. Those that have stayed have often married a local and settled more into standard British life, which of course doesn't include picking fruit 15 hours a day.

I've lived in the UK and Poland. Poland is a magnificent place if you have money. Still own 3 hectares bordering the Bory Tucholskie national park. We visit yearly but have not done so the last couple of years. A neigbouring farmer plants 1 hectare to barley/oats and in return looks after the place and the fruit orchard. We paid about 50k euros for it and it included a solid wooden home thats habitable year round.

For Polish workers in the UK who are less skilled, the dream is often to return and build a home. The doctors and engineers will go where they are paid well and can live well.

There are some shitty parts but I loved living in Pomerania. Hop on the ferry to Norway/Sweden/Denmark/Finland/Iceland. Drive down to Dresden for the concert season. Slovakia and Czech for cheap easy skiing.

[FalseBayFC]

I did an engineering degree in the late 80s (well started it anyway). We were shown a report commissioned by one of the chartered engineering institutes which stated that the lack of investment in apprenticeships in the UK would lead to a need to import skilled labour as the current crop of trades got older and retired.

We got a bit better for a while, but it's still a lottery for members of the public trying to hire reliable trades for works at home, the quality and prices vary tremendously.

My grandpa came from Lockerbie and was apprenticed at age 14. Ended up being a boiler maker on the mines all over Southern Africa by 21. By the time he retired he had a very successful engineering firm. We also scrapped apprenticeships and trade schools here. Its been a huge mistake.

[Tichtheid]

I did an engineering degree in the late 80s (well started it anyway). We were shown a report commissioned by one of the chartered engineering institutes which stated that the lack of investment in apprenticeships in the UK would lead to a need to import skilled labour as the current crop of trades got older and retired.

We got a bit better for a while, but it's still a lottery for members of the public trying to hire reliable trades for works at home, the quality and prices vary tremendously.

My grandpa came from Lockerbie and was apprenticed at age 14. Ended up being a boiler maker on the mines all over Southern Africa by 21. By the time he retired he had a very successful engineering firm. We also scrapped apprenticeships and trade schools here. Its been a huge mistake.

When I left school there were a large number of apprenticeships still available, there were colleges all over Scotland offering training in all the building trades, catering, secretarial work, hairdressing, mechanical and electrical/electronic engineering (in fact there were dedicated colleges that were run by the likes of the electricity board and the merchant navy for many apprentices).

about 15 years ago I did my electrician's qualification through the local tech college. The gear we used was old and broken, I sat my second year exams two days before I sat my first year exams due to the college not bothering about us, all the money was going into the IT suits, which is fine until you need to get a power supply into the suits and can't find a qualified electrician to do it.

[sockwithaticket]

Then why does New Zealand need to import nurses from India and the Phillipines? The NZ Health department says that New Zealanders are not interested in the messy long hours involved in that kind of labour. British farmers have no one to pick their fruit. Americans have to import third worlders to work in their abbatoirs. Apparently UK citizens are not attracted to the long and arduous task of driving around an HGV truck. Why do these countries need thirdworlders to the shit physical jobs? I think its more than just the shit wages. My visits to the USA, UK and Australia and from what I've read suggest that the urban inhabitants of these countries are becoming less and less physically capable of an job that involves manual work.

They're often not raised in environments where it's the norm or something taught to them, but that has nothing to do with their actual physical capability.

You are slightly right, it's not just shit wages that discourages people from doing the jobs you've mentioned. It's shit wages, shit conditions and easier jobs that pay at the least a similar amount if not more. If you can't get someone to do the work, then you're not paying enough to coax them away from other prospects.

I guess it has a lot to do with urbanisation. Countries like Poland still have lots of people living and working in the countryside.I lived there for 4 years and it's striking once you cross the border into Germany where mechanized agribusiness is the norm. Not much going on in little villages there.

Poland at that stage was importing welders from the Ukraine because it had lost so many to Germany and the UK.

What pisses me off about the essential skill immigration programs in rich countries is that absolutely zero consideration given for the damage it causes the other country.

That is absolutely fair. It's actually a damning indictment of the short term thinking prevalent in so many Western democracies; they're driven by the desire to get re-elected every 4 - 5 years, that's prioritised over everything and it leads to taking shortcuts on all sorts of issues which have systemic root causes and might actually require some semblance of state intervention to solve. That's before you add in some governments own ideologies about letting the free market do its thing. Those same governments also tend to have issues with immigration, even if it's just because their voters do, yet if the developing world is continually raided for valuable professionals they continue to stay in a holding pattern of being developing rather than developed which does nothing to stymie the desire of people to move away.

I think the Saudi, Gulf states model where millions of third worlders are imported to do manual labour and live in iniquitous conditions is appalling. Many UK farmers are calling to be allowed to import virtual slaves, house them in shit conditions and then send them home when the seasons over. Of course the slaves will come but it doesn't make it right.

I understand how we've got to where we are, food costs a certain amount to produce and we haven't paid the real price for it in a while, mostly thanks to big chain supermarkets demanding produce not exceed certain price points, which means finding savings in the business model and that has become exploiting cheaper labour from the EU. It's definitely not right. As a remainer one of the few upsides I thought Brexit might bring would be a reckoning in the industry whereby farmers have the leverage to put up their prices in order to hire domestic workers at a wage that makes living here feasible, supermarkets take a hit to profits while softening their price increases and people have to become accustomed to a truer price of their food. Prices on non-essential goods would depress to reflect the changes in consumers' disposable income. At least that's what I'd hoped, it seems we're going to cling to trying to use borderline slave labour via special visas instead...

[Paddington Bear]

Mentioned it before but anyone who has been to Eastern Europe, particularly somewhere like Poland, in the last few years will not be surprised that there are labour shortages in Western Europe. GDP and living standards have risen exponentially, at least in the cities, and so there's less need to come and be treated like shit over here.
Moreover one of the largest and most interesting minorities to watch in years to come is Anglo-Poles. Those that have stayed have often married a local and settled more into standard British life, which of course doesn't include picking fruit 15 hours a day.

I've lived in the UK and Poland. Poland is a magnificent place if you have money. Still own 3 hectares bordering the Bory Tucholskie national park. We visit yearly but have not done so the last couple of years. A neigbouring farmer plants 1 hectare to barley/oats and in return looks after the place and the fruit orchard. We paid about 50k euros for it and it included a solid wooden home thats habitable year round.

For Polish workers in the UK who are less skilled, the dream is often to return and build a home. The doctors and engineers will go where they are paid well and can live well.

There are some shitty parts but I loved living in Pomerania. Hop on the ferry to Norway/Sweden/Denmark/Finland/Iceland. Drive down to Dresden for the concert season. Slovakia and Czech for cheap easy skiing.

Yeah I found my first few trips there very eye opening compared to what I was expecting, I have to say. Fwiw contrary to a lot of the narrative at the moment I've found a huge amount of goodwill towards Britain and the time spent here from people who did come over, no doubt seen through the rose tint of having used the proceeds to build their house and life as you say.

[Kawazaki]

There are massive skills shortages across virtually all sections of the UK economy. It's not just HGV drivers. Whether it's a points-based system, a sponsor system or something bespoke to the UK, it's very important that the UK gets the proposition right as talent attraction becomes more global. I'd also like to see a big return of the old technical colleges model that lost is way about 30 years ago.

[FalseBayFC]

You're right about the technical colleges. Importing skills works as long as you can pay for them or offer an attractive enough destination. Its also a short term fix because the children of immigrants are never as desperate or hard working as their parents and end up becoming retail assistants and internet content providers. So you need to import more first gens.

[Dinsdale Piranha]

There are massive skills shortages across virtually all sections of the UK economy. It's not just HGV drivers. Whether it's a points-based system, a sponsor system or something bespoke to the UK, it's very important that the UK gets the proposition right as talent attraction becomes more global. I'd also like to see a big return of the old technical colleges model that lost is way about 30 years ago.

There is frequently low value placed on jobs with a manual component even if it's skilled - try getting a tradesman in London in under several weeks.

A friend ( who happens to be a Gloucester STH for his sins) works for an aviation company. They offer apprenticeships to be a qualified helicopter mechanic. Once qualified after a couple of years this is a well paying job. 40-60K then upwards from there.

A few years back they asked around local schools for candidates and got no response. The schools said "we don't encourage kids to go in to manual jobs"

FFS.

[Slick]

I did an engineering degree in the late 80s (well started it anyway). We were shown a report commissioned by one of the chartered engineering institutes which stated that the lack of investment in apprenticeships in the UK would lead to a need to import skilled labour as the current crop of trades got older and retired.

We got a bit better for a while, but it's still a lottery for members of the public trying to hire reliable trades for works at home, the quality and prices vary tremendously.

My grandpa came from Lockerbie and was apprenticed at age 14. Ended up being a boiler maker on the mines all over Southern Africa by 21. By the time he retired he had a very successful engineering firm. We also scrapped apprenticeships and trade schools here. Its been a huge mistake.

When I left school there were a large number of apprenticeships still available, there were colleges all over Scotland offering training in all the building trades, catering, secretarial work, hairdressing, mechanical and electrical/electronic engineering (in fact there were dedicated colleges that were run by the likes of the electricity board and the merchant navy for many apprentices).

about 15 years ago I did my electrician's qualification through the local tech college. The gear we used was old and broken, I sat my second year exams two days before I sat my first year exams due to the college not bothering about us, all the money was going into the IT suits, which is fine until you need to get a power supply into the suits and can't find a qualified electrician to do it.

There has been a massive change in Scotland over the last 10- 15 years in the college sector. There was basically a new start with consolidation of appropriate institutions, massive investment, new infrastructure and a focus on linking into industry and delivering for industry which has produced, imo, a world class sector.

As an example, you go to the City of Glasgow Maritime college and half the students are in uniform as they have been sent for training through the various global maritime companies, who have a seat at the table when courses are being designed, and part of the focus is that they are representing their employers.

My main gripe at the moment here is that SG concentrate so much on the uni sector when actually we have massive export potential from the college sector that isn't realised.

[FalseBayFC]

There are massive skills shortages across virtually all sections of the UK economy. It's not just HGV drivers. Whether it's a points-based system, a sponsor system or something bespoke to the UK, it's very important that the UK gets the proposition right as talent attraction becomes more global. I'd also like to see a big return of the old technical colleges model that lost is way about 30 years ago.

There is frequently low value placed on jobs with a manual component even if it's skilled - try getting a tradesman in London in under several weeks.

A friend ( who happens to be a Gloucester STH for his sins) works for an aviation company. They offer apprenticeships to be a qualified helicopter mechanic. Once qualified after a couple of years this is a well paying job. 40-60K then upwards from there.

A few years back they asked around local schools for candidates and got no response. The schools said "we don't encourage kids to go in to manual jobs"

FFS.

The good thing about getting kids into trade schools and apprenticeships is that they quickly get conditioned to the physical side. Once someone is 21 and never had to bend his back it becomes more difficult.
I worked on the Milennium Dome in 1999 as a riggers mate during a working holiday. I had an IRATA qualification because of my climbing background. The UK artisans and labour types were amazing. I eventually ended up with a scaffing and stage building crew and spent 9 months travelling the world doing mainly music and sports events. Many of the lads had been doing it since they were 16/17 and were tough as old boots.

But we lived in London 8 to a house.

I think the South of England has a huge problem housing people like nurses and carers in decent affordable accommodation. That's part of it isn't it?

[JM2K6]

When will the wholesale prices come down, who is not producing the raw materials, the Russians?

From what I've read, Asia is trying to move away from gas etc, and Putin is witholding supply to force a deal on a pipeline through

[weegie01]

To tie two themes on this thread together, our drainage contractor has a private box at Celtic Park.

We live in a country area so septic tanks are the norm. We have been in this house for 26 years and have never had drainage problems. The contractor makes a fortune out of people who come from towns with no idea how to treat private drainage systems.

All the locals, including myself have drain rods. It is almost a measure of whether you are a real local or not. The townie call straight a way, we fix what we can. Nonetheless we have him on speed dial as we own holiday lets. It does not matter what you tell people, the drains are blocked on a regular basis.

No one wants to do his job. So after working like a looney for a few years he now works two or three days a week and makes a comfortable six figure salary.

He's Polish.

[Niegs]

There are massive skills shortages across virtually all sections of the UK economy. It's not just HGV drivers. Whether it's a points-based system, a sponsor system or something bespoke to the UK, it's very important that the UK gets the proposition right as talent attraction becomes more global. I'd also like to see a big return of the old technical colleges model that lost is way about 30 years ago.

There is frequently low value placed on jobs with a manual component even if it's skilled - try getting a tradesman in London in under several weeks.

A friend ( who happens to be a Gloucester STH for his sins) works for an aviation company. They offer apprenticeships to be a qualified helicopter mechanic. Once qualified after a couple of years this is a well paying job. 40-60K then upwards from there.

A few years back they asked around local schools for candidates and got no response. The schools said "we don't encourage kids to go in to manual jobs"

FFS.

Was the same over here in Canada for the longest time. High schools pushed university for as many as possible (we seemed to brag about the numbers who go, but not be as clear about what those undergraduates are actually doing when they finish, or how many get Masters to do jobs you could walk straight into and be trained to do out of high school a generation or two ago). Things have switched somewhat - I work at a technical college that is booming and even held strong with no real loss in numbers during the pandemic - but I still hear from family in manual trades that the work ethic isn't there (lots of turnover, some who do stay know how to game the fact that they're in demand so aren't so bothered about doing the best work all the time). An older staff member I work with said there was a time not too long ago that industry came back to the school and said it needed to do better as a lot of the candidates they were getting just weren't up to par (not just what they came out with, but also work ethic, will/ability to learn, etc.).

On the subject of the UK, though... I recently backed out of going over to do (yet more) graduate studies over there. What I found interesting researching it all was that there's a post-graduation work scheme where, if you study in the UK, you can get a work permit to stay two years and find a job (in any field, which I thought could be 'exploited' by both student and employer - not actually working in or hiring people for what was studied). But I didn't see any such option for trades. Part of me was thinking - as I'm a big history nerd and not shy of doing a bit of hard work - maybe I'll switch completely and get into heritage construction? (We have two courses here that interest me, but surely it'd be better to train and find steady work in Europe!) I could see apprenticeship programs galore for various trades but couldn't see any pathway for foreign workers to study those in the UK and stay afterwards. Surely Brexit means you need these people now that Eastern Euros aren't rocking up to fill need, but why the focus on uni graduates?

[tabascoboy]

When will the wholesale prices come down, who is not producing the raw materials, the Russians?

From what I've read, Asia is trying to move away from gas etc, and Putin is witholding supply to force a deal on a pipeline through

Ironically the US policy of sanctions against Russia in support of Ukraine (pipeline supply routed through Ukraine from Russia is a big net earner via fees) isn't helping us. Russia clearly doesn't want to bolster Ukraine's economy and hence they withhold supply, preferring Nordstream to be more quickly operational and also puts pressure on the West to get it running more quickly. Of course the US also want to sanction against Nordstream in case it is used as blackmail over Europe which the Russian are pretty much doing anyway...and so it goes round and round...

See https://www.cnbc.com/2021/09/24/europe- ... eapon.html

I gather that the UK also isn't getting as much LNG through tanker supply for various reasons.

[BnM]

Sods law my 3 year deal on gas and electricity ends today. FML. Next cheapest is £35 a month more.

Also isn't everyone's tanks full by now?

[Lobby]

Sods law my 3 year deal on gas and electricity ends today. FML. Next cheapest is £35 a month more.

Also isn't everyone's tanks full by now?

Yes, but some of the idiots are still doing this

[Kawazaki]

Sods law my 3 year deal on gas and electricity ends today. FML. Next cheapest is £35 a month more.

Also isn't everyone's tanks full by now?

Mine does too. We're with Shell Energy. Who are you with and are you going to the variable rate now or signing up for fixed again?

[TB63]

Sods law my 3 year deal on gas and electricity ends today. FML. Next cheapest is £35 a month more.

Also isn't everyone's tanks full by now?

Mine does too. We're with Shell Energy. Who are you with and are you going to the variable rate now or signing up for fixed again?

Was with AVRO who've gone tits up... Been put onto Octopus so waiting to see what they're rates are like..

[BnM]

Sods law my 3 year deal on gas and electricity ends today. FML. Next cheapest is £35 a month more.

Also isn't everyone's tanks full by now?

Mine does too. We're with Shell Energy. Who are you with and are you going to the variable rate now or signing up for fixed again?

Sticking with variable, I'm with Octopus, it's higher but not as high as fixed which is more than 10p a unit more plus extra on the standing nearly 100% increase for elec. What they said on the news tonight was that most fixed tariffs now are more than the price cap so if your likely to hit that then there's no point.