The Official English Rugby Thread

[inactionman]

Not good!!

Crowd behaviour at student rugby games is under fresh scrutiny after worrying scenes at last week’s British Universities and Colleges Sport student finals day at Saracens’ StoneX Stadium.
In addition to scuffles breaking out between rival supporters, the Metropolitan police have confirmed that a 19-year-old man reported being assaulted when a dispute spilled over into the car park later in the evening.

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/202 ... y-fracas

Yep, I noticed that - think it's just too much beer for a bunch of late-teenagers but it needs sorting.

Not a patch on the Army-Navy game though.

[Paddington Bear]

Student rugby club in fighting shocker. Tale as old as time. There are some good eggs around student rugby but for the most part it is the preserve of the utter twat, certainly at my uni fighting was considered a key part of their Wednesday night

[JM2K6]

Borthwick bucking expectations with a left field choice for new scrum coach, surprising me and everyone else ah no just kidding he's hiring yet another Tigers coach because he's a boring fuck who desperately needs his safety blanket (yes I'm grumpy today)

[Margin__Walker]

So unimaginative isn't it.

Had to laugh about the talk post 6N of the S&C guy from Leicester that's suddenly going to come in and fix everything. As if he's completely in a class of his own in the rugby S&C world. No one else will do.

[sockwithaticket]

Tom Collins to Irish confirmed.

[SaintK]

Tom Collins to Irish confirmed.

Good signing, terrific little player.
Not sure whe he didn't sign a contract extension he was evidently offered, maybe he was asked to take a major pay cut?

[Margin__Walker]

Tom Collins to Irish confirmed.

Good signing, terrific little player.
Not sure whe he didn't sign a contract extension he was evidently offered, maybe he was asked to take a major pay cut?

Probably the allure of the big smoke and slight jeopardy about whether you're going to get paid at all each month. Will keep him on his toes.

[inactionman]

Tom Collins to Irish confirmed.

Good signing, terrific little player.
Not sure whe he didn't sign a contract extension he was evidently offered, maybe he was asked to take a major pay cut?

Probably the allure of the big smoke and slight jeopardy about whether you're going to get paid at all each month. Will keep him on his toes.

A complete aside, but I've always wondered how squad players have managed to afford living in London, especially renting. The costs are eye-watering. Do clubs still help with accommodation? Assume that's not allowed under cap.


etA: It's pretty common in football, where a club will generally put a newly signed player up in a hotel suite.

[Margin__Walker]

A complete aside, but I've always wondered how squad players have managed to afford living in London, especially renting. The costs are eye-watering. Do clubs still help with accommodation? Assume that's not allowed under cap.

It's a good question. For senior academy, there's an academy house or two the club seems to own that they filter through. A lot of the fringe squad players will be living in various house shares.

But yeah, straight up help with rent for senior players would almost certainly have to be factored into the cap.

[Paddington Bear]

Good signing, terrific little player.
Not sure whe he didn't sign a contract extension he was evidently offered, maybe he was asked to take a major pay cut?

Probably the allure of the big smoke and slight jeopardy about whether you're going to get paid at all each month. Will keep him on his toes.

A complete aside, but I've always wondered how squad players have managed to afford living in London, especially renting. The costs are eye-watering. Do clubs still help with accommodation? Assume that's not allowed under cap.


etA: It's pretty common in football, where a club will generally put a newly signed player up in a hotel suite.

Middlesex Cricket have flats round North London (though they’ve had to sell a few because of a pensions fuck up). Wouldn’t shock me if something similar happens in rugby

[inactionman]

I was on the same course as a Bath player back in the late 90s, just at end of shamateurism, and it was pretty common for players to get free digs and a sponsored car.

I assume all that now would sit under cap, although I suppose it would be possible for a player to get club-owned accommodation at a relatively peppercorn rent.

What's a squad player on these days? I really don't know but assume it can be around £40-50k for a junior squad player? It's not a trivial sum but it doesn't go far in London.

[Raggs]

I was on the same course as a Bath player back in the late 90s, just at end of shamateurism, and it was pretty common for players to get free digs and a sponsored car.

I assume all that now would sit under cap, although I suppose it would be possible for a player to get club-owned accommodation at a relatively peppercorn rent.

What's a squad player on these days? I really don't know but assume it can be around £40-50k for a junior squad player? It's not a trivial sum but it doesn't go far in London.

Tough to tell, but I'd have thought a bit more than 40-50k, maybe not by much. 60-80k? 35 players in a normal squad? 20 players on 60k would only be 1.2m of the cap.

[Slick]

I was on the same course as a Bath player back in the late 90s, just at end of shamateurism, and it was pretty common for players to get free digs and a sponsored car.

I assume all that now would sit under cap, although I suppose it would be possible for a player to get club-owned accommodation at a relatively peppercorn rent.

What's a squad player on these days? I really don't know but assume it can be around £40-50k for a junior squad player? It's not a trivial sum but it doesn't go far in London.

It's not too bad if you are sharing with 2 or 3 other lads in Zone 3 outwards I would think.

[Paddington Bear]

I was on the same course as a Bath player back in the late 90s, just at end of shamateurism, and it was pretty common for players to get free digs and a sponsored car.

I assume all that now would sit under cap, although I suppose it would be possible for a player to get club-owned accommodation at a relatively peppercorn rent.

What's a squad player on these days? I really don't know but assume it can be around £40-50k for a junior squad player? It's not a trivial sum but it doesn't go far in London.

It's not too bad if you are sharing with 2 or 3 other lads in Zone 3 outwards I would think.

It’s absolutely bog standard mid-20s London professional stuff, very doable if not quite the pro sportsman lifestyle

[inactionman]

I was on the same course as a Bath player back in the late 90s, just at end of shamateurism, and it was pretty common for players to get free digs and a sponsored car.

I assume all that now would sit under cap, although I suppose it would be possible for a player to get club-owned accommodation at a relatively peppercorn rent.

What's a squad player on these days? I really don't know but assume it can be around £40-50k for a junior squad player? It's not a trivial sum but it doesn't go far in London.

It's not too bad if you are sharing with 2 or 3 other lads in Zone 3 outwards I would think.

Yep, I know plenty of young lads in house shares on a lot less than that, but it's not going to go that far for anyone with a family - although I appreciate older players are probably on a bit more.

My main thought was that 50k in Gloucester - or, indeed, Northampton - is very different to 50k in London.

[JM2K6]

Training ground location is way more important than stadium when it comes to sports clubs. Quins training ground is some way out, Irish not quite so far but still Sunbury afaik, so not the absolute worst for rents. Lots of youngsters will be sharing decent places quite affordably, I'm sure.

[Hal Jordan]

These are rugby players and young men we're talking about. This means they will live in Young Ones conditions provided the wifi is good for gaming sessions.

Of course, they'll also have access to a Mayfair flat owned by Uncle Bobby, or their trust fund from Grandpapa to rely on.

<adjusts monocle>

[Margin__Walker]

A lot of the LI lads seem to live out in Sunbury and Halliford near the training ground. The club put a few of these videos out earlier in the year, which died on the vine. Interesting mix in this one. Arundell picking up a decent contract signed last season and his 20k England cheques, who'll no doubt move somewhere better soon. Munga, who's not first choice, but is in and out of the prem team and Smart who's out been out on loan and will realistically be battling for a contract at the end of most seasons.

[Happyhooker]

I know ealing own a few houses that junior squad players share for not really market rent.

I can only presume LI do the same, but rent isn't that steep near their training ground (comparatively)

[FalseBayFC]

Fucking legend!

[Margin__Walker]

I know ealing own a few houses that junior squad players share for not really market rent.

I can only presume LI do the same, but rent isn't that steep near their training ground (comparatively)

They definitely do for senior academy lads. Not sure outside of that though.

[Ovals]

Cracking game between England and Italy U19s. England converted a try with the clock in the red to win 28/26 after getting outpowered up front, especially in the last 1/4.

[Margin__Walker]

Yeah, they got the job done, but a pretty sketchy win really. Second best up front and got a bit lucky with a harsh red card for the Italian wing.

[Ovals]

Yeah, they got the job done, but a pretty sketchy win really. Second best up front and got a bit lucky with a harsh red card for the Italian wing.

Yeah - it was far from convincing. Unlikely to have won without the RC. Still, did very well to make that last play count. Being outmuscled in the scrums and the mauls made life very difficult but it's a good learning experience for them to have to rely on skills rather than just power.

[SaintK]

So Nick Cain in The Rugby Paper today reporting that the RFU announced a further £50m annual loss to the Council last week.
Why the fuck hasn't Sweeney and the CFO resigned
Guess which part of the game will suffer most from this mismanagement?

[Hal Jordan]

I'm sure CVC will be very understanding in the rent they'll be charging their tenants in the not too distant future.

[Ovals]

So Nick Cain in The Rugby Paper today reporting that the RFU announced a further £50m annual loss to the Council last week.
Why the fuck hasn't Sweeney and the CFO resigned
Guess which part of the game will suffer most from this mismanagement?

I could understand the coffers being hit hard during Covid but how the fuck do you lose £50M with a turnover of around £200M ??

[inactionman]

I also missed this from a few weeks back -Anthony Watson still begrudging over his Bath exit.

https://www.rugbypass.com/news/anthony- ... club-bath/

There were all sorts of rumours about unrealistic demands etc, and to be honest I think the club have a reasonable expectation that a player would play when available, but whatever's occurred it's troubling to have ex-players feeling they've been so poorly treated.

Also some comments from Henry Thomas in a similar vein (although only caught these second-hand, think they're behind paywall somewhere), he's doing well in France and really should have been on England's radar but had a few nasty injuries. It seems he's stated that he wasn't paid by Bath for his final year - I know Bath have ben a bit shambolic but I really, really struggle to believe that's true. Has anyone with access behind e.g. times paywall seen anything about this?

I quote myself as one of subjects of my post, Henry Thomas, is now in the wider Wales WC squad.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/65441832

eta: just noticed it's been discussed on the Wales thread. Ignore.

[fishfoodie]

Uh Oh, this doesn't sound good.

London Irish at risk of financial meltdown

Gallagher Premiership club failed to pay their players and staff last month

London Irish are at risk of following Worcester Warriors and Wasps into financial meltdown after players and staff failed to receive their salaries for the month of April.

The American consortium involved in takeover talks with the Gallagher Premiership club informed all employees in a meeting on Friday that their money would not be paid on time.

A follow-up email was sent on Sunday with assurances that confirmation of payment would be received by Monday evening in the UK, once the banks in the United States had opened for business.

But it was an empty promise. The Times understands that no payments were made overnight, raising an all-too familiar red flag for stressed employees.

https://archive.is/fyYbp

[Happyhooker]

I can only apologise. After Wasps folded i started to go to quite a few London Irish games. I'm obviously a Jonah.

The only upside is that JMK has offered to buy me a Saracens season ticket for next year.

[inactionman]

I can only apologise. After Wasps folded i started to go to quite a few London Irish games. I'm obviously a Jonah.

The only upside is that JMK has offered to buy me a Saracens season ticket for next year.

Good man, taking one for the team

But, obviously, not good about LI.

[inactionman]

Lee Blackett appointed at Bath - presumably to fill back and attack coach role recently vacated by Mad Dog Joe Maddock.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/65456597

Not entirely sure what led to Maddock's sudden departure, and the statement from the club was notably perfunctory, so this may explain a bit - that Maddock was being pushed outwards or downwards by the appointment of Blackett.

[SaintK]

Lee Blackett appointed at Bath - presumably to fill back and attack coach role recently vacated by Mad Dog Joe Maddock.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/65456597

Not entirely sure what led to Maddock's sudden departure, and the statement from the club was notably perfunctory, so this may explain a bit - that Maddock was being pushed outwards or downwards by the appointment of Blackett.

I reckon that's a pretty shrewd appointmentr. Blackett is a good coach.

[inactionman]

Lee Blackett appointed at Bath - presumably to fill back and attack coach role recently vacated by Mad Dog Joe Maddock.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/65456597

Not entirely sure what led to Maddock's sudden departure, and the statement from the club was notably perfunctory, so this may explain a bit - that Maddock was being pushed outwards or downwards by the appointment of Blackett.

I reckon that's a pretty shrewd appointmentr. Blackett is a good coach.

Maddock was a very decent player and well-liked, but not sure the backs quite got going - although he's not had the benefit of a settled team or of Finn Russell.

Sorry to see him go, but Blackett is indeed a welcome addition.

[Kawazaki]

The only upside is that JMK has offered to buy me a Saracens season ticket for next year.

You need to read the sacred Saracens book of plausible deniability and pledge allegiance to uphold the tenets of the club - honesty, integrity and sincerity - before you are allowed to buy a season ticket.

[inactionman]

The only upside is that JMK has offered to buy me a Saracens season ticket for next year.

You need to read the sacred Saracens book of plausible deniability and pledge allegiance to uphold the tenets of the club - honesty, integrity and sincerity - before you are allowed to buy a season ticket.

That does sound exactly like something they would do.

[JM2K6]

Hey that was actually funny, don't ruin it by explaining the joke

[Margin__Walker]

Don't worry HH, it's all going to be fine. Never simple with LI, as we do love a bit of drama. This will all blow over.

[inactionman]

For those with any residual interest, Bath's plans for the Rec Development to be showcased after the Sarries home game on Saturday to season ticket holders then for the general public on the 10th.

I have totally lost track of what is going on, what has been proposed, what has been objected to, what has been counter-proposed, what has actually been approved and generally which way is up. Hard to keep much faith given the era of false dawns.

Plan is for capacity of 18k (currently around 14.5k) and the underground carpark idea has been dropped - probably a good idea given no-one wants their shiny Range Rover to get flooded (I think it was actually binned due to traffic concerns).

I know you're all on edge of seats so I'll post some photos once they're revealed on the club site. Unless the proposal is crap, then I won't bother.

[Happyhooker]

Don't worry HH, it's all going to be fine. Never simple with LI, as we do love a bit of drama. This will all blow over.

Hopefully. The mere thought made me feel like i needed to scrub myself with lye.