Tennis Fans, Lend Me Your Brains!

[Niegs]

I have to do a report and presentation on the ITF as an organization and am poring over all the documents, moving on to secondary sources.

But from anyone who's a fan of the sport, I'd love to hear what you think are some of the hot-button issues over the last few years?

(Comedy answers welcome too if it keeps this thread up a couple of days. )

[Grandpa]

Novak used to do comedic impressions of other tennis players... but stopped once he won a grand slam. Why?

[eldanielfire]

Why are there big tournamnets in oppressive regimes.
Why are there no big indoor tournaments for the women's tour anymore?
Why aren't grand slam prize money more equally shared out so the poorer players outside the top 50 earn more, given in tennis they have so many costs to keep touring?

[inactionman]

Why are there big tournamnets in oppressive regimes.
Why are there no big indoor tournaments for the women's tour anymore?
Why aren't grand slam prize money more equally shared out so the poorer players outside the top 50 earn more, given in tennis they have so many costs to keep touring?

Worth emphasising. There was a big push to equalize men's and women's prize money, despite the fact that grand slams are only 4 tournaments which are co-located on tours which are otherwise separate with separate qualifying routes, they should have focused more on ensuring adequate funding for the lower ranked. They seemed to miss that bit, perhaps as it didn't impact the likes of Serena or Novak.

Issues around 'the 5th slam' Indian Wells and abuse of players.

[eldanielfire]

Why are there big tournamnets in oppressive regimes.
Why are there no big indoor tournaments for the women's tour anymore?
Why aren't grand slam prize money more equally shared out so the poorer players outside the top 50 earn more, given in tennis they have so many costs to keep touring?

Worth emphasising. There was a big push to equalize men's and women's prize money, despite the fact that grand slams are only 4 tournaments which are co-located on tours which are otherwise separate with separate qualifying routes, they should have focused more on ensuring adequate funding for the lower ranked. They seemed to miss that bit, perhaps as it didn't impact the likes of Serena or Novak.

Issues around 'the 5th slam' Indian Wells and abuse of players.

I remember reading how it costs over 100 grad a year to tour, flights, coaches, court hire, accomodation, nutrition etc are all on the player unless a tournament director is generous. The taxes in multtple countries. Outside the top 100 you are from a rich background, have a big unions support or well sponsored. The latter obviously is usually only significant for top players.

[inactionman]

Why are there big tournamnets in oppressive regimes.
Why are there no big indoor tournaments for the women's tour anymore?
Why aren't grand slam prize money more equally shared out so the poorer players outside the top 50 earn more, given in tennis they have so many costs to keep touring?

Worth emphasising. There was a big push to equalize men's and women's prize money, despite the fact that grand slams are only 4 tournaments which are co-located on tours which are otherwise separate with separate qualifying routes, they should have focused more on ensuring adequate funding for the lower ranked. They seemed to miss that bit, perhaps as it didn't impact the likes of Serena or Novak.

Issues around 'the 5th slam' Indian Wells and abuse of players.

I remember reading how it costs over 100 grad a year to tour, flights, coaches, court hire, accomodation, nutrition etc are all on the player unless a tournament director is generous. The taxes in multtple countries. Outside the top 100 you are from a rich background, have a big unions support or well sponsored. The latter obviously is usually only significant for top players.

It seems to be anti-competitive, Federer gets private jets, luxury home rentals for tournaments, massages, chauffeurs, a lower ranked player is going cattle class and cadging lifts to the stadium.

It's not like Federer needs a hand.

eta: also worth adding that lower ranked players are at the mercy of their home associations for funding and development, Murray had to essentially go outside of the LTA and Judy is pretty scathing of it all.

[Niegs]

Cheers for this so far!

Again, not a fan here ... and I've just learned that the ITF (my focus) doesn't have total control like World Rugby has? So is the above about the org that runs the tour and not the ITF? (Will keep reading... even if not, I've already noted in my SWOT that they don't have total control like some orgs do.)

[Thor Sedan]

Why is the French Open classed as one of the slam events - it is a rubbish surface favoured by exactly one person in the last 15 years.

[Kawazaki]

Equal pay for women who only play best of 3 sets in the Majors. Lack of depth in the women's game as well.

[petej]

Why is the French Open classed as one of the slam events - it is a rubbish surface favoured by exactly one person in the last 15 years.

Clay is a great surface to play on.

[Grandpa]

Why does the US Open have lighter balls for women than in other Slam events?

[eldanielfire]

Cheers for this so far!

Again, not a fan here ... and I've just learned that the ITF (my focus) doesn't have total control like World Rugby has? So is the above about the org that runs the tour and not the ITF? (Will keep reading... even if not, I've already noted in my SWOT that they don't have total control like some orgs do.)

It's split. The ATP run the elite men's tounaments. The WTA the women's. The ITF run the rest. But while the Grand Slam events are nominally ITF, they are their own entities and run themselves. They also don't even have to agree with each other, though they tend to work together somewhat. But they also agree to use the ATP and WTA to use their rankings systems (and both award ranking points slightly differently) for awarding ranking points and for entry to the Slams, as does the ITF tour.

[eldanielfire]

Why does the US Open have lighter balls for women than in other Slam events?

They all have their own balls. I guess whomeever sponsor the events provides the balls. The WTA tour use lighter balls anyway.

[eldanielfire]

Worth emphasising. There was a big push to equalize men's and women's prize money, despite the fact that grand slams are only 4 tournaments which are co-located on tours which are otherwise separate with separate qualifying routes, they should have focused more on ensuring adequate funding for the lower ranked. They seemed to miss that bit, perhaps as it didn't impact the likes of Serena or Novak.

Issues around 'the 5th slam' Indian Wells and abuse of players.

I remember reading how it costs over 100 grad a year to tour, flights, coaches, court hire, accomodation, nutrition etc are all on the player unless a tournament director is generous. The taxes in multtple countries. Outside the top 100 you are from a rich background, have a big unions support or well sponsored. The latter obviously is usually only significant for top players.

It seems to be anti-competitive, Federer gets private jets, luxury home rentals for tournaments, massages, chauffeurs, a lower ranked player is going cattle class and cadging lifts to the stadium.

It's not like Federer needs a hand.

eta: also worth adding that lower ranked players are at the mercy of their home associations for funding and development, Murray had to essentially go outside of the LTA and Judy is pretty scathing of it all.

Murray went outside the LTA because it was shit and he believed their coaching actually ruined his older brothers forehand stroke. He saw what was happening to the lieks of Nadal with superior coaching and went, I think with the LTA partly funding it. The LTA then shat bricks and threw hundreds of thousands at Murray's development. He's probably the junior whose have the most investment in in the history of tennis.

[Grandpa]

Why does the US Open have lighter balls for women than in other Slam events?

They all have their own balls. I guess whomeever sponsor the events provides the balls. The WTA tour use lighter balls anyway.

A few people suggesting the lighter balls suited Emma... and she is struggling now with the normal heavier balls.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/tennis/2022 ... ls-claims/

[Niegs]

The more I read on this, it seems that the RFU allowing the clubs individual power wasn't the worst sports decision. At least World Rugby has major control over what comes under its wings. ITF seems to have lost that to ATP and WTA, with upstarts coming every now and then to clog / challenge the schedule?

[Calculon]

Why does the US Open have lighter balls for women than in other Slam events?

They all have their own balls. I guess whomeever sponsor the events provides the balls. The WTA tour use lighter balls anyway.

A few people suggesting the lighter balls suited Emma... and she is struggling now with the normal heavier balls.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/tennis/2022 ... ls-claims/

“The US Open really needs to change the ball for the girls,” said Tyzzer. “If they keep that ball the same, no one like Ash will win that tournament. And I don't know the reason why. It's the only tournament that has a separate ball for the guys and girls. So if they don't change the balls, she won't win the US Open.”

What's the reason that the US open has different balls for the men and women?

[Grandpa]

They all have their own balls. I guess whomeever sponsor the events provides the balls. The WTA tour use lighter balls anyway.

A few people suggesting the lighter balls suited Emma... and she is struggling now with the normal heavier balls.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/tennis/2022 ... ls-claims/

“The US Open really needs to change the ball for the girls,” said Tyzzer. “If they keep that ball the same, no one like Ash will win that tournament. And I don't know the reason why. It's the only tournament that has a separate ball for the guys and girls. So if they don't change the balls, she won't win the US Open.”

What's the reason that the US open has different balls for the men and women?

Google isn't too helpful. This is the best reason I could find..

Mr. Brewer, who has worked in tennis for three decades, couldn’t explain why women use different balls at the Open but said it has been that way as long as he can remember.

The men apparently don’t care. “The subject of a different ball being used by the women in the same tournament historically has not been raised as an issue or concern,” a spokesman for the Association of Tennis Professionals, the governing body of men’s tennis, said.

It’s the Women’s Tennis Association that’s the driving force.

WTA rules stipulate that regular-duty balls are to be used at all of its tournaments unless otherwise approved. The rule was adopted in the early 1980s at the request of the players, according to a WTA spokeswoman, because extra-duty balls were difficult on their arms, shoulders and elbows.

Since then, the women and men have played with different balls—at least in the U.S.

“It’s an American phenomenon,” Mr. Collins said.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/at-u-s-ope ... 1565957964

[Hugo]

One of the things I'm intrigued about is why did the USA & Australia essentially cease producing male Grand Slam winners at the start of the 21st century?

I'm sure some of it has to do with the world catching up but it can't be entirely attributable to that. Both nations have rich tennis histories and host a Grand Slam so for two weeks in the year tennis is at least in the national consciousness.

[Grandpa]

One of the things I'm intrigued about is why did the USA & Australia essentially cease producing male Grand Slam winners at the start of the 21st century?

I'm sure some of it has to do with the world catching up but it can't be entirely attributable to that. Both nations have rich tennis histories and host a Grand Slam so for two weeks in the year tennis is at least in the national consciousness.

Did André Agassi and Steffi Graf have any boys?

Edit. Yes... And he is in his 20s... so no hope there..

[eldanielfire]

One of the things I'm intrigued about is why did the USA & Australia essentially cease producing male Grand Slam winners at the start of the 21st century?

I'm sure some of it has to do with the world catching up but it can't be entirely attributable to that. Both nations have rich tennis histories and host a Grand Slam so for two weeks in the year tennis is at least in the national consciousness.

Style. After Aggessi then US seemed to invest in tall, big servers, at a time when the tour suddenly gained players from Europe who focus on fitness, shot and being able to hold a rally for ages.

Also the tours slowed down their courts due to the racquet technology making the game so fast. The catalyst was the 1996 Wimbledon final where two massive servebots Sampras and Krajicek freeked them out that the tech woudl eliminate skill players. But it took a few years and a few stages. Wimbledon invested in new slower grass types, other courts were relaid with slower surfaces.

This also had another unintended outcome, the court speeds were harmonised more, which is why we see players able to suceed on clay as well as the others much more than in the past.

[Hugo]

One of the things I'm intrigued about is why did the USA & Australia essentially cease producing male Grand Slam winners at the start of the 21st century?

I'm sure some of it has to do with the world catching up but it can't be entirely attributable to that. Both nations have rich tennis histories and host a Grand Slam so for two weeks in the year tennis is at least in the national consciousness.

Did André Agassi and Steffi Graf have any boys?

Edit. Yes... And he is in his 20s... so no hope there..

On that note: Germany's is another drought that seems inexplicable. Apparently Boris Becker was their last male open winner - in 1996.

Since then Russia (3 players), Spain (4) & Switzerland (2) have produced multiple Open winners.

I would lazily assume that given its population size & economy that Germany would crank out at least one tennis superstar a generation just like their football team make semi finals, rain or shine. Clearly the formula for tennis success is not large population + wealth.

On Agassi - in his book he talks about how he didn't even like trnnis, his Dad forced him and his siblings to play it. Based on his personality I can imagine that he would have encouraged his kids to go into different avenues.

[Hugo]

One of the things I'm intrigued about is why did the USA & Australia essentially cease producing male Grand Slam winners at the start of the 21st century?

I'm sure some of it has to do with the world catching up but it can't be entirely attributable to that. Both nations have rich tennis histories and host a Grand Slam so for two weeks in the year tennis is at least in the national consciousness.

Style. After Aggessi then US seemed to invest in tall, big servers, at a time when the tour suddenly gained players from Europe who focus on fitness, shot and being able to hold a rally for ages.

Also the tours slowed down their courts due to the racquet technology making the game so fast. The catalyst was the 1996 Wimbledon final where two massive servebots Sampras and Krajicek freeked them out that the tech woudl eliminate skill players. But it took a few years and a few stages. Wimbledon invested in new slower grass types, other courts were relaid with slower surfaces.

This also had another unintended outcome, the court speeds were harmonised more, which is why we see players able to suceed on clay as well as the others much more than in the past.

Thanks, so the Americans were going down the road of relying on superior athleticism and the powers that be moved the goalposts to a more skill and stamina based game?

[eldanielfire]

One of the things I'm intrigued about is why did the USA & Australia essentially cease producing male Grand Slam winners at the start of the 21st century?

I'm sure some of it has to do with the world catching up but it can't be entirely attributable to that. Both nations have rich tennis histories and host a Grand Slam so for two weeks in the year tennis is at least in the national consciousness.

Style. After Aggessi then US seemed to invest in tall, big servers, at a time when the tour suddenly gained players from Europe who focus on fitness, shot and being able to hold a rally for ages.

Also the tours slowed down their courts due to the racquet technology making the game so fast. The catalyst was the 1996 Wimbledon final where two massive servebots Sampras and Krajicek freeked them out that the tech woudl eliminate skill players. But it took a few years and a few stages. Wimbledon invested in new slower grass types, other courts were relaid with slower surfaces.

This also had another unintended outcome, the court speeds were harmonised more, which is why we see players able to suceed on clay as well as the others much more than in the past.

Thanks, so the Americans were going down the road of relying on superior athleticism and the powers that be moved the goalposts to a more skill and stamina based game?

Yup.

[Grandpa]

One of the things I'm intrigued about is why did the USA & Australia essentially cease producing male Grand Slam winners at the start of the 21st century?

I'm sure some of it has to do with the world catching up but it can't be entirely attributable to that. Both nations have rich tennis histories and host a Grand Slam so for two weeks in the year tennis is at least in the national consciousness.

Did André Agassi and Steffi Graf have any boys?

Edit. Yes... And he is in his 20s... so no hope there..

On that note: Germany's is another drought that seems inexplicable. Apparently Boris Becker was their last male open winner - in 1996.

Since then Russia (3 players), Spain (4) & Switzerland (2) have produced multiple Open winners.

I would lazily assume that given its population size & economy that Germany would crank out at least one tennis superstar a generation just like their football team make semi finals, rain or shine. Clearly the formula for tennis success is not large population + wealth.

On Agassi - in his book he talks about how he didn't even like trnnis, his Dad forced him and his siblings to play it. Based on his personality I can imagine that he would have encouraged his kids to go into different avenues.

Zverev might be next for Germany...